Bench for light workshop?

[Bob Eager]

Having nearly completed work on the house to SWMBO's satisfaction (yes, yes, I know it'll never actually be finished, but she doesn't)....

I have been allocated a room as 'mine'...about 4m by 3m. I intend to use this for various things, some of which are already happening but only in an ad hoc fashion.

The room will usually have 2 or 3 PCs in it, running to a KVM and monitor/keyboard/etc. plus one of the house printers. It is also used to store light tools (PC/electronics etc.) and stocks of paper/toner, plus boxes of components. These are in high metal shelving.

I have one side of the room (3m approx) for a 'bench'. I'm not after a heavy workbench here, but somewhere to use the PCs, work on PCs and other electronics, and generally fix things. It should incorporate storage.

The question is...what to use for a bench. I don't want anything elaborate, so I was thinking of something like some kitchen units and a piece of worktop. I need to be able to get cables 'up the back' which might complicate it. There is also a radiator running the length of this wall, unfortunately.

I really have to use this wall, because of the other 3:

• One has a chimney breast in the middle of it.

• One has the door in it, and the cupboard with the mains isolator/meter/consumer units - not movable.

• One is a bay window.

So, any ideas and actual experiences appreciated....!

[Andy Hall]

Reward indeed.

I've done something roughly like this for my study.

I made my own cabinets, approximately to the dimensions of kitchen base and top cabinets and used kitchen type doors for them. THe cupboards have a service space behind (as do most that you buy), so it's easy to run cables.

I didn't use legs or a kick board on the cabinets but arranged the cabinet to be just clear of floor level by attaching some spacers of about 6mm below. With this arrangement, the worktop ends up at approximately standard desk height.

I have a large 21" monitor and the solution to accomodate that was to put it into a corner between adjoining walls and with worktop and cupboard runs on each. There is a section of worktop joined to each wall run and forming a 45 degree angle to them. This gives a place for the monitor with ample space in front for a keyboard or writing etc. and loads of legroom underneath. I used butcher block worktop finished with 8 coats of Danish Oil (it's a quick procedure).

I used cable outlet inserts made by Trend and their router jig to cut the holes.

The upper cupboards are butted virtually against the ceiling to give maximum height between worktop and underneath of cupboard. There is room for two rows of bookshelves all the way round, although I have only installed one at this point.

It works pretty well and I am pleased with the result.

I think that the main problem that you would have is the radiator. One option could be to fit grilles into the back of the worktops to allow convection. You would need to have air inlet at the bottom as well, though. Even then, the output is going to be reduced by possibly 30% (like a radiator cover).

I would try to look for an alternative for the radiator. A fan convector may not be appealing because of the noise. How about two or three smaller radiators on the other walls, or perhaps a high one at one end? Double finned low radiators under the bay window?

[Lurch]

On 4 Jan 2005 23:34:23 GMT, "Bob Eager" strung together this:

Depends how high you want it. I've got 2 workbenches in the garage, (well, I've got more but only 2 that I can get to!), One is atop an old cupboard of a similar height to kitchen units and the other next to it is low level for sitting at.

Neither of mine have a radiator behind though, could yours be moved? I suppose you could leave a gap behind the unit to circulate air if that's what ends up there, or change it for a plinth heater.

[Bob Eager]

(useful stuff)

The radiator is actually oversized for that room, IMO. So a loss such as that is not a problem, especially as two of the PCs are on 24/7.

Yes...the wall behind the door perhaps.

That might work. Will have to look at costs....!

[Stefek Zaba]

My study's smaller - 4m x 2.2 roughly. It has minimal heatloss - only the 2.2m end wall+window, and the first 3m of one of the longer walls, are external; timber-frame construction with (I think!) sthg like rockwool behind the vapour barrier. Oh, a little heat gain from the HW tank in the airing cupboard which it shares 1m of wall with.

With only one PC in here, not running 24x7, and a sprinkling of small loads only 30W or so of which are on 24x7, it's still more comfortable with a small gap permanently open in the small side window, and when working at the PC with it and outboard peripherals adding 400-500W of heat into the room, I often find myself part-opening the window. The TRV on the rad agrees - it kicked in a few days ago when the outside temp was unusually low, for a good 30 minutes or so.

So you may find your rad as essentially redundant as mine is, and faffing about with relocation to be unnecessary. A grille strip at the back of the workbench is a possibility, but is an invitation to Sod and Murphy to send irreplaceable parts (Torx-7-head M2.5 30mm machine screws, tiny custom plastic mouldings, etc) down there. I'd go with the "who needs a rad when you've a couple of 24x7 machines in there", and rejig if you find your fingers or toes turning blue...

