plug-in "permanent" house wiring

Perhaps the installation of a flanged inlet at the UPS location would give you the ability to use permanent wiring in the wall. I'm not sure what wire size you need, but they come in 15 and 20 amp and perhaps 30 amp straight blade and twistlock.. Depending on the inlet configuration that you use, you might need to make your own cord set-up to connect the flanged inlet to your UPS. At the third floor location you could just have a regular receptacle or something different like a twistlock to indicate that it's special.

Reply to
John Grabowski
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You don't want to have a male plug to male plug extension. Instead of a duplex in the basement, you'd use a motor plug, which is an outlet(inlet), that has male prongs to receive the female end of your extension cord

Voila, you

Reply to
RBM

"What planet do I come from?" Let's try a planet where people use numbers instead of emotions to make decisions.

A search for "rack mount ups" at froogle.com sorted by relevance prices the five most relevant at: $825, $440, $490, $504 and $650

I clicked on the first one and it has a "670W Nominal Output Power", and provides about 20 minutes of standby time at half load (325W) which hardly seems excessive. My "kill-a-watt" meter puts my power usage at just under 400W so I would get a little less than 20 minutes with new batteries in the unit and less once the batteries age.

If you take the cheapest unit at $440 and pretend the wiring cost was $140 you come to a $300 initial savings. If your discount rate is 8% and the project life span is 10 years $300*1.08^10=$647.58.

$647.58 saved based on initial cost alone

Then take a look at batteries:

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the manufacturer states that they are good from 3-5 years. This makes since because it matches the life expectancy of lead-acid car batteries and also matches my personal experience.

If the cost of the batteries+shipping for the unit is $50+ (and it is more) two replacements over a 10 year life expectancy will add another $100 or so to the total cost.

We are up to $747.58. If the additional UPS uses only 20W and 10W for cooling 30W at $0.10 per kWh over 10 years comes to $263 which brings us to about $1010 difference. If the space is free and somehow I have overestimated by $260 we are still talking about a $750 difference.

If my math is wrong, please show me. Otherwise please help with my ORIGINAL question. ... and NO ... I am not switching from rack mount equipment to non-rack mount for a whole variety of reasons that are even more off the topic of home repair than I have been drawn to by the erroneous responses about UPS system TCO. Please answer the original electrical question!

PS: I do have systems at a hosting facility. These systems do not need to be at a colocation facility or they would be. JEEESH!!!!

Reply to
William.Deans

Thank you very much David, John, and RMB for attempting to help me create a NEC complaint installation. I am going to proceed with project "central UPS" as one poster put it. I am going to use a red plate and a label from a labeling machine which states the receptacle is connected to the basement UPS. I will use twist lock flanged connectors (in the basement) and 12 AWG wire throughout.

One line explanations for hecklers: ===================================== Anti-rackmount coalition: I have clients because I give them what they want. People who don't believe in discount rates: The miracle of compound interest is real and I don't actually mind your disbelief because someone has to pay all that interest. UPS TCO math: I elaborated in my Pete C. reply post. Derby Dad: I'll be sure and eat the high-fiber box to after consuming the cereal contained therein.

Reply to
William.Deans

Reply to
DerbyDad03

I don't recall saying anything about your fiber intake. I did, however, ask a question about the code compliancy of your beautifully finished attic.

Reply to
DerbyDad03

Simpler than any of the above:

buy another damn $39 ups. jeeeeeeze...

steve

Reply to
Steve Barker LT

I use numbers as well, not emotions.

Rack mount UPS = same guts as non rack mount UPS in a rack mount case for 2X the price. Try a non rack mount UPS on a $20 rack shelf, that's what I've used for years and it performs perfectly.

Again, you are not making rational choices for the UPS, you're going on cosmetics. You can get a perfectly acceptable Trip-Lite brand 1KVA UPS at Costco for $100 add a rack shelf from another source for $20 and you're done.

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First off, *never* buy replacement UPS batteries from the UPS manufacturer, they are severely overpriced. Get replacement UPS batteries from a local wholesale battery distributor, where they are much cheaper for the same battery. I've used Mid State Battery in the past and a set for a UPS rarely exceeded $40 with tax. The UPS is out of warranty at that point so it's not like you have to use the "branded" batteries to maintain warranty.

