Glyphosate kill delay

Does anyone know how long glyphosate takes to kill various weeds? E.g. elderberry bushes, dockins, brambles, bracken, grass?
Don't want to waste money by spraying again if it's premature to do so.
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I put some on brambles this summer which I though hadn't worked - but 6 weeks later they keeled over, were cut down and have not re-appeared.
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I'll wait a bit longer, then. The retail price of tiny sachets of already-quite-dilute glyphosate is outrageous.
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On 12/08/2013 10:52, Windmill wrote:

In this weather you should see some yellowing of the growing points within two weeks of application and a complete kill after a month. It is a slow acting translocating weedkiller that does roots as well as top growth. If you see an immediate effect you used it too strong!

If it is wilderness that you are reclaiming the best value for money is leave it all until tinder dry. Make a firebreak around the edges and then flash burn it to see off most of the weed seeds. The black scorched earth makes it much easier to spot weed any green shoots.
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The back garden has become a fair imitation of wilderness, but the last time I even had a small safe fire, away from anything flammable, some busybody called the fire brigade.
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Docks and grass about a fortnight if the weather is dry, brambles about a month, elder bushes a couple of months depending on size. Bracken around six weeks to two months it seems ver resistant to glyphosate and needs several treatments possibly at monthly intervals. Also I would bump up the concentration by 25-30% for elder and bracken. ie Instead of 120-150 ml of 360g/l concentrate per five litres use 150-200 ml.
If you're buying it pre-diluted it could take ages and may not work - they dilute it to a ridiculous extent.
If the elder is large and has a significant trunk use the techniques described here previously of hashing the bark to get the glyphosate past the waterproof bark or drill holes into the trunk and top up with concentrated glyphosate.
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Bracken is another plant like nettles, buttercup, etc, that has natural defences against sprays - deep resilient roots, IIRC interconnecting, moderately waxy leaf surface, etc. The preferred spray against bracken used to be Asulox, which does work, if rather slowly over several seasons, but things may have moved on since then.
Certainly with bracken you need to hit it hard and above all consistently, it's no good expecting one spray to do the trick. You have to remember too that it dies back completely every year, so there's probably not much point in spraying it too late in the season. AFAICR, I used to spray twice with Asulox, once quite early in the season when the new shoots were 15-30cm above ground, again some time later, probably about mid-summer, but I can't now remember the precise recommendations for best results.
And you need to keep doing it every year, because it can take several years to exhaust the plants' systems and achieve complete kill.
When young and fit, I used to pull it out as well, but it's a hard pull, and I'd probably struggle to do it now. And again, you have to keep at it consistently, it's no good just having a go when you feel like it.
On Tue, 13 Aug 2013 09:13:30 +0000 (UTC), Steve Firth

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Fascinating.
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The bracken looks slightly discouraged, but not much more than that. Suppose I'll have to spray again. The elderberry is new growth and seems now to be dying.

Indeed. But having sprayed myself accidentally I'm now a little concerned about its alleged harmlessness so slightly reassured that the solution was weak.

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On Monday, 12 August 2013 11:52:46 UTC+2, Windmill wrote:

Seems to vary enormously. About 10 years ago, I would use Roundup against b road leaf weeds on a hot day and see them visibly start to wilt within 2hrs at most and they'd be flat out dead in a couple of days. Try using today's Roundup formulation, however, and you'll be lucky to achieve any knockdown at all. I have give up with Roundup and Weedol. I buy some cheap stuff from Wilko i n sachets that is supposed to be watered down, but I apply it neat. Still t akes about 2 weeks to kill the weeds off, though.
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On 13/08/2013 10:25, snipped-for-privacy@virgin.net wrote:

Monsanto a couple of years back were selling something they called "fast" Roundup that was more than just glyphosate. It made home users aware that something was going on within a couple of days.
The way that glyphosate works by inhibiting certain chemical pathways means that it takes a week or more before the photosynthetic byproducts build up to levels that are toxic to the plant. The growing point is usually affected first - nettles turn a nice shade of yellow as it takes effect and grass a characteristic bronze as it expires.

Sounds like a major failure to RTFM is causing to your problems.
Any generic glyphosate product will do the job apart from on a handful of Roundup Ready(TM) volunteer weeds, waxy holly and ivy and curiously buttercup which is surprisingly resistant to the stuff.
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On Tuesday, 13 August 2013 11:34:16 UTC+2, Martin Brown wrote:
[...]
No way. The formulation has definitely changed for the worse. Perhaps it only works effectively on Monsanto's genetically-engineered weeds. ;)
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On Tue, 13 Aug 2013 03:24:07 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@virgin.net wrote:

The branded stuff aka Roundup, Weedol just has less of the active ingredient (glyphostae) that the generics, they may have some surficants to aid penetration though.
I'd just get the highest concentration I could, dilute if required and bruise the target plant a bit. It does take a while to act, some plants are quicker than others and some tough buggers can take more than one application. Just be patient, it does not produce an instant knockdown. Indeed by the way it works you don't want an instant knockdown.
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I wonder if a little squirt of dish detergent migh be helpful?

It's not so easy to decide which brand has the highest concentration. Seems to have been made a little obscure, perhaps on purpose.
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On Sun, 18 Aug 2013 02:18:42 GMT, Windmill wrote:

It ought to be in the small print of ingredients as g/l.
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On Mon, 19 Aug 2013 01:30:26 GMT, Windmill wrote:

No different to grocery shopping. Never assume an "offer" is the best value, around 50% of the time it is not.
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snipped-for-privacy@virgin.net writes:

Read somewhere that Roundup-resistant weeds are now a problem. And that the patent expired fairly recently. And that there is now something newer than glyphosate which does work on the resistant weeds. Suspicious persons no doubt wonder if the Roundup-resistant weeds were specially bred or modified!
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On Sun, 18 Aug 2013 02:01:41 GMT, Windmill wrote:

If they were, we'd(!) be sued for having them in our gardens. Big corporations, in league with judges that like money, are good at punishing victims, as we've already seen.
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On 12/08/13 10:52, Windmill wrote:

wait two weeks really for a tough plant.
elder and brambles are the worst. grass and docks a few days should see em yellow
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On Mon, 12 Aug 2013 09:52:46 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@Freeola.net.invalid (Windmill) wrote:

Woody stuff like brambles takes weeks, but when the sap draws back into the rootball at the end of the season it kills the bugger off quick-smart.
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