When you fly in and see all those parking lots lit up:)
The light illumniating the lot is doing its job
Waste light leaks and goes directly to the sky illuminating nothing.
Just thought I would point this out
why not use the same type camera system that changes traffic
signals when there are cars around. let the cameras turn
on the street lights where there is activity, and off after
an hour of no activity. they have a long view from pole top.
most of our local lots now use 70 watt sodium bulbs, each
easily replaced at least ten 100 watt incandescent bulbs.
lots that were on timers until 2am switching 6000 watts
now use photocells to switch 420 watts dusk to dawn.
dallas made a substantial power cut just by replacing all
the traffic signal bulbs with snap in led panels. and cut
maintenance staff who's only job was continually replacing
burned out signal bulbs. some intersection controllers and
signals are now solar powered. all of the school zones are
solar powered, including the radio links that eliminated the
timing sync when they lost power. (no more school
zone flashing at 2am)
-- larry / dallas
the high efficeny sodium and other lamps take a few minutes to come to
by the time the sensor tripped light on vehicle would of passed.
plus theres liability issues if lamps fail for some reason....
It STILL doesn't matter.
All that matters is that we FEEL GOOD just doing something - anything -
to address the "crisis" of "wasted" energy and the <koff, hack> global
warming it causes.
When all the efforts toward conservation have been made, although that
will never happen in the minds of too many, it still won't be enough to
some. To the environmentalist extremist, the only truly good world is
one where mankind no longer exists. Until that day, they won't be
happy. Of course, they'll be gone, too, so it's moot point.
A growing society will consume increasing amounts of energy. There is
NO WAY around that fact.
A society that no longer grows will collapse and be gone. There is no
way around THAT fact.
Take your pick.
Interesting comment. I believe that France and Italy are experiencing static
populations and Europe as a whole has significantly lower population growth
than in the past. Japan, I believe is also experiencing an ageing
population. All of which are countries "that had their day" and therefore in
"relative decline". I do appreciate your comments, though the demise of
China, Egypt, Rome and Greece historically does not require more recent
dynasties to collapse either to a major extent or at all.
we did that a lot about a year ago. it would take the city
or state months to replace miles of copper pulled out of the
conduit between the lights. the dark bridges across the
river were the only places folks seemed to care about.
crime- down here, storm windows are a good crime deterrent
since few houses have them.
This was a not-so-rare occurrence in The Good Old Days<tm> of the
dial-up BBS (Bulletin Board System) and FidoNet - a virtual predecessor
to the internet we now take for granted.
It was not uncommon for a reply to arrive on a reader's computer BEFORE
the original message.
This is why quoting became a convention and persists to this day.
It was the fact that, during the BBS days, the messages were moved
around the country (and, later, the world) using dial-up LONG DISTANCE
calls - all paid for out of the pocket of the hobbyist BBS "SysOp"
It was this fact that made EDITING ones quotes imperative and an
absolute requirement. Bandwidth was expensive to the BBS operator who
often provided access to these services for FREE. They paid the monthly
fee for a dedicated, standalone phone line. Some even had multiple
phone lines. In its heyday, MacNet Omaha (1:285/14) had TWO lines. It
was an expensive hobby, indeed, while raising three young daughters.
Mrs. MacWidow was MORE than patient during the seven years it operated.
Indeed they are grateful as are the astronomers in Tucson, Hilo, San Jose
and numerous other places. The lighting ordinances in those areas have kept
the light pollution under control so the multi-million dollars invested in
observatories, staff salaries and benefilts to the local economies are still
paying off. Other places, where wasted light makes it impossible for
astronomers to see the sky, they've packed up their telescopes and moved to
darker areas in Chile or Argentina.
So, let's see if I've got this right. You are saying that we should
continue to pay taxes to waste 30% of the light and energy from our public
lighting systems (streets and parking areas) lighting up the underside of
birds and airplanes so observatory investment goes off shore and so we get
to enjoy glaring and excessive lighting.
If that is your interpretation of my words, more words are unlikely to
change your mind. I am not prepared to challenge your claim of "30%" or
even your definition of "waste". We obviously disagree.
I object mostly to the simplistic views of those that impugn that which
has served us well for ages yet, only comparatively recently, declare
that it is "bad" or "wasted" or now constitutes "pollution".
Perhaps it because I am probably older than most of the vocal
environmentalists. I remember how things were and how far we have come.
Most frustrating is the knowledge that, no matter how far we have come
or how much we do currently in the realm of environmental protection and
conservation, it isn't enough - and it will never be enough.
IOW, they would bitch if they were hung with a NEW rope.
On Tue, 6 Jan 2009 23:25:58 -0800 (PST), terry
Ever been into an inner city area? Miami has an area called the
Pork-N-Beans projects, located about Liberty City. Adjacent to Little
Havana. The lights have an orange color, so people can see better into
Once in Liberty City I experienced a few locals that had bones pierced
through their noses. That was in daylight, can you imagine what the
night looks like there?
A 2002 DOE report found that outdoor lighting in the U.S. used 58,000+
gigawatt hours/year. 93% of that went for roadway and parking area lighting.
And, that total doesn't include night sports lighting, on-premise signs,
building floodlighting or landscape/decorative lighting.
There are certainly savings to be had no matter what you think about light
and crime or safety. For example, what about the wasted light -- that
portion that just goes directly up into the sky from poorly shielded
streetlights? That waste has been estimated at 30% of the total power used
by streetlighting by the International Dark-Sky Association. So, just
controlling the wasted light would save $1.7+ billion per year if the
electricity costs $.10/kWh. Depending upon the fuel used to generate the
energy, less oil or coal would be used and less C02 and other environmental
pollutants would be emitted.
So, at least reducing the wasted light that does no one any good seems like
a no-brainer plus, as others have said, turning off or dimming down some
streetlights late at night when traffic is light, especially on freeways,
makes sense too.
Streetlights can now be addressed individually via internet technology and
so dimmed down or turned off when not needed.
Some streetlighting is also excessively bright as the newer car headlights
have some 4X the light output of older headlights. Oddly enough,
headlighting doesn't seem to have been taken into account in the lighting
designs for most traffic streets and highways.
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