Combis and showers

Boilers of this sort of ilk tend not to be (auto) modulating. Of hand the only natural draught boiler with modulation I can think of is a Vaillant Sine (1980s combi).

No I mean on most ordinary burners. You can see the effect on ovens, grills and sometime hob burners - it's a transient effect. I presume that the gas rate increases immediately but there is a transient delay in the corresponding air flow increase into and through the mixing tube(s).

This is a somewhat simplistic analysis. The point I'm getting at is that the flame temperature is constant (due to the air/gas ratio being more or less constant). The excess air forms a bigger proportion of the total flow through the boiler at lower gas rates. There will be some variation in the flue gas temps with gas rate, this effect will be to mitigate the effects of the excess air.

The point I was trying originally to make was that modulating burners with fixed speed flue-fans are not really all that bad. They are of course not as good as premix burners with tightly controlled variable speed blowers. The gas valve on those boilers, sometimes known as a zero-governor, is something akin to a carburettor, namely to keep the fuel:air ratio as constant as possible over a wide range air flow rates.

I don't know, but I strongly suspect that the 'carburettor' on an LPG vehicle would be much the same technology.

Reply to
Ed Sirett
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I believe the psychobabble term is co-dependancy?

I tend to agree with you - no matter how hard he tries I'm going to try just as hard not to respond to the false allegations, innumerate reasoning, absolute claims etc.etc.

Reply to
Ed Sirett

More like picking a scab really... you know you shouldn't but it can be fun briefly and it is so easy to do.

Yup, sorry guys... I am getting better at ignoring him, but in my defense in this case the OP seemed like a newbie, so it did not seem fair to have him mauled by dribble!

Reply to
John Rumm

What false allegations would these be? The, all combis have poor flowrate one? Or the, Part L cylinders are quick recovery one?

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

The Chav is at it again. Sad but very tragic indeed.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

It came across as adjustable injectors.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

The message from Ed Sirett contains these words:

I remember them. Had a sliding occluding panel that partially covered the open end of the venturi.

Reply to
Guy King

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:06:27 +0100 someone who may be "Doctor Drivel" wrote this:-

An expert is someone who knows how little they know about the subject they are an expert in. A non-expert thinks that they know just about everything about the subject they are not an expert in.

Reply to
David Hansen

...Like me.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

Is that a self confession of how little you know of this subject?

Noun: "expert" ekspurt

  1. Is someone who knows how little they know about the subject they are an expert in.
Reply to
Fred

You have to read that again. If you can't comprehend get back to me.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

Yep.

This is perhaps a good reason, to bring about a broader selection of responses.

Reply to
Ed Sirett

And your was total misinformation. I have no time for professionals who don't know their jobs. With them, as with you, I go for the jugular. I can understand the amateurs going on myths, and there is an excuse for the uk.d-i-y Lunatic Association (affiliated) members: Richard Cranium, Matt/Lord Hall, Rumm, etc - they are just plain nutters, but a so-called pro? If you don't know, ask me.

Reply to
Doctor Drivel

If you're having difficulties ask your supervisor for till training after hours.

Who could possibly refuse an offer like that?

Reply to
Andy Hall

Weren't the Servowarm boilers of the 70s modulating ones? Also my water heater of that vintage (part of a warm air unit) did so.

Reply to
<me9

** had to snip Matt for obvious reasons **
Reply to
Doctor Drivel

AFAICT Servowarm rebadged other makes (like Thorn). The only one (i've seen) that was unique to them was a boiler that hid in wooden box behind a radiator which swung out on hinged water connections. The boiler itself was a typical cast iron, permanent pilot unit, except it was very shallow so as to fit behind the radiator.

There were doubtless loads of other models which I haven't seen though.

When I say modulating I mean (auto) modulating not just the ability to be set to different gas rates by the installer.

Reply to
Ed Sirett

Both the ones quoted (I'm not 100% certain on the servowarm* ) modulated the flame down (constricted the gas supply) as the water heated up, resulting in a constant circulating temperature.

  • The Servowarm was a curiously shaped (quite wide) unit in a place I rented for a few months. The flame seemed to be constantly on, but when the radiators heated up, would reduce in size to maintain temperature, rather than switch off completely. This was the same as in the water heater I mentioned. It was a purely mechanical arrangement, with a thermally expanding element directly controlling the gas flow. I may stil have the water heater in the garage, I'll have to have a search and see how it worked, if I still have the bits.
Reply to
<me9

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