water in basement (continued)

[Arkadiy]

Hi all.

So, I am about to give up :(

I've been pumping water out of my basement every evening for two weeks now (following NE two weeks ago). The water is still comming back. Every rainy day sets me about 5 days back (in my basement water condition). It looks water table is not going anywhere any time soon.

So I am almost about to pay big bucks for something to be done in my basement.

My basment is unfinished and consists of crawl space and another space

6 feet high, deeper in the ground. The floor is concrete, and it is not even (I have to pump out of three different spots now).

One of contractors suggests 2 separate systems -- one for the crawl space and one for the another space -- each one with sump pump and french drain. He is saying that two systems are nesessary because the different floor level, and the french drain is especially necessary since the floor is not even. He is asking $7000 for this work.

I am in NJ.

Do you think what he suggested to be done is reasonable?

Do you think the price is reasonable? How is it affected with the fact that the work seems urgent?

Thanks for any advice.

Arkadiy

[Arkadiy]

Hi all.

So, I am about to give up :(

I've been pumping water out of my basement every evening for two weeks now (following NE two weeks ago). The water is still comming back. Every rainy day sets me about 5 days back (in my basement water condition). It looks water table is not going anywhere any time soon.

So I am almost about to pay big bucks for something to be done in my basement.

My basment is unfinished and consists of crawl space and another space

6 feet high, deeper in the ground. The floor is concrete, and it is not even (I have to pump out of three different spots now).

One of contractors suggests 2 separate systems -- one for the crawl space and one for the another space -- each one with sump pump and french drain. He is saying that two systems are nesessary because the different floor level, and the french drain is especially necessary since the floor is not even. He is asking $7000 for this work.

I am in NJ.

Do you think what he suggested to be done is reasonable?

Do you think the price is reasonable? How is it affected with the fact that the work seems urgent?

Thanks for any advice.

Arkadiy

[Toller]

It sounds like you posted all the details earlier. For those of us who don't remember it, can you repost?

[Arkadiy]

2 weeks ago, during the noreaster, my basement got flooded (about a foot of water). I don't have a sump pump, and during previous five years (I bought the house 5 years ago) everything was mostly allright, although once I saw a small pool of water sipping through the floor. I wiped it off then, and that was it. Apparently everything was more or less OK during the previous 40 years since the house was built.

I use a utility pump to get rid of water, but the water keeps comming back through the floor (apparently because of the raised water table). The first five days since the main event were dry and hot, so I almost got rid of water, but then there was one more rainy day, and again I had about 3 in of water... Now, three days later, I am down to half an inch, but tomorrow, according to the forcast, is gonna rain again :(

Also I have a separate crawl space, and even though it's floor level is higher, there is more water in the lowest part of it...

Thanks for any advice, Arkadiy

[Arkadiy]

Here is the link to the original discussion:

Thanks, Arkadiy

[Dan Espen]

I'm NJ too. I had the french drains put in years ago. They will solve the problem.

The price seems reasonable. In NJ most people had Vulcan calling them all the time. This was before telemarketing went completely out of control and I called them when I decided to have the work done. I can't remember what I paid but this was in the 70s.

When you see the amount of work it takes the price will seem more reasonable.

Some things to consider. They may want to hook up to the sanitary system. Don't let them, in most places that's illegal. Discuss that before hand.

If you might have radon issues, consider that. They will be opening the slab to air infiltration. It may agravate radon penetration and you might later have to have the system sealed.

[Toller]

Do you have close neighbors? What is going on with them? Do you have a storm sewer to pump into? If not, do you have anywhere to pump to?

[Arkadiy]

Most people do have sump pumps. But they have not worked in years, so some of them happen to be out of order, and those basements also got flooded...

I can't answer this question -- got to figure out the answer yet...

Thanks, Arkadiy

[Arkadiy]

Thanks.

How do I know if I have rodon issues? 5 years ago, during the inspection, the rodon level was normal...

[hallerb]

does your homes basement sit above the level of the street?

rephrased is there somewhere to drain the water too?

[Dan Espen]

Any houses in your area with Radon levels that needed remediation would be one clue.

[Toller]

Knowing what you can do with the water is obviously very important. Find that out before talking to contractors. Pumping water up 2' is very different than pumping it up 10'.

