3kw comet kiln-plug socket renewed 3 times...

..so,for the first 2 years,my comet kiln worked perfectly...then the socket burnt out,replaced it(always ised a professional electrician)thos time,socket switches got hardrr and harder to switch on,then the socket stopped working again,replaced the whole unit...now its happened again...the socket is about 20 ft via armoured cable to the house,the kiln room isnt damp...the kilns fine,but the plug gets a bit hot(when it worked)the electrician seems to be baffled...'must be your kiln'...but i know nothing about electrics so cant argue the toss!can ANYONE help...its driving me mad....
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On Tue, 15 May 2018 03:14:02 GMT, Lea Goldberg

Well if it baffled your professional electrician, there's your problem.
What subnormal idiot thought that a damp kiln room could have any bearing on socket condition/ temperature 20 feet away?
AB
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On 15/05/2018 06:24, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:

And just because a professional electrician was used it doesn't mean that the socket wasn't replaced by the cheapest he could source rather than the best quality available.
A plug/socket getting hot is a sign of inadequate low resistance connection or it being under-rated.
What socket are you writing about. A standard 13A socket/plug? (Although I can't see how you would fit a plug to an amoured cable). Is the switch heavy duty as used for a electric oven?
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I assume the 20ft cable is from the house supply to the socket in the kiln room - and therefore almost certainly irrelevant to the problem. Why not wire the kiln directly into a fused connection box with an two pole switch? The socket is failing either because it and/or the plug are cheap and nasty, or because of pervasive damp and corrosion.
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There appears to be two versions of the Comet Kiln, the ECO which draws 3kW which should be fine using a 13A plug in a standard socket. The other is a 5.5kW model for which a plug and socket is totally inadequate. There shoul d be a ratings plate somewhere on the kiln check the wattage, although I wo uld have thought your professional electrician would have checked that firs t.
Richard
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On 15/05/2018 07:57, Tricky Dicky wrote:

Good point.
The other thing I would suggest even for the 3 kW model is to get your sparks to fit a "cooker" type breaker switch and then an industrial type plug and socket like this:
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/4641403/?grossPrice=Y&cm_mmc=UK-PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-PLA_UK_EN_Connectors-_-Power_Connectors%7CIndustrial_Power_Connectors-_-PRODUCT+GROUP&matchtype=&gclid IaIQobChMIja_et5iH2wIVWc-yCh0b5AUTEAYYASABEgI9d_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
(This is what I did in a friend's business unit after he was getting short life even from MK plugs and sockets that were running with a high duty factor).
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On 15/05/2018 08:29, newshound wrote:

Or wire it straight in - as you would do with a cooker. My big glass-fusing kiln (7kw or thereabouts) has its own cable straight back to the consumer unit, a big isolating switch on the workshop wall, and the same 'big cable' wired direct into the contactors.
Kilns and standard plug-type connectors don't mix - and, as they're often left running, unattended - it's worthwhile doing the job properly and safely.
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On 15/05/2018 08:39, Adrian Brentnall wrote:

Yes, good point about wiring in direct. I used plugs and sockets for my friend because they are in heater supplies switched by temperature controllers. This way, if either a heater or a controller fails, working items can be switched over to a spare device.
But perhaps worth remembering if you have something more portable like a big welder, which you might want to put away.
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newshound was thinking very hard :

Your first step, ought to be to check the actual current drawn or check the rating plate on the back of the kiln. If it is just over the 13 amps, likely it would not blow the plug top fuse, but damage the plug and socket over time.
One solution for the 'just over 13amps' is to swap the plug and socket for a 16amp blue plug and socket. These are unfused, so the MCB would need to be changed if necessary for a 16amp if it is not already a 16amp.
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On 15/05/2018 08:39, Adrian Brentnall wrote: <snip>

And the OP may need to watch the implications for her insurance of anything which departs from the regs/manufacturer's requirements. And double and redouble that if she is using it commercially and has employees who use or are around the kiln, run courses where people use it, ...
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3kW which should be fine using a 13A plug in a standard socket. The other is a 5.5kW model for which a plug and socket is totally inadequate. There should be a ratings plate somewhere on the kiln check the wattage, although I would have thought your professional electrician would have checked that first.

https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/4641403/?grossPrice=Y&cm_mmc=UK- PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-PLA_UK_EN_Connectors-_-Power_Connectors%7CIndustrial _Power_Connectors-_-PRODUCT+GROUP&matchtype=&gclidIaIQobChMIja_et5iH2 wIVWc-yCh0b5AUTEAYYASABEgI9d_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Probably a good idea, but why does he need a plug and socket for the kiln anyway?
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On 15/05/2018 08:29, newshound wrote:

I would suggest that if you are fitting a socket like that a 32A one might be better as they cost about the same.
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On 15/05/2018 08:29, newshound wrote:

A 16 Amp plug and socket isn't sufficient to provide 5.5kW
Can I suggest you fix your signature and use 2 hyphens '--'

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On Tue, 15 May 2018 20:33:29 +0100, Fredxx wrote:

Or even better, the correct 'two hyphens and a space'.
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Its quite obvious that something in that circuit is underrated for the current being drawn, and once some plastic bit starts to melt you get poor and poorer contact, even arcing in the end, completely trashing the socket. If a plug is getting warm that is a good bit of diagnostic help. The pin that is getting hot is obviously doing so due to underrated connections. Look in the plug or whatever it is that plugs into the socket which gets damaged. it is entirely possible that the body of the plug is unaffected if its a higher melting point plastic. I had an issue like this with one of those so called plug in mechanical timers, the one where you put pins in holes. When I opened it up the short bit of brass from the live pin to the switch had been riveted to either end and this had oxidised and heated up the pin as a result. Load of rubbish. I only had a 3K fan heater on it! Brian
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On 15/05/2018 06:24, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:

I read it as the socket/plug is next to the kiln where the socket is at the (shed?) end of the 20ft of armoured cable.
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wrote:

Correct, I misunderstood when reading the original.
The problem should be pretty damned obvious though to anyone with a basic idea of electrical work.
Socket burnt out means nothing until inspection, it may simply be a loose cable.
It could be a cheap nasty socket with a sliver of bent brass carrying the 13A. BS marks seem to get onto anything with square pins these days.
Current information summary, socket burnt, replaced by "professional"
Went again, Ditto
Went again, overheating, Electrician baffled
1. Inspection of the defective items should be more than enough to indicate the reasons for the problem.
2, Instead of being "baffled" if the "electrician" measured the current drawn, then it would remove one item of uncertainty.
Personally I would suggest that the major problem is the choice of electrician.
AB
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Those original MK surface mount 13 amp sockets (and the matching plug) used to cook too. As anyone who's removed them when re-wiring will have found. Usually plenty scorch marks.
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On 15/05/2018 13:50, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Anyone who has done some DIY electrical work and purchased no-name plugs/sockets from the sheds probably knows that they can be vastly inferior to MK branded products. If MK can burn what hope is there for an inferior product?
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Despite being rated at 13 amps, most sockets and plugs aren't happy to carry that for very long periods. They are a domestic connector and really for intermittent use at full capacity. As with a kettle or washing machine etc. Hence things like 13 amp water heaters normally not plugged in, but hard wired. Same sort of thing with storage rads.
Even more so if cooling to the socket/plug is restricted in any way.
The answer is to go for an industrial 16 amp plug and socket - if indeed it has to have a plug/socket arrangement.
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