vinyl siding primer, latex or oil?

[rg]

Benjamin Moore dealer recomended their 100% acrylic latex primer (fresh start). They said it was a bonding primer and did not require bonding additive (emulsabond). I tested it on a small area, brushing it out real thin and within hours in direct sunlight I could not scratch it off with with my fingernail. So I went ahead and did a small area (front and sides of a dormer) but two days later I was able to scratch it off fairly easily, I was dissappointed. The only difference was that I put it on heavier. Note: not too heavy, I know how to paint and prime, a nice even coat. I called BM and they said that I should expect to be able to scratch any latex coating for at least a weak, maybe up to four weeks. But it was ok to go ahead and paint. So I put a base coat over the primer and its' been about a week and I can still scratch it easily. This has not been my experiance over the years. So I tested an area with BM oil primer and it seems to be sticking like glue. The oil primer was tested strait and thinned some and alothough the the thinned drys faster they seem to stick equally well.

Am I making too much of this and just trust BM and go ahead with the latex primer, maybe thinning with water some?

Should I just bite the bullet and do it in oil?

What do you guys think?

BM recommends against thinning any of their products.

Conditions have been good weather sunny and dry.

I know the siding is clean, I did it myself with TSP and a sponge, rag, and brush by hand

I tested and area after using a chemical de-glosser (will-bond) and the results were no better

Paint is BM MooreGuard

[RicodJour]

You don't need primer on vinyl siding at all. Just clean the vinyl well (plenty of rinsing), put Emulsabond in the first coat and you're good to go. I assume you're painting with a lighter color paint - vinyl siding painted a dark color can have problems with warping and expansion in direct sun. I would not use oil paint because it yellows more than latex and does not have the elastic properties of latex - particularly important with vinyl siding.

R

[h]

Always use oil-based primer. Since that is no longer available (at least around here), switch to solid coat stain. That's what I did when oil-based paints were banned. No peeling, no problems.

[RicodJour]

This link might interest you:

Paint is one of those things where the more you pay the better product you get. Visit the Sherwin Williams web site and check out some of their latex/urethane paints. Good stuff.

R

[h]

Ignore the above. I thought you were painting wood.

[Blattus Slafaly]

The purpose of vinyl is NOT TO HAVE TO PAINT in my mind. Painting your vinyl siding is a big mistake. It will look like crap in a few years.

I remember being in line at Home Depot one time buying forest green vinyl shutters. A lady behind me ask if I was going to paint them. I thought, where did this nut case come from? I said, why would I paint them when they come in all colors?

I have no use for painting.

[RicodJour]

What if it looks like crap now? You'd rather live in a house that looks like crap than spend some time and money and live in a house with a color you liked?

You also, obviously, have never painted vinyl or aluminum siding. If done right, they can take and hold paint for years - longer than wood siding will.

R

[jim]

The guy who installed my windows was asked about quoting for new vinyl siding. It was faded and looked terrible. He said I could pay him a load of cash to remove the old and install the new or I could just paint it. I cleaned the siding with TSP and pressure washer. I let it dry a week. I used Benjamin Moore 100% acrylic flat. No primer. I made sure I lifted out the siding overlap painting in 2" underneath for expansion. The finish was that good it's hard to determine if it's wood or vinyl. 5 years later - no peeling or fading. Can clean it with a pressure washer. Looks great and I saved a load of cash. BTW I anticipate I will get longer out of this paint job than if I painted over wood siding.

[Blattus Slafaly]

The next time it needs painting how you gonna scrape that vinyl?

[Red Green]

"h" wrote in news:g8mics$e9l$ [e-mail]:

Curious - where are you located? I had heard it was banned in CA I think.

[RicodJour]

With a scraper or a wire brush.

You're basing imagined problems based on something you've never done.

R

[h]

Upstate NY

[Red Green]

"h" wrote in news:g8pccl$p85$ [e-mail]:

For you or anyone in the group,...

If you are where oil base is banned what do you use when you need oil base primer?

Where I've had to use it is priming where it's been wallpapered or whenever the outer drywall layer seems to be prone to bubbling.

[h]

I switched my exterior to stain and we have only wallpaper and stained woodwork inside, so no need for primer (ceilings are just re-painted white every few years).

[RicodJour]

What do you do that you need to paint your ceilings every few years?

R

[h]

??? When I redecorate a room I always paint the ceiling. Why not? It's not like it takes more than half an hour with a paint stick.

[RicodJour]

You're exaggerating a bit on the amount of time, and neither paint nor time is free, but I wasn't questioning the time element. What is wrong with the ceiling paint that you have to redo it? The way you make it sound it would be similar to taking the dishes out of the cupboard and rewashing them even though they haven't been used. You know, a waste of time.

R

[h]

Well...the last time I painted the kitchen ceiling (16x20) it took 30 minutes plus 25 minutes to clean the paint stick. I repaint whenever I want to change the color of "white" that I'm using or if the ceiling just looks dingy. Kitchen and bathroom ceilings, for example, get painted much more often than any other ceilings simply because of their exposure to steam, etc., even though I use semi-gloss on the ceilings in those rooms. It's not that the ceilings are grimy, since we've never allowed anyone to smoke in our house, it's just that they are no longer "bright". However, washing a ceiling is more work than vacuuming and re-painting it, and it's a lot messier to wash than repaint with a paint stick. Hell, you don't even need to move the furniture or use a drop cloth with a paint stick. Only down side to the stick is that it takes almost as long to clean it properly as it does to paint the ceiling.

[Oren]

Another downside --- We have textured walls and ceilings. Sprayed on and knocked down (style/pattern). Multiple coats of paint changes the texture look.

I don't have an issue with that.

[KLS]

In my book, Rico is right: why repaint the ceiling unless you have an actual patch to cover? Can't you use your time, energy, and materials elsewhere in your house?