Electical Storage Heaters

Any firm that can say "Electric heating is clean and 100% efficient and has a zero carbon footprint at the point of use in your home. Electrification of heating should be considered as a high priority given it has a significant impact on total emissions" makes me want to run in the opposite direction.

Yes, it is probably true that the latest storage heaters are cheaper to run than older ones (in that less heat is released at times when you don't want heat) but storage heating will always be expensive to run.

Yes. They are complete crap from the days of white heat of technology with nuclear electricity "too cheap to meter". I remember the scenario only too well my parents had them installed (they now have gas CH).

They were far too hot by night and stone cold by 4pm. Utterly useless!

No but they will likely also be rubbish. The only way to store serious amounts of energy in a relatively small volume is by phase change and almost all of the formulations have their potentially nasty features - notably a change of volume leading to eventual leakage and/or corrosion.

Your choice is really between solid fuel (messy but cheapish), oil or bottled gas all of which are expensive. Air or ground source heat pumps only if you have money to burn and don't mind it failing in cold weather (but then new fangled condensing boilers seem to do that too).

All electric heating is 100% efficient. The problem is the cost of electricity compared with other fuels.

How good storage heaters are revolves around contolling the heat output, nobody has come up with a really good method though things are much better than they once were. Can't say how the ones you link to compare with what you've got.

The reason they were installed were they are cheap compared with a gas CH system. (ie Low capital cost0 But high running cost.

Your other options are oil CH, Propane gas (tank) CH or heat pump. (Air or ground source.) There is a subsidy for this latter (Renewable Heat Incentive).

You might also look at reducing your heat losses (more insulation/double glazin etc)

They're just a reseller selling Dimplex Quantum systems which you can also get from TLC Direct (other suppliers are available)

I'm not sure how much they save compared to 'ordinary' combined storage/panel heaters such as Dimplex Duoheat or equivalents.

If you want very low daytime heat loss then fan assisted storage heaters are the ones to go for, but they're expensive and have a high initial cost.

Ordinary storage heaters were always intended to be supplemented by evening heating i.e. a decorative electric fire in the lounge, back in the 1960s when having a bedroom at 16degC was considered comfortably warm.

If you are not in during the day then storage heating may not be suitable for you.

Another option is a thermal store heated by off peak electric, with wet radiators.

Owain

Oil fired CH would probably be the next choice.

Newer ones might be better insulated - but they still don't change the laws of physics. If you massively over spec them, then they will last a day.

Well the site if full of enough eco bollocks to make me look elsewhere! Since they claim to use dimplex heaters, you will probably find them cheaper at your local electrical wholesaler.

have eye watering prices but claim to have intelligent charging - ie do not fully charge if the next day's programmed demand is say only a couple of hours - or the weather is warmer.

How well this works (or not) I cannot say.

Certain modern storage heaters should have much better insulation and thus be better at saving the heat for when it is needed.

But there comes a line when it is better to just have cheaper day-rate panels.

Well that much depends on the usage pattern. I don't find even basic ones that expensive given the right tariff. However most do leak heat when turned down. Short of having the guts in a vacuum chamber I doubt there is much more one can do though. Brian

modern storage heating is radio controlled by the Electric company, and gives a much more even heat output,(ie you get boosts at various times) compared to the old night time only system. Mains gas cheap, tank gas expensive, oil probably your best bet if you want to change. Not smelly when properly installed.

Allan

Good tip - but do all elect companies have this tariff?

Heard on the news heating oil prices are falling and likely to stay low.

Not heard of that. Are you thinking of E10 instead of E7 (7 hours cheap rate fixed period over night)? E10 gives 10 hrs/day at cheap rate but the hours are fixed within a pattern of 5 overnight, 3 afternoon, 2 evening.

Reading the Quantum blurb it mentions someting about demand control and stabilising the grid but the box to do the comms to the grid is not available.

It may well be worth looking at a wood pellet/chip boiler and the RHI scheme.

Oil is rather volatile. Looks to be the lowest it's been for over 3 years at the moment but this time last year it was about 65 p/l it's now about 52 p/l. That's £260 difference on 2000 l.

Have a look at:

And select 3 years. Note how the price plummeted from that 65 p/l to

I'm ust about to buy but with the price sliding I'm holding out to the last dregs, unless I spot an upturn. B-)

(*) Other pricing sites are available and I find Boilerjuice generally about 2p/l above our local supplier. Gosh, might get this next lot below 50p/l, hasn't been that low since the latter end of

ROFL It is still extortionately priced even in summer!

Don't believe everything you hear on the news! There is a de facto monopoly operating with all the small independent suppliers being a name only delivery service for the conglomerate that bought them up.

You might have a choice of supplier in a few lucky locations but most places now there is Hobson's choice.

You could say that about anything.

Dave Liquorice confirms that it is at its lowest price for 3 years.

Have you bought any recently and found this not to be the case?

Not since February when it is always pricey.

There are various dynamically switched non-E7 tariffs in use in certain parts of the country, generally dating from the era of the old regional electricity boards. Control (AFAIK) is still primarily over the 198 kHz radio teleswitching system, which is now obsolescent (as is all BBC long-wave broadcasting). The future of dynamic demand management is tied up with smart metering, which, like everything in the electricity supply industry, grinds exceedingly slow.

