Government to hand out free plug-in batteries

Are you saying you’re clueless?

For more than twenty years the cry has been ”Follow the science!”. Anyone with sense follows the money.

Cui bono.

You're both right. One of the world's great problems is that the science follows the money.

Err, not really. It all depends on the quality of the battery to start with and how often it has to start the engine.

I assumed we were talking about rational reasons, not 'emotional' ones

It entirely depends on where you are trying to get.

They have a higher capacity. If you can disable stop-start (Nissan Notes allow this) and you don't use it every day, and drive at least 10 miles when you do use it, then the battery could last (possibly) up to 10 years.

My previous car was stop/start, it benefits company car drivers by having lower BiK, but made no difference to me, other than there was a recall on the starter/alternator/belt/idler.

Yes it was a higher capacity battery than the non-stop/start model, and that confused all the websites which find what battery you require from the car registration.

Mine needed replacing at just over 7 years old.

Oh, quite. Very rational.

Your problem is you aren't me. And you can't imagine my situation. Which may not match yours. Hence your permanent irritation with a lot of life, it seems ;)

I'm probably the same in reverse, by the way. It's the tax we pay for being human.

Science or engineering ?

Anyway, a bit of solar + battery + (microinverter) is certainly *a* solution that would be of interest to me. But there is no use trying to explain as despite repeated postings, you continue to be unable to imagine reasons for this.

At least I know when I am making emotional decisions. And don't try to justify them rationally. And call it 'emotional intelligence'. Yuk!

I shouldn't need to imagine your situation. You could tell me.

Its not up to me to dream up improbable reasons why bird mincers and rooftop dazzlers would be an ideal choice.

If you want to contend a rational argument with rational reason, say so. Or bugger off. Hand waving 'there are reasons that you cant imagine because you are dumb' is simply exiting the game in a stupid huff.

The world is at some level objective fact. And at any given level it is possible to say that there is a optimal approach to achieve a given result.

What there isn't., is a sub optimal approach that doesn't achieve the given result, even if thousands of people believe it does.

The great danger of average intelligence and average intelligence is it leads to people who think they are smarter than they are, and then the old adage applies:

Bullshit baffles brains.

But would it be cheaper than the true cost of nuclear electricity, say

The reason we have a grid at all is because the answer is 'no' Its the same for food: we have farmers for that. We don't need to cultivate out back gardens

The abject failure of successive governments following EU doctrine is to ensure that electricity is so expansive and unreliable that your solution appears 'rational'

But there is no use trying to

But the reasons are not rational. That#s all we are saying

And end up costing *other* people money. largely

One of the most potent reasons for undertaking the solar+battery+inverter route seems to be a warm feeling arising from ’doing something’ and the prospect, founded on the hope of continuing high electricity prices, of payback at an indeterminate point in the future. Exactly what this is a solution to seems to be something of a variable feast that appears to be rather hard to explain rationally.

I've just bought one of these ;)

Well at least you are not pretending it was a rational decision

You are still missing another cogent reason.

Nope…I’m missing the ongoing farce in its entirety.

Still not getting it . . .

Currently: One 800 VA inverter power, max. 2kW panel nominal power, registered in a registry, using a random nearby household socket and its household wiring. Ferraris meters may run backwards, but the supplier must be notified and they will replace the meter with one that won't run backwards, usually electronic, and often but not always replaced within months.

Higher power allowed, but subject to special wiring.

Several also not verboten, but subject to regulations to avoid multiple inverters per circuit.

Supplier will be automatically notified from the registry. One must deal with the supplier and their rules if: you wish to be paid for the excess power, the system exceeds the "simple plug-in" specs, or a battery is involved.

That said, there are legal "simple plug-in" battery storage inverter systems that charge by solar panel, pass through power to the grid, store energy, and provide power at an outlet -- but that power is not routed into a household circuit, or the grid. This is basically a solar-charged UPS system, AFAIK with the option to feed off the grid. These are legal.

There is change in the law currently making its way through the legal process that will change the status of storage systems.

Of course it allowable to cover the roof in solar panels, run inverters, and store, only that's outside of the scope of buying a 250€ set of two panels, attachment hardware, and inverter, and DIY: hanging it from the south balcony, and plugging in the system, done.

Thomas Prufer