Difficulty In Getting A CH Boiler Serviced :Update

[Stuart B]

>> >

>> > >> >> " Stuff this" I said and opened up Thomson's Local Directory and >> >> called the first place ( Corgi) that I spotted and they are doing it >> >> on Monday . £91 incl vat .I don't know if that is typical but it gets >> >> it done . >> > >> >> They did mention the cost if they find anything but I doubt they will >> >> but even if they do they will not be fixing it .Alpha can do that . >> > >> > I'd be inclined to put the 91 quid in a high interest account and take >> > the gamble as to the boiler giving problems. The so called service >> > usually is no more than a check that things are ok - and if not the >> > boiler installation details should say what's required. > > >> with a 3 year warranty dependent on the 'service history'. You would be >> gambling the next two years against a problem. > >I'm not so sure. Makers can put whatever conditions they fancy into a >warranty - but they don't effect your rights in law. And recent judgements >suggest things like a boiler should fault free for 5 years. Of course many >might not want the bother of having to confront a manufacturer. > >> On my new van I decide to pay the high cost of a 'service' after the 12 >> months at the expensive and questionably competent main dealer. The >> second year I took it to the local garage and had it 'serviced' for a >> third the cost but I forewent the last years warranty (which indeed >> turned out not to be needed). > >I think that has also been outlawed - the requirement to use a dealer for >servicing for a warranty to be upheld. All that's needed is a record of >proper servicing having been carried out. Which is pretty basic stuff in >most modern vehicles. > > > >> -

You are correct about car servicing .That "rule" was outlawed or removed a while back . AlphaBoilers have said in an e-mail to me that not doing an annual service will not invalidate the 3 year warranty .I have printed it out and kept it with the boiler documentation.

Well I got the guy out to do the service and ,as I suspected would happen ,I'd have been as well not getting it done and save myself the £73 . I was hard pressed to see what he actually did for the money .I got the impression he was fiddling around to make me think he WAS doing things but I could see he wasn't . He knew from speaking to me that there had been no problems except for a small leak that Alpha had fixed . He certainly didn't do all the things listed for a service in the Alpha documentation . From speaking to him it was clear he was an Ex Scottish Gas fitter now working on his own but also on the books of the company that I contacted . Acht well..once bitten twice shy .

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------. I posted the above reply yesterday about getting my CH Boiler serviced .I happened to look at the boiler last night and close the flap covering the panel display and noticed that this guy had not fitted it properly .....He had not fitted the bottom part properly before screwing in the screws at the top .FFS

[TheScullster]

wrote

I recently had the first year's service on a Worcester Bosch boiler and the only thing of note that the guy did was to stick a gas analyser into the flue and check the reading! He also checked the gas fire which was more of a challenge, being a coal effect job from which all coals have to be removed for cleaning.

Phil

[Dave Baker]

I posted the following 5 years ago in this thread

friend of mine is a Corgi gas fitter. He told me years ago that although a fair chunk of his income came from boiler servicing it was the biggest con in the business from the customer's point of view and the easiest £50 he ever makes. If there's no actual fault with a thermocouple or other component all he could do himself was hoover out any dead insects and dust and tap the gas pipe a few times to dislodge any crap and that's what he advised me to do. My boiler has been here (potterton RS50) since I bought the house 17 years ago and was several years old then. It's never been serviced other than as above and works as well now as it ever did. I've put two thermocouples on it over the years which is a 10 minute job and I've no doubt saved 17 x £50 on servicing which is more than enough to buy another boiler if this one ever goes wrong.

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If people have an annual or bi-annual service plus pay for a maintenance contract from BG or the like you're looking at over £300 a year. Enough to buy a new boiler every few years. I can never understand why everyone doesn't just save their money.

[David Hansen]

On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 15:01:05 -0000 someone who may be "Dave Baker" wrote this:-

I must tap the gas pipe a few times, the next time I do the rest.

[Stuart B]

Exactly .

My previous boiler was a 25 year old Potterton floorstanding boiler and that's all I did .Remove a couple of covers and brush and hoover out the crap and replace the panels .

Last ( and only) time I got a gas fire serviced the fitter did much the same .Removed a couple of bits of casing and took out the imitation coal and swept out the dust and then put it back together again .So I have followed suit .

This is fine for us guys who can DIY but you can understand others ( dare I say most laydeees) who are unable to turn their hand to such things and get caught in this trap .

[adder1969]

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Well, if you knew he didn't do the things listed in the service for the boiler, why on earth did you pay him? (I assume you did). ..and also since when did an email ever overrule the specific terms of an agreement already in place? There's nothing to stop you doing your own service is there?

[Stuart B]

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I know .Not really like me but I was glad to see the back of him .

I didn't say that an e-mail overruled the terms of an agreement . What I said ( possibly back in the original thread) was that I had it firmly in my head that the boiler HAD to be annually serviced otherwise the free 3 year warranty would be invalidated but after booking the service I could not find where I read that ( if I ever did which iit seems I did not ) . I e-mailed Alpha to check if not having the service would invalidate the warranty and they confirmed that the warranty would not be invalidated if the service (s) were not carried out . I hope that makes things clearer .:-)

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Yes - when I installed my last boiler about 30 years ago a mate in the trade said far more damage was done to a boiler by pulling it apart for 'servicing' than by leaving it until it actually needed one. In my case some 15 years later. It sooted up. A good clean and off it went again. Replaced it last year with a condensing one - but simply because of increasing gas prices. It was still working like new.