Stefek

[Bob Eager]

Yes, I had a think last night and came to essentially the same conclusion. The study (upstairs) has another 3 PCs in it, all permanently on. We have never used the radiator in there.

So, I just need to think about what kind of 'bench' construction is best....!

[Stefek Zaba]

If you want cost-efficient, I'd guess at kitchen worktop & kitchen unit bases, picked up at 'sale'/discontinued-range prices. Then you can spend the cash you saved on a big anti-static sheet to cover the bench ;-) For cable access, interrupting the supporting batten in a couple of places and cutting a recess of say 5cm wide x 3cm deep (so 13A plugs, VGA/LCD-panel connectors, etc. can readily pass through) would be simple enough - though keeping the batten in one piece and reducing its depth instead would make keeping it in good contact with the top rather easier. As far as the bench base goes, it's up to you to balance storage (which cupboards give you) against access space (which either free-standing legs - 2insq timber being functional, chromed or similar Official Worktop Legs being Prettier to some ways of thinking). You may find an open bench - batten on wall, braced legs or a simple chip/MDF side panel to support the sides and "thereby" the front. If you're worried about deflection in the middle of the front, stiffening with a bit of angle iron a few inches back from the front edge might help. For the garage bench, I have that sort of arrangement, with a half-depth shelf lower down running the full width of the bench, forming a handy place to store both projects-in-progress and some of the tools/materials.

Bookshelf-wise, I'm very happy with the Spur uprights and long runs of pineboard I put in within a few weeks of moving in here. There's a natural gap the depth of the shelf uprights behind each shelf, which makes the narrow shelves I have next to the desk to have an arbitrary collection of Ethernet, small-gadget-wall-wart-feed, phone/ISDN/ADSL, USB, and more to run restrained but easy to add/shift/remove as the mood takes me.

Hope that helps stimulate some thinking - Stefek

[Ian White]

That certainly works as my 'light, clean, standing' workbench (as distinct from the various other combinations).

However, you also need to think about work-surface height, and room for toes and knees.

A good solution would be to use two 50-60cm units and leave a knee space in between them. That gives you the options of both standing and seated work. I would say keep the recessed plinths, so you can comfortably stand up close when you need to.

One drawer/cupboard unit and one stack of drawers often makes a nice combination of storage spaces. You don't need the whole front-to-back depth for your knees, so you could fit some extra Spur shelving in there.

A tall chair or stool (preferably adjustable, to make it exactly right for you) would complete the ensemble.

[Bob Eager]

Very useful...thanks!

[Bob Eager]

Thanks...again some useful ideas. The mixed storage/open idea was roughly what I had in mind.

[Dave Liquorice]

Personally I'd put my main assembly/disassembly/tinkering area in the bay, daylight is so much nicer to work under than artifical. I've use white Melamine on 2" sq legs, cross braced at the rear and sides and 3 x .75 battens between the leg tops to make sturdy, cheap, benches.

[Capitol]

IME Kitchen units and a worktop work well in this application. In 3m of one wall, I have one of the office pcs and and two kneeholes, one for the pc, one for the bench area which backs onto the radiator. By splitting the worktop into two short pieces it is possible to have one section against the wall, and a gap at the back of the workbench section. The kitchen base units are freestanding, with the top in some locations, screwed to them. The split also facilitates access when various disasters strike. The bench worktop has a 150mm rear upstand, which enables most of the small vital screws to fall onto the floor in front of the bench, where they disappear into the carpet to join the sawdust, metal filings, crumbs and coffee, before she sucks them up into the cleaner. The occasional screw makes a bid for freedom at the rear, disappears into the double panel radiator behind the bench, where it is preferably written off(one of those screw pick up tools, a mirror and a magnet is a good investment! That item is of course, normally, brass!). Kitchen drawer units make good filing cabinets, but don't do too good a job or you will find that these are taken over for the usual collections of nK handbags and shoes(IME, these things breed when I'm not looking and she wants to take over the next door space!). The airflow round the radiator is very good and the instrument shelf at higher level deflects the heat round the room without cooking the operator at the bench. Typing chairs with adjustable height work well. Some jobs you need just under the magnifier, some you need elbow room for! The knee holes provide storage for boxes, large paper cutters, UPSs etc. Using kitchen units is economic, very fast, but most shelves are crap and won't take book loadings.

Hope this helps

Regards Capitol

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I've got my workshop in a first floor bedroom. There's no point in making an ultra strong bench since I'd not risk heavy hammering etc with a suspended floor and ceiling underneath.