E7 storage heaters:

- can be cost effective in well-insulated buildings, particularly those with high thermal mass on the warm side of the insulation;

- capital cost of insulation is low compared with oil or gas wet CH, so they can appeal to short-term tenants;

- in poorly insulated buildings, e.g. 9 in. solid-wall, forget it, unless there is scope and funding to add serious insulation.

That just about sums it up ! I haven't seen any E7 tariff installed in this area 'Scottish Hydro' for at least 20 years. Allan.

This can be good if it stops developers :-) ... ... altho probably not for long.

Dimplex Quantum work very well.

- Highest level of insulation - not 0.1" but 1" silica slab on the front so cold to the touch even when fully charged.

- Heat is PUMPED out by a fan - heat leakage is via the REAR and actually V ERY small even over 48hrs.

- Heat is pumped out at the VERY BOTTOM - directly heats the coldest room a ir, makes a huge difference.

- Seemlessly switches to peak as core depletes - element just behind that f loor vent.

- Digital temperature & timer control - you can set to 16oC during day, boo st up in evening.

Some downsides...

- Very expensive - so shop around, Discount Electrical / Heating used to be good, some others were £70-110 cheaper (John Cribb & Sons).

- Heavy chassis - 28-32kg re slab super-insulation.

- Depth of chassis - you have thick front insulation, new brick design re f an & plenum design.

- Slightly odd capacities - see 6" on the right? That is electronics, fan, full digital LCD programmers & menus (engineering & service menus also avai lable, very useful, smart radio slave/master included)

- Front clearance MATTERS - it is so big because the air output is HOT, WID E, FAN-BLOWN.

- Fan noise soft air-roar when first charged - caused by thermostatically c ontrolled plenum being narrow re hot core, so no bedroom use unless you set wakeup to be 8:30am.

- No static heat loss - you can set the room to 16oC or less (reprogrammabl e range) and you WILL get that - with majority of heat available 11pm, so y ou can't let it "leak" overnight.

Probably USB re-programmable and updateable, proprietary by the look of it.

Quantum do give instant heat response like a super-sized fan heater right a t floor level.

Duoheat. Basically a NSH-that-leaks + front-radiant-panel. Weak peak-rate boost (Quantum are 3x bigger).

You can undersize a Quantum and just rely on its peak rate element boosting . That sounds ridiculous, but because the heat is fan emitted almost on the f loor it does knock out the cold-feet syndrome.

Both Duoheat & Quantum. If you have a very insulated house, try to get cool air to the heaters or t hey will only charge to 75%. Even in a cold hall the Quantum will not readily go above 80% charge. You can program (!) 1-2-3-4 extra charge hours, but you still hit an 82% li mit or so.

Overally, Quantum finally delivers something that works "iPad like" except for a couple of issues.

- Price is outrageous - smart people sold their old heaters at £70-190, i nsulated, then bought fewer Quantum.

- Insulation is needed - you need CWI+Loft+DG, you can skip DG if you stick 50mm insulation on the inside of walls.

- Smarter people - might go GCH, it comes down to insulation + living style + solid floors & single point of failure.

Duoheat WILL cook you in a morning and get a bit cool in evening re a bit w eak boost element & not as responsive as Quantum.

Quantum will NOT fry in a morning, cold in an evening, too hot, too cold al l day long. They just deliver what digital temp you set. Finally. Took nearly until the last nuke was decommissioned!!

Typically a Quantum 100 will use 2-7kWhr boost in a hallway when TWO such h eaters are needed. That is to maintain 19oC and NO cold draught off wall to ceiling leaded glass re bottom-heat outlet. Warm winter so could not be ar sed to get the other Quantum in use as I blew the SDS into pieces (but that is another story...). Absolutely wipes the floor with old NSH which were f rankly just ****-off and get a clue. Duoheat leaves me cold (hah!) but ok a s static "Duo300 as baseline heater in a big bedroom kind of thing". Quantum are very very popular in London, you no longer need GCH at all with them & 2013 insulation levels. For running cost, I would use 120 day winte r with 80% charge on E7 and average 5 units Peak. That is for a very long b ad winter, adjust if you already know your existing kW figures.

I bought them for a relative and the difference is night-n-day. However the rule about insulation remains true (that hall I refer to above has a) lead ed glass, b) no CWI and c) 320mm loft insulation incidentally).

It's on a par with other energy sources. 55 p/l equates to around 5.5 p/kWhr. Bit more than mains gas, bit less than off peak electricity, a lot less than standard/peak electricity and less than LPG. Just like it's always been.

I think most of the "big brand names" that do domestic oil are all under the GB oils umbrella. Web based BoilerJuice is under GB Oils. Wallace and WCF are still independent, Fuelfighter on the web is WCF. FuelTool is independant.

I haven't checked ownerships recently mind... Well worth looking at the bottom of the web pages of the suppliers in your area.

Our local supplier is still a small family run independent. Probably too small to attract the attention of GB Oils.