Car batteries operate under very different conditions from UPS batteries. Car batteries cycle from freezing temperatures to 150 degree temperatures and back in the winter. Car batteries don't sit on a float charger most of their life. Car batteries are called upon to produce several hundred amps for 30 seconds and then recharge. There is pretty much no valid comparison between UPS battery life and car battery life.

Again the life expectancy you are going by is not correct. It may be a good number for a large corporation to use when replacing batteries in hundreds of UPSes, but it's silly for a home user where you have a couple UPSes and can easily load / runtime test them annually. As I noted, the batteries in my big (1.42KVA) UPS are a decade old and still performing perfectly under load.

The standby consumption is the only place you're even close to reality, and the $2.19/mo is pretty insignificant.

If you want to waste money for some sort of ego / cosmetic reasons, by all means feel free to do so, certainly people waste money of far more silly things. Don't try to "cook the books" to try to justify the extra cost for cosmetics as some sort of savings though.

My central server, network gear and a few other extraneous items along with the big UPS are in a standard equipment rack in my garage. The rack is used and was free, most of the equipment in it is not rack mount and is on rack mount shelves, though the main ethernet switch is rack mount.

As for the original question:

NEC Article 645.10 "Disconnecting means" indicates that a means of disconnecting power to all electronic equipment in the information technology room must be provided as well as similar disconnecting means for HVAC and closing smoke / fire dampers, and the controls must be grouped and located at the principle exit doors.

NEC Article 645.11 indicates that a UPS of 750VA or lower capacity installed within the information technology room is exempt from article

645.10 disconnecting means requirements.

These are the sections of the NEC that reference UPS systems, and clearly aren't intended to be applied to a residential environment. There are other articles for separately derived systems and multiple power sources, none of which are directly applicable.

Ultimately it comes down to the discretion of your local building official (AHJ) to interpret and apply the code and their own expertise to determine what they will require / accept. Since there is no directly applicable NEC code you are entirely at their mercy as to what they'll let you do.

The AHJ may simply insist you use a separate UPS so that the disconnecting means are clearly recognizable to the local fire department responding to your server fire. They may accept the remote outlets if the connections are entirely isolated in separate conduit from the regular household circuits. It's entirely up to the AHJ and nobody on the 'net can give you the precise answer.

The NEC is available online for your review, someone posted the link here recently I believe.

That's nice. Do you have a backup generator to keep things online for more than the ~20 minutes of the UPS(es)? If not, that's a better place to spend money than purty racks.

Reply to
Pete C.

The use of flexible cord as part of the permanent wiring system of a building is tightly constrained by the US NEC. Connecting alternative power sources to circuits is not a use the code writers permitted and in the absence of a specific permitted use it may not be used as permanent wiring. Here is how you do what you want to do and still be code compliant. This is the same connection scheme that will pass inspection for supplying hard wired appliances such as heating equipment from a portable generator.

You install a box that is equipped with a double pole double throw (DPDT) switch that has a center off position. The switch should be rated for the ampacity of the circuit. The two center terminals on each side of the switch are the commons of each pole. Those common terminals will supply the circuit to the third floor which will terminate in an appropriate receptacle outlet. The two terminals that are connected to the common when the switch is in it's up position will be connected to the circuits normal source of supply. The other two terminals will be connected to a flanged inlet which is a recessed male plug that you will install beside the DPDT switch either in the same J-box or one immediately adjacent to it. A regular cord of the same configuration as the UPS receptacle outlet will connect between the receptacle on the UPS and the flanged inlet on the junction box. In that way the flexible cord is not part of the permanent wiring and you can transfer the circuit to it's regular supply when the UPS needs servicing.

It will be argued that the flanged inlet and the use of the double pole switch is overkill and that the same function can be accomplished by just terminating the flexible cord into the j-box and using a common three way switch. That is not true however because the three way switch will bypass the TVSS protection that is built into the UPS because the circuits neutral will not pass through the UPS under UPS operation.

A common three way switch will also allow the transfer of the load from regular power to UPS too quickly. If it is a continuous duty UPS it may have an output waveform that is out of phase with the utility power. Being only an electrician myself I can only tell you that we were taught during apprenticeship training that could be harmful to some loads. That information may not be up to date because modern computers may be more tolerant of such power fluctuations then the ones in service when I was in training low these many years ago.

-- Tom Horne

Reply to
Tom Horne

The additional rules are that the receptacle outlet and the equipment served should be labeled as having more than one source of supply.

