Tim Streater wrote in a previous post that "...the central issue, which is that the unit using the AA is sending a continuous radio signal to the centrally mounted control box which decides whether to run the door motor or not. And the central unit says "No" if if doesn't detect the signal".
This would mean that if your idea was implemented, the door would only operate once.
If there's a continuous drain I'd be looking at hardwiring - then there's no messing about with batteries that need charging or changing. If running mains is inconvenient, even a bit of bell wire with a PSU on the other end would suffice.
Theo
Quite.
And Tim may not have qualified the case that the central box is deactivated when the motor is being run in *both* open and closed directions, in the same way rear parking sensors might not be in use when you are going forward. ;-)
Cheers, T i m
p.s. This is where a home automation system could be pressed into use. Say the central unit actually does need to get the signal to function in either direction and you set the safety sensor transmitters to have their battery power cut when the doors are fully closed (microswitch inside the bottom of the door), you could integrate the Open/Close button(s) into the system and then bridge the 'sensor battery cut' switches with momentary relays to allow the doors to start opening. Given that you don't need the safety function running when the doors are fully open, the same solution could be arranged for that (in case you leave the doors open for some time). Then the batteries would probably last for years. ;-)
Something like this might do to provide continuous power - the croc clips could be cut off and the bared ends soldered to the battery contacts in the sender unit. Tim Streater is bound to have an unused USB mains power supply somewhere...
The average load might be around 7mA.
The sensor likely travels with the overhead door, down near the bottom strip. PSU wiring would have to move as the door opens. Maybe that's how it worked before the battery fetish came along.
A 2"x3" solar panel would work, to generate that amount of current, but it might take a 350mA LED to illuminate the panel and have some margin (for aiming the light). The question then, is how do you get the light to follow the solar panel, as the door rises.
Solar cells are around 0.5-0.6V each. Three cells would give
1.5V. And that's what the 2"x3" ones seem to offer.Paul
Our remote operated garage door, 2008 or so,had a photo cell (sender/receiver and reflector) monitoring the space about 400mm above floor level. I don't know if this would meet current regulations.
>
I'm sure I have such a spare :-)
But anything that adapts to use the mains means trailing wires, which knowing my luck would get trapped or strangle a mosquito or something. The nearest sockets are some distance away although I'm sure I could get my friendly sparks to add another, closer, socket.
I think I need to measure the draw current, to see what capacity I'm after.
Yes.
Could always add a fanny pack with a much bigger battery
Yeah, there's room to mount one next to each sensor.
Are you sure you're fitting the right kind of battery? I've had two auto garage doors and the sensors have both taken two AA-sized lithium thionyl chloride batteries (3.6v non-rechargeable) which last several years.
So you are running with 7.2V. With new AAs (3.2V tops) the sensors work fine. When they stop working the combined voltage of the two AAs (as measured here) is around 1.1V.
In any case their website says "two AA batteries will be required" for the situation where the Control Box is beeping - indicating new batts required.
If you Google "aa garage door batteries" the vast majority of hits are for 3.6v Li-thionyl (ER14505) ones so that would seem to be the most common type. What make is the door and/or controller? They ought to specify the exact type of AA needed (I'm not saying it isn't 1.5v but that would be unusual).
Well I can't help that.
It's a Birkdale classic roller door. And it may be unusual from the PoV of garage door geeks, but to an ordinary member of the public reading the Birkdale FAQ (which is what I was doing), AA means what you buy in Tesco and friends called "AA".
The Birkdale website appears to be marketing oriented. There was nothing to download about the sensors, near as I could tell. That FAQ entry was the only place I saw batteries mentioned at all.
The doors are using S-RSENS3-TC transmitters, which are these:
RS3 TGL868 · Transmitter for the detection of impact with no safety edge. · Operating frequency 868MHz. · Multi-frequency system: 4 self-adjusting channels at 868 MHz. · Power radiated < 1mW. · Power: 3Vdc (2 x 1.5V LR6 AA). · Operating temperature: -20°C to 55°C. · Tightness level: IP22. · Standby/operating consumption: 0.1mA/12mA. · Range: 50 meters. · Battery life: in accordance with the battery life table. · Dimensions: 40 x 194.5 x 20mm. · Maximum slat length: 4 meters.
Could be that I just need to stop using s**te AAs and get some better ones.
100uA shouldn't be much worse than the actual self discharge
Assuming an ampere hour, that should be 10,000 hours or a bit over a year
I wonder just how rubbish your cheap AAs are...
In message snipped-for-privacy@mid.individual.net>, Tim Streater snipped-for-privacy@greenbee.net writes
Seems a bit oversafe to need the edge protection when the door is fully closed. How does the motor know when to stop closing and can this not be linked to disconnecting the safety device?
>
Standby/operating consumption: 0.1mA/12mA <=== But what is the duty cycle ?
Your battery life is consistent with the unit being in the
12mA state, roughly 50% of the time.That sounds unnecessary to me.
Some mistake was made during installation. What could that be ???
The 868MHz frequency is used for "meter reading". Do you have a smart meter nearby that listens for probes on that frequency ?
Paul
YKIMS! Go for a test of the Ultimate Lithiums...
Some doors use magnets fitted up high and down low, to set the limit. Limit sensing is separate from safety sensing. The limit sensors are adjusted first, so that the safety sensor is not stopping the motor and the magnets do that instead. Some controllers have a bridge position on the terminal block, to bypass the door edge sensor while setting limits with limit magnets.
After downloading several JCM documents, the transmitter has a distinct smell of using capacitive sensing, rather than some sort of radar detection scheme. There is a need for the physical relationship of the last two slats in the door, to be separated by 1mm. It looks like the idea is, when the door starts to compress on an obstacle, the slats get closer to one another. The spacing on the "hung" slat changes, as the slat is no longer hung and starts to compress towards the slat above it. It doesn't measure compression as such - only a door edge sensor would do it that way. If they used a magnetic property, it would likely use more power than a capacitive sensing method would.
There is a "sensitivity" setting, but it's possible all that does is cause the transmitter to report in more frequently. When the overhead door closes at high velocity, the rotary sensor setting must be changed, to compensate.
The user manual for the transmitter, has a battery life table. Under the most extreme conditions, about 180 days battery life. Around 450 days, or a year and a half for the batteries, when a more normal usage pattern is present. The battery life is a function of how long it takes to close the door. This means, when the controller wants to move the door, it sends a signal to the transmitter "enter sensing mode", the transmitter power consumption goes up, then when the door is completely closed, the transmitter sends a signal "exiting sensing mode".
This is all a guess, as none of the documentation is anywhere near to being technically complete. I'm sure installers just eat this trash up and have a big smile on their face when reading one of those.
If I had to guess at the moment, the overhead door was never set up properly on limit switches, the door closes and sets off the safety sensor and the safety sensor stops the door from completing closure. This leaves the transmitter in a high power state, transmitting that the door has hit an obstacle. And the controller is not telling the transmitter to enter the low power state and stop sensing.
There's no reason for the transmitter battery life to be equating to the transmitter being left in the ON state all the time.
The door needs to be checked, that the limit switches are in control of door opening and door closing. Not the safety sensor stopping door closure instead, on a "normal" door closure. Like, if the bottom magnet fell off the install, that might leave the system dependent on the safety sensor, to stop the motor. It would appear the transmitter is not allowed to go back to low power state, until the collision is cleared.
Paul
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.