On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 8:47:22 AM UTC-5, KenK wrote:
To ~32. Insulation only slows down heat transfer, it doesn't stop it.
If you have no water flow, leave standing water in a pipe with insulation
on it long enough, it will freeze just like it would without insulation.
On Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 9:05:57 AM UTC-5, trader_4 wrote:
that is correct for the case the OP asked about where the insulation is wra
pped directly around the pipe. If the air around the pipe is under 32, th
e water will enetually freeze, insulation or not.
if this is indoors, a crawl space etc. and instead of wrapping the pipe i
tself, you instead install insulation as a barrier between the cold outsid
e and the warm inside, so that you can keep the air around the pipe above
32, that can keep the pipe from freezing.
Of course, this won't work at all if you are talking about a pipe that is o
utside or if there is no heat at all in the house.
It will not get colder than the surrounding temperature. But it will
take longer to get there. I'm sure it's not as effective as a
thermos bottle, which uses vacuum and reflection.
When I lived in JHS and HS in a ranch-style house, I always disliked
how long it took for the hot water to get from the far end of the
house to the bathroom.
So when I got my own house, a 2-story townhouse, one of the first
things I did was get that split sleeve stuff and put it on all the hot
water pipes in the basement. At least for me, who lives alone, who
might use the upstairs bathroom in the morning and not again until
dinner, certainly not before lunch, it did no good. The water was
usually cold again, and if not cold, then just warm. I couldn't
insulate the part inside the wall from the basement ceiling to 2nd
floor, but doing so wouldn't have made much difference in my shoes.
My one set of grand parents lived on second floor.
I remember her commenting how long it took to get
hot water. Of course, and instant tank under the
sink would have helped. She'd turn on the hot water,
walk away and do some thing, and come back. Must
have wasted a considerable lot of water.
I wrapped some over head pipes in the humid summer,
as they were right over my chemistry set, and I got
tired of them dripping on me.
On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 17:00:35 -0500, Stormin Mormon
If I had built my own home (something I had no interest in paying for,
but would have loved to have done myself) I suppose I would have
insulated the hot water pipes inside the walls.
Does anyone do that? I don't think it would help someone in my
shoes, but if the hot water is used ever hour or two, maybe it would.
My powder room hot water faucet is only 8 feet from my water heater,
so that's not a problem. And the cold water there goes near the
furnace, so in the winter, after two seconds of tepid, there are 4
seconds of hot, followed in a couple seconds by cold again.
Tired of waiting for hot water at our bathroom (sink furthest away from
the hot water heater) I bit the bullet and convinced SWMBO that this was
the way to go:
<(Amazon.com product link shortened)>
Watts circulating pump system that I saw on "Ask This Old House"
Rich Trethewy installed one in a residence and said it worked like a
charm. Ours has been going strong for about 4 years now. Simple
install if you are at all handy - took me about 2½ hours total. Mount a
diverter beneath the sink which allows the pump (mounted by the hot
water heater) to circulate hot continually (either continually or set
operating periods with the pump's built-in time) by pressurizing the hot
line and forcing the water through the diverter and back into the cold
line so you always have hot water ready to come out of the tap.
Only downside is that if you want cold water it takes a second or two to
get the hot out and then you have tepid water for about the same period
of time you might be begging for hot water if you didn't have the system
We like it. Price on Amazon is around $190 but when bought mine, I
found somebody selling brand new units for around $150 or.
I'd do it again in a NY instant.
A person should not have to go through life waiting for hot water.
I finally bit the bullet a few years ago and crawled under the house
and ran a 1/2 inch CPVC line from the HWT to the kitchen sink/dishwaher
in almost a straight shot. It replaced the old old old original steel
pipe with Gawd only knows how many ells and 45's and almost clogged from
deposits through the years. It was one of those things I should have
done 15 years earlier. I'd considered putting a small electric tank
under the counter but the new line solved the problem.
On Wednesday, December 16, 2015 at 10:44:52 AM UTC-5, My 2 Cents wrote:
Elbows and 45's hold very little water. Any improvement would be from
shortening the total length significantly. And if the old pipe was
restricted, going to a new larger diameter pipe only increases the time
for hot water to arrive.
I'm glad it worked so well.
My line to the kitchen sink is pretty straight. And the sink is about
20 feet from the WH, but if there's a wait, it doesn't bother me.
There are almost always things to do like getting other dishes to put
in the sink. (compared to the upstairs bathoom where I have nothing
to do but wait) AFA the dish washer goes, I don't know what
kind of water goes in that, except that when I was trying to find a
drain clog and putting the DW through the same cycle over and over,
the built-in heater eventually made the same water so hot that it bent
a plastic bowl!
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