Electricity Monitors - Is there really a need for them?

On Fri, 22 Oct 2010 21:37:30 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Even better if you can avoid hard disks....one of them runs off a CF card (read only).
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Bob Eager wrote:

cant avoid that. Need lots of read writes. CF dont last very long with a lot of writes.

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On 22/10/10 23:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Not always the problem it seems. Decent flash will cope with a lot of write cycles (over 100,000 IIRC) - it depends whether your writes are spread around or concentrated into a few areas - and whether the unit has any decent wear levelling circuit.
To put it in context, a decent flash (eg Transcend) assuming a few GB size upwards written over an over from start to finish, continuosly will last (MTBF estimate) some decades.
Putting a swap file on a cheap unit however will not.
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Tim Watts wrote:

well if you can tell me where to get 500GB flash for less than 30 quid that will take constant random writes and reads fr 5 years I'll buy some.
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On Fri, 22 Oct 2010 23:06:11 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

I know they don't. Hence the read only bit I mentioned.
NFS mount a file on one of the other machines...
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Bob Eager wrote:

This is the NFS file server, begorrah! At least with OS-X I don't need ***ing appletalk on it as well. Just samba
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Dave Liquorice wrote:

the scanners take forever to warm up,Pcs well this one about 30 secs, BUT its backup runs over night. The wife's G5..a minute or so.

interesting.
I can thoroughly recommend this: I have an Atom 510MO board..in the smallest case that would take two disk drives. Its faster than the PIII it replaced..64 bit and a gig of ram, and gigabit ethernet.
more than good enough for its purpose.
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wrote:

I worked for a large (300+ employees) organisation in the past. One of the directors wanted to "go green" and demanded all desktops got switched off at night.
Within a week, we were experiencing 15+ minutes bootups, as *all* the machines decided they needed to do a Windows update at the same time. OK, some profile management could have cured that. However we started seeing a spike in machine failures, as - guess what - the shock of on- off-on cycling started to hit PSUs and in some cases HDDs.
Whatever we "saved" in electricity, we pissed away in maintenance costs ... to say nothing of how much carbon it took to manufacture the new components.
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On 23/10/2010 02:30, Jethro wrote:

Interesting. My employer is rather larger than yours, and encourages computers to be switched off at night. However we may buy more reliable machines, since we don't see the problems you suggest with failures.
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Bwahahahahahahahahahahahah. For "large", read "small".
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Clive George wrote:

machis are a bit better these days.
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On 23/10/2010 03:41, Clive George wrote:

OK, I'm out of date, but when I worked at ICL some years ago the numbers we got suggested leave on overnight, turn off at weekends for best reliability.
The power management facilities of modern machines (especially spin down discs when idle) must surely affect this conclusion.
Andy
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That's rubbish
the on-off cycling is going to cause failures in the three-four year time scale (if that). You are not going to see a spike in failures because of a two week experiment!
tim
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tim.... wrote:

Speaking from experience (though several years ago when hard disks were much smaller, slower and tended to have different problems to today such as stiction and generally tending to make odd noises when they were about to fail) ...
Machines that had got used to being on 24x7 with only very brief downtime, had a tendency to fail when turned off, even just for a few hours to re-organise the server room - still makes me quite nervous and keen to have known good backups before moving servers.
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On 23 Oct,

You may if they have already been running (on a wing and a prayer) for years.
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Jethro wrote:

Oh yes. been there done that.
WE also go occasional main supply fuses blowing as the switch on surges....
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Actually, I suspect it's not to be told to eat less cakes or whatever, I suspect it's more about the feeling of support from doing something you find a bit difficult with other people doing the same.
In the context of electricity monitors, some people may find them useful in seeing what they use and then reducing their consumption in response.
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Chris French


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On 21/10/2010 20:59, ARWadsworth wrote:

I get a bill from the electricty company every few months that tells me that.
Colin Bignell
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wrote:

No, utterly pointless. They have probably cost more energy globally in their design, component material manufacture & distribution, actual product manufacture, product distribution, product retail, product usage etc than they ever saved.
Individual appliance energy meters are useful however to check "your freezer thermostat is working" and "your new appliance is actually drawing 390W when it said 320W in the instructions" (such as a dessicant dehumidifier which seem to always understate perhaps in lieu of compressor drawing substantially less albeit with less heating benefit). Once you have used such meters, you might as well sell them back on fleabay to actually *be* "green" and thus recycle them so preventing another one being pulled down the supply chain, it then effectively only costs you 1-2 to hire the thing rather than the 10-14 they cost.
DIN rail meters are easily bought (german ones on Ebay are about a tenner?) and useful for sheds, garages, home business subject to IR acceptance, Koi fish production facility (!), garage freezers re stuck thermostat and so on.
I would rather they did a mailshot of "99p plug-in RCD" which might actually save some lives or "we collect your electric blanket for free, PAT test it and replace it for free if defective if over 65 or for 5 if under 65".
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for folks that don't know, electric blankets are the biggset killer electrical appliance
NT
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