I made mine out of 2x2 PAR with the legs at 2ft spacing, and a perimeter frame at the top, and at about a foot off floor level for shelves, with all the joints simple half overlap types, glued and screwed. There are also horizontal strengtheners front to back alongside each leg at the top and shelf height. The shelf area is made out of flooring tongue and groove, with a sort of pelmet across the front to keep things in. It's screwed to the wall, and covers 1.5 walls, including a cut out for the rad. The top is 1" blockboard covered in strong lino, and has a hardwood edge, flush with the perimeter frame. I have a wood vice at one end, and a metalwork one at the other - with extra horizontal supports there. Later additions are a pillar drill, grinder, and compound angle saw. These are all bolted in place so may be removed when handling large sheets of whatever.

The beauty of making one is that you can tailor the height to suit yourself. I'm 6ft, and standard kitchen worktops are too low.

It cost not a lot - I used re-claimed blockboard as it was to be covered.

And its just fooking perfect for my needs. Wish I could say the same about everything I've made. ;-)

Everything in the workshop is designed for easy removal in case I ever needed to move, or have it as a bedroom again. So all worktop sockets etc are surface mounted and the wiring in surface conduit, so after a bit of filler and a tosh of paint you'd not know anything had been there.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

At the end of my benches, I've got a similar design, but at desk height, which runs under the window. This is my electronics area where I'll be sitting down. Can't abide using a high typist's type chair at a standard height bench.

[Bob Eager]

I agree. As it happens, this is ground floor (front!).

I'm slow this morning - PAR? It sounds more solid than what I was planning - heaviest thing that'll go on it is the laser printers I repair sometimes...but that's no reason not to do so of course.

This isn't a place where I'd have a big vice or anything like that, it's more electronics and minor hardware...!

Yes...I'm 6'4" and that is a consideration. However the kind of work I do is mainly sitting down, so it comes down to compatible seating more than anything.

As it happens, I had that idea too...but for another room. In the case of the workshop, the major power point users are the PCs etc., and they all run from one 13A socket, via a beefy UPS. Since I've just rewired the house (well, one bit isn't quite finished!) there are plenrty of sockets in the room.

This other room is larger (4m x 4m) and is a spare bedroom used as the 'office'. This has another four PCs in it (or will have, we're currently camping out in the next room and the office is being rewired etc.) and these too will run off a UPS. But there *is* extra wiring needed, over and above a normal bedroom, and, like you, I plan to use surface conduit and sockets for lots of network wiring, power (from UPS) and the like. I haven't yet worked out how to arrange all this table/worktop wise yet as SWMBO is involved in this one, and anyway we only stripped the room out three days ago.

(BTW, this was after completing decoration on the living room on Dec

23rd, having new carpet (4m x 7m) fitted at 9am Christmas Eve, and completing other stuff an hour before relatives arrived on Christmas Day morning!)

[Dave Plowman (News)]

PAR - planed all round, or smooth. ;-) Might also be called SAR - (surfaced)

I wanted the benches to be an exact fit round two walls, between door and window, so using ready made kitchen units wouldn't have been so good - and would have cost *far* more. Nor did I need doors, etc. I have added a couple of home made drawers, but these are much deeper than kitchen units.

My original intention was only to use it for small jobs, but find a nice warm dry well lit workshop (with a good sound system and TV) so appealing I'll lug car stuff up there for overhaul after a good clean. And carry lumps of timber up and down stairs for cutting etc rather than use the Workmate.

The obvious answer would be to move out of London and get a place with room for a decent external workshop. But I actually like living here and it's close to work, so I'm stopping. ;-)

[Ian White]

As well as the stand-up bench made from kitchen units, I do have a separate sitting-down electronics area with a much lower bench. Obviously it is better to have both, if there's space.

But if limited to only one option (as the OP seemed to be, by the room layout) it would have to be the higher bench, with a higher chair for sitting-down work.

Personally, I wouldn't go for a sitting-down bench facing into the bay window - not even if that was possible as well as the stand-up bench. BTDT, and retreated with severe eye-strain from having *too much* light in the daytime. Facing a window also severely limits the opportunities for over-bench shelving, which is particularly useful for electronics work.

[Bob Eager]

That's what I thought it meant, but not what the actual words were!

Yes, I am still not sure about the larger jobs - whether to do them there or elsewhere on a 'temporary' basis.

I'm in East Kent, 10 mins from work...so I'm not moving either!

[Bob Eager]

The bay window is very exposed to the road, so has blinds to stop people looking in and seeing what's there. So I would get little light benefit anyway...!

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I'd qualify this by saying I suffer intermittently from back trouble, and this sort of chair is the very worse to aggravate it, as you tend to perch on them rather than sit back.

I've got venetian blinds on a south facing window. But it's not a bay, being a back bedroom. Far too posh for the Victorians. The window is also one corner, rather than central - due to the rear addition. So my 'electronic' shelves are to one side on that wall. I'd put up some pics, but don't have a website. ;-)