I would be real reluctant to spend $7,000 to fix a problem that happens every 15 years, especially with an unfinished basement. If you can wait a while, the price ought to come down.

A sump pump (maybe two) might solve your problem. They should be under $1,000 each, depending on where the water has to go. They might not handle the floods you had this year, but it is possible that the $7000 fix wouldn't have handled it either. Talk to your neighbors to find out what was, and what wasn't, adequate.

I find it real hard to believe that drains are necessary in the crawl space. If you are pumping water out of the basement the crawl space shouldn't see much water. But there might be a good reason for it; we can't see your house...

[mm]

P&M

I'm not sure what kind of utility pump you are using, but instead of pumping in the evening, why don't you buy a sump pump and pump all day and all night long. The pump will turn off when the water level gets to an inch or two. I think you can buy a pedestal pump or a submersillble sump pump and both will work the same basically.

You don't need a sump to use a sump pump if there is water in the whole basement.

I'm sure you can use flexible hose, perhaps the same hose you are using now, and clamp it on to the output with a radiator hose clamp.

I'm not saying this will solve your problem, but you won't have to tend to the pump, and you won't feel like you are in such a rush with only an inch or two in the basement. You may be able to channel the water from the crawlspace to the six foot basement area, but you'lve probably already done that.

When you solve this problem, however you do it, you can take your sump pump and put it in (one of?) your sumps. So it won't cost you a thing.

I would turn it on and run it for a half hour without leaving the house the first time. And don't plug it in or unplug it when you are standing in water. I hope you are turning your current pump on and off safely, so whatever you are doing for that you can probably do for this one.

That won't be true if you pump 24 hours a day.

That's all I have for now.

[mm]

If you didn't have it in the first test, especially if was a 5-day test and not a 12 hour test, you probably don't have it now.

Except for the point he makes that if you cut a hole for the sump, maybe more will slip through.

They sell radon test kits at hardware stores, including Home Depot etc. The good ones (at least 20 years ago) had to stay in the basement for several days, then had to be sent away in the envelope provided where they would process the test. I don't remember how long this takes in practice. Probably less now.

I think what they do now often is put the radon removal fan vent in the sump. I saw that once.

But don't get too worried. Only what 10% of houses have radon, or more, or fewer. I don't remember but it's nowhere near a majority even. Still this would be a good time to run one more test if you are going to cut all the way through your floor.

Because a complete floor keeps the radon out, right? It only gets in through cracks if there are some, and sumps. Right?

[mm]

In my n'hood, everyone with a below grade basement had to have a sump pump, the law. everyone, in 1979, who had a basement which was at ground level, which in our case was just at one end of the basement (to the back yard), didn't get a sump pump. I don't know if any of them added one.

Where does your utility pump pump to?

[scott21230]

Without pictures, it's hard to say for sure, but ti does sound reasonable. Sounds like whatever is happening is gettign worse over time. My only question is to (given the age of the home) if the outside concrete has been waterproffed lately. It probably needs it if it hasn't been done in a long time. I'd try that first.

[Goedjn]

You're doing treatment without diagnosis. Where is the water coming from, and where is it going? Where would you like it to go instead?

[Arkadiy]

I agree :(

But who is going to provide such diagnostics (except the people interested in doing the work)?

The water seems to be comming from below, because the ground is saturated and the water table is high... But this is only a guess.

There are some bad areas outside the house, with the concreet pavement sloped in the wrong directions, where the water is gathering during the rain. Can be the problem, but again, I am not sure, and I can't fix it easily to try...

If the water is pumped out, I would like it to go to the street, where I am pumping it out now.

Thanks, Arkadiy

[Arkadiy]

Yes, most of them have sump pumps.

On the street?

[Arkadiy]

It's definitely closer to 2' than to 10' :)

Here is my concern -- I am afraid for the floor which is currently exposed to wery high humidity. I can't provide appropriate ventilation -- I have only one tiny window in the whole basement area. I don't know how dangerous it is. If not, I would wait untill things dry out, and then decide what to do.

Here is the question: if there is a sump pump, how does the water get to it? Through the floor serfice or under it, before reaching the floor level? I got the impression that it goes through the floor serfice (or french drain on this surface).

Thanks, Arkadiy