Cheap boilers!

Ah. I thought you weren't agreeing with me.

I'll get my coat.

sponix

That was my point. It won't be, because the only significant difference is the few pieces of plastic that comprise the condensate trap and drain.

Comparing recent condensing and non condensing products:

- both have a fairly large heat exchanger

- both have a fanned flue

- both have electronic ignition

- both have an electronic control system

Where do you get the notion that a condensate drain makes a product unreliable?

That is not very plausible.

I have to agree with you Andy.

The only parts that are different are the burner, heatXer and condensate stuff.

The fans for premix burners are better made than the simple shaded pole combustion fans of non-premix units.

There is no APS on a condensing boiler.

The heatXer is made of more corrosion resistant materials - hence it is likely to out survive the non-condensor which eventually corrode.

The plastic bits are pretty trivial and the only problem is likely to be a blocked condensate pipe which is unlikely on a quality install.

Well if you discount the legitimacy of Part-L building regs in >90% of homes.

Indeed but not filled in. Especially the fact that building regs approval is required to install a boiler or self-certification of compliance.

True.

Now this is just plain wrong. Compare the spare part prices for a Biasi or Alpha against the spares part prices for a Worcester or Vailant.

Time will tell. I'm not expecting any upset of the "form book" on this one.

Which needs registering and filling in and signing - and that means certifying it complies with the regs.

It's not the special offer, it's the fact that in >90%+ of homes it would be illegal. Law breaking whilst more of a life style option that it used to be is not common practice amongst those avoid cowboy status.

I think my contributions over the years and the FAQs below speak for themselves in this matter.

There isn't one. However are you never going to fit it? A bit pointless not to. I doubt it's going to appreciate much sitting in the shed.

Sorry, my fault. I thought you were trying to argue for buying up a non-condensor and fitting it simply because it's cheap regardless of the rules. Please accept my apologies if I over did things.

DrD. Please note this is the way to deal with things when you are wrong.

If you mean Dr Drivel/IMM, then you don't known what you are on about. He is the most informative person here on heating and water. I know, I have constantly taken his advice to great success.

I agree with you. My point is that I would not touch a Ravenheat because of bad reports. I have never used one and use top branded products as that impressed the customer. The 'Bosch' on the front gives confidence in people who buy. That is the way it is.

Then why when anyone posts a question regarding boiler or heating system problems does he never answer? Set Square, Ed, Boilerdoc etc. seem to contribute far more useful information on these matters than the advertising babble that your hero is forever regurgitating.

I install things not fix them. He is the best here at installation designs by a mile. The only advice I have ever taken in heating and water has been from him. I'm sure the others are good. IMM has come out with practical and at times inventive and cost effective ways to install. Ways I would never have though of. Offer him a problem and he come up with the goods every time, and often offering a number of ways to do it. You don't see this as you don't install.

You have to be joking... he routinely comes up with overly complex half arsed solutions to problems, that don't actually satisfy the requirements. When someone points this out he sets about bodging ever more complexity onto them to try and "patch" what was a daft idear in the first place. Not saying he is always wrong or always posts poor advice, its just I can't be bothered sorting the useful stuff from the immense volume of crap you have to wade through to find it.

now that I can believe...

Your rose tinted specs must be dirty.

;-)

I am not joking, I install things.

I install systems and with IMM I would be putting in tanks and employing idiot plumbers. And I have come across some plumbers who still think it is the sixties.

I am not going to argue with you. You are clearly no expert in heating and water, so your view is irrelevant. I have used his advice on a number of occassions and he has got me out problems quickly and cheaply and the systems worked and delivered. And I did use two combis, something which many simpletons on this group can't get their heads around and tend to mock, which was a quick, simple and a highly cost effective way to get high flowrates, save space and create two zones. Highly recommended, I know I have done it. And the Rinnai multi point IMM put me onto worked wonderfully.

I am sure you do... you were joking when you said he was the best here at... well anything really. Most of the time he is as clueless as you seem to be.

Erm, yes.

Obviously not the case....

I don't claim to be an expert - however I can apply analytical thinking to the subject - something drivel usually fails to do. Drivel does claim to be an expert, but anyone can see that in reality he is nothing more than an armchair plumber with too much time on his hands.

In article , John Rumm writes

You _do_ realise timegoesby is Drivel is IMM is News is Adam is etc. ?

By the way you write the exact opposite of what I'd guess you mean you are in fact IMM anyway?

I have have suspected it on occasion (like now for example!), although I am not yet convinced... I have never seen any of dribbles (obvious) concocted identities that can string a coherent sentence together yet.

Surely everyone knows that.......except timegoesby, Drivel, IMM etc.

Perhaps we should engage Mr Utterson....

You forgot Icky the Firebobby too. You have to realise that My Arse, Mr Tomlinson here is barking mad. How is the job at Liverpool JM uni going? May not be for long if you keep it it.

It had to be snipped.