The cord may be of any length you find convenient but cords longer then six feet are generally frowned on for permanent use.

If you do what I suggested in my other reply you will simply throw the switch to the non alternate power position and walk away.

-- Tom Horne

Reply to
Tom Horne

Fair enough.

To the best of my knowledge it is electrical code complaint so long as it is not considered a bedroom (it doesn't have arc-fault protection.) There may also be more than 5% voltage drop if you fully loaded the existing circuit (but that is a FPN).

Reply to
William.Deans

This is a great way to "clean up" after the project concludes. I will reply in your other post.

Reply to
William.Deans

Greetings Mr Horne:

a) I will try to limit the flexible cord length to 6 ft and run more conduit if necessary. b) I like the DPDT idea very much!

Thanks again Tom!

--William

PS: At first glance this is an expensive switch:

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but I am sure I can find a cheaper version. The appliance control DPDT switches are very reasonable.

Reply to
William.Deans

My assumption is that one uses a UPS to avoid power interruptions, giving you a short time to safely save data and shut down. How is a system that you have to manually throw a switch, assuming you are even there at the time, going to help?

Reply to
RBM

Once again, I am feeling misunderstood.

My original question was not limited to NEC compliancy. I also asked about egress and any other codes that might be applicable to the intended use of the space: height of sloped walls, joist sizing for live loads plus furniture, ventilation, etc.

I don't really care if it's code compliant in all areas - that's your choice - and as I've said before, making it NEC compliant is commendable, especially from a safety perspective. I'm just curious as to whether or not you've put as much effort into all the other codes that might apply as you seem to be to putting into the UPS connections.

Reply to
DerbyDad03

Maybe, but you won'thave two ups's using electricity all the time. OTOH, I turn off my UPS when I'm not at the computer. If I don't the thing gets pretty hot, all wasted energy.

Reply to
mm

I don't know. I"ve heard that electricity travels at the speed of light.

Of course that would be the speed of light in copper. I held a lamp up to; one side of a copper sheet, and it hasn't gotten through to the other side yet. Should I wait another hour?

Reply to
mm

Then why is my one-computer UPS so hot if I leave it on while not using the computer. Not just in one spot, but over the entire top surface and some of the sides.

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Reply to
mm

Greetings Pete,

Your math is wrong. It uses prices for non-rackmount equipment and generics. This is not the class of equipment which I am using for this installation. I know you have strong pro-generic anti-rackmount feelings but please try to put them aside. This is not what all my clients like to see me use even in the dev environment and they are right by definition.

Insisting on rack mount / name brand equipment does not equate to cooking the books. Period. Your entire argument stems from the fact that I could do it cheaper if I used non-rack mount generics. You have not pointed out a math error! Lawyers could probably drastically reduce their clothing / dry cleaning costs if they wore jeans and a white t-shirt but clients wouldn't like it. When client perception is taken into account it is cheaper to pay for the suits.

Yes. I have a backup generator and speaking of backup generators with "central UPS" I can simply plug this generator into the power inlet in the basement through the basement window (indirectly by plugging the central UPS into the generator). Without "central UPS" I have to run the generator cord in through the basement window and then snake it up three flights of stairs with extension cords!

That said, thank you for your NEC notes.

--William

Reply to
William.Deans

Greetings Steve --- I believe my reply to Pete also addresses your post:

" Greetings Pete,

Your math is wrong. It uses prices for non-rackmount equipment and generics. This is not the class of equipment which I am using for this installation. I know you have strong pro-generic anti-rackmount feelings but please try to put them aside. This is not what all my clients like to see me use even in the dev environment and they are right by definition.

Insisting on rack mount / name brand equipment does not equate to cooking the books. Period. Your entire argument stems from the fact that I could do it cheaper if I used non-rack mount generics. You have not pointed out a math error! Lawyers could probably drastically reduce their clothing / dry cleaning costs if they wore jeans and a white t-shirt but clients wouldn't like it. When client perception is taken into account it is cheaper to pay for the suits.

Yes. I have a backup generator and speaking of backup generators with "central UPS" I can simply plug this generator into the power inlet in the basement through the basement window (indirectly by plugging the central UPS into the generator). Without "central UPS" I have to run the generator cord in through the basement window and then snake it up three flights of stairs with extension cords!

That said, thank you for your NEC notes.

--William "

Reply to
William.Deans

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