[BRG]

> A friend of mine is a Corgi gas fitter. He told me years ago that

Dave,

where do you get your "£300" figure from?

My gas maintenance contract with BG for this year (2007/2008) is £189 and that includes a "service" call, the full cost of any breakdowns or leaks on my C/H system (including rads, cylinder, expansion tank, pipework, radiators, controls pump etc) 24 hours a day.

Over the years-to-date, they have renewed a cylinder, numerous pumps, thermostats, time clocks, rad valves, re-piped the C/H system in the airing cupboard, repaired under-floor pipe leaks, changed boiler heat exchangers and carried out many miscellaneous boiler repairs - all under the maintenance contract with absolutely no quibbling.

(Initial boiler was a Potterton Neataheat wall mounted [and that broke down almost every month for around 5 years] existing boiler is a Baxi wall mounted [a bit more reliable over the last 10 years])

To cap this off, their service response times have always been good (the shortest wait was 2 hours and the longest 24 hours) and I have *NEVER* had a one of their engineers standing by the boiler, pursing his or her lips and saying "I'll have to replace this or that because..." when only a thermocouple has gone or the spark igniter cable has become disconnected - nor had problems with return calls.

For any maintenance contract (or other insurances), you usually pay for the 'peace of mind' and, if they are never used, then great - *BUT* if something does go wrong or a catastrophe occurs, then at least you can pick up the telephone, make one or two calls and there is someone there to ease your troubles.

Unless of course, you're a tight-arse and pick the cheapest possible cover that doesn't really give what you wanted in the first place - or not worth the paper they are written on because they have so many exclusion clauses!

I pay a damn sight more for my car and house insurance per year (the best I can afford and with a damn good company by the way) and to my mind, get far less in return for the premiums - unless a major disaster occurs of course.

BRG

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Seems they must fit rubbish for spares - and the original system was rubbish too.

In 30 years I've had one replacement pump. One replacement three port valve. Two thermocouples. Three complete changes of TRVs - due to buying cheap twice. No pipe or rad problems at all. But then I do use inhibitor which BG apparently don't think necessary.

[Andy Cap]

I agree. There something SERIOUSLY wrong with a system that requires so much attention or the standard of maintenance and parts has been extemely poor.

Andy

[BRG]

Dave,

Spares I don't really worry about as they are paying for them - and the more they change the less profit they get - but to be fair, their quality seems to be reasonable (other than the pumps which gave a problem until I insisted that they use a Grundfos on the last change some six years ago).

The system I inherited when I moved into the property some 25 years ago was the original one and yes, it's rubbish (and the same system is also used on around 100 houses on the site) control wiring apparently back-to-front (that's the only way I can describe it), a pump that operated on the return rather than the flow (hence the airing cupboard re-pipe), motorised valves powered shut and a few problems with the roomstat and timer wiring - that's why I let BG do all the work!

Yes, there is inhibitor in the system - British Gas insisted that they put some in after they did a system flush some six years ago - again, according to your comment, BG seem to operate different policies in different areas.

BRG

[Dave Osborne]

Out of interest, which TRVs have you tried/discarded and are you happy with the expensive ones?

Cheers,

Rumble

[Dave Plowman (News)]

When I first installed the system I told myself that the perfect design and careful balancing meant TRVs weren't required. About a year later I decided to fit them. ;-) Apart from to the living area where the thermostat is.

Now this was long before this group existed, and I hadn't done any research on them, so just bought Wicks own brand. Ie the cheapest. After about 3 years some gave trouble - and Wicks had changed their design radically which meant their current ones weren't a direct replacement. So in a fit of pique I went to Homebase - who at the time were owned by Sainsbury and had quite a good reputation. Changed the lot - which also meant altering the pipework. They did about 5 years. Changed them again for the same make. When some of those started to fail I made one good set out of the old that I'd kept and got a few more years from them. By this time I was reading this group and found that a decent make like Drayton although much more expensive last considerably longer. So I fitted those about 7 years ago and so far so good.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Of course the cost of spares doesn't matter if you're insured. I was simply questioning the need for insurance at all. If you have a half decent system to start with.

You'd think a firm getting a contract for 100 houses - presumably similar

- would take the trouble to design the system properly. If nothing else to save warranty claims and the hassle of them. It's not exactly rocket science.

The other thing of course is just how quickly BG get the system running again. In my brother's case this has taken up to five days. And his breaks down about twice a year. Mainly the boiler which BG recommended - a Potterton Envoy...

[Edward W. Thompson]

On Wed, 23 Jan 2008 17:32:17 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"

snip

I'm not looking for a debate but care to share yoiur thoughts on your decision process. As your old boiler was ;'working like new' I would have thought that capital cost of replacement would have outweighed any advanatges in lower fuel consumption.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Indeed. But the rises in gas costs ain't over yet - IMHO. It's also quite a large old house which is difficult to insulate to modern standards due to solid brick walls, so the actual bills are quite high. Over 1000 quid a year. So a 20% saving should recover the capital cost of a self installation in a reasonable time. Be a different matter if BG had been involved. ;-) It also coincided with other works in the room so was a convenient time to do it.

[adder1969]

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My bad - I missed the "not" before "invalidate" :-) I'd have left it at though though if it were me :-)

[adder1969]

In 20 years I've had a leaky system due to a bad joint at a rad, replaced one pump because of crud in the system, two motorised valve motors, a PCB and a thermocouple.

It might actually be more complicated than rocket science but it's not brain surgery to install and maintain a heating system. ..but you pays yer money etc...

[anyoneanywhere]

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" I'd have left it at though though " What's that mean?