OT: Public transport

Correct both things can be true: on average religious people have lower IQs than non-religious, a religious person is more intelligent than CK.

In fact I'd argue the latter is highly likely.

IQ is highly dodgy. You can train people to do better at it and it also assumes a certain type of (western) education so cannot be an ubiquitous measure of intelligence. It is also a relative score where "average" normalised to 100 so is highly dependent on what is determined to be "average".

Don't think it is. The expanding universe is pretty well established.

Hardly. This is simply scientific debate of two opposing views given the same scientific evidence. He admitted he was wrong ultimately. The opposite of religious dogma.

I like to equate this also with Maxwell's Equations. Other people's equations all seemed to work together as a funtional unit except for one small problem. Like four meshed gears with one gear missing some teeth. Maxwell 'patched' this problem with 'displacement current' and everything fell into place.

IMO there is nothing wrong with creating a fudge factor which works and then trying to validate its mathematical or physical existence or determine its numerical value.

Interesting snippet here:-

On Nov 3, 2023 at 12:59:38 AM MST, "Chris" wrote <ui299a$2mre3$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

Do not recall details, and did not look much into it, but some of the Webb observations did not fit expectations and might shift thinking. Doing some brief research now there are questions about how to interpret the data the Webb telescope is offering (questions about how we handle opacity) and it is not seen as a big change... at least for now.

Exactly. Science has knowledge without certainty... religion has certainty without knowledge.

On Nov 3, 2023 at 12:58:35 AM MST, "Chris" wrote <ui297b$2mr4r$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

I would agree that fits the evidence.

Absolutely agree... and since the test is defined by 100 being average, that has had to change over the years. The average IQ of the US has gone up significantly in the last 100 or so years and that has led to the tests being adjusted. When people look at less well off places and say the IQ is lower and then insist that is tied to genetics they are showing a severe lack of understanding of the history of the test.

I still think that there is another, as yet undiscovered, reason for large scale doppler effects. IMO steady-state is not dead.

On Nov 2, 2023 at 7:50:59 PM MST, "rbowman" wrote snipped-for-privacy@mid.individual.net>:

Growing up as a Reform Jew, I know there is a large push on education in the community. There is a reason Jews tend to have a higher rate of doctors, lawyers, scientists, etc. But Reform Judaism is more of a moral / social group than a "strong" religion. Being an atheist is quite common, and few Reform Rabbis I met had a view of God even similar to what is in the Torah (roughly what many would call the Old Testament). The focus is on helping to make the world a better place... and it is why American Jews tend to be liberal (at least Reform ones). Tend... of course there are exceptions.

With that type religion there is no real need to compartmentalize. There is also reason to question if you could really call it a religion, at least in my view. LOL!

Largely to match the existing theory that the universe was constant. Then we learned more and the science grew.

This is how science works. People have their own ideas and they get tested. Does not mean people are perfect... of course individuals can get "stuck" on their idea being the right one... but over time science grows and changes to match the evidence.

To me it is interesting that the models are really about predicting and controlling. They need not be "right" in terms of whatever the universe really is. Newton's Laws still work amazingly well... but Relativity shows them to not be 100% accurate. Quantum Physics is amazingly useful but is contrary to Relativity in some areas. Does not mean any of these models are bad -- they all work VERY well. But we clearly have more to learn.

My #1 principle: the Universe is not limited to my ability to understand it.

As you note, he rejected the idea as he learned more. Did Lemaître reject Christ as he learned more? (Rhetorical question).

Snit formulated on Friday :

No, average 'for the data set' will always be 100.

Comparing two sets is wrong-headed.

On Nov 3, 2023 at 6:57:41 AM MST, "FromTheRafters" wrote <ui2u8s$2q5lu$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

Exactly. But people DO compare. And in some cases there is SOME value... but they do it poorly.

It's good to keep an open mind.

There is *SO* much we could all talk about here on Usenet. I'm always keen to hear your personal views.

I could do with a little less tikkun olam.

On Nov 3, 2023 at 5:26:38 PM MST, "rbowman" wrote snipped-for-privacy@mid.individual.net>:

Less? For me this has been a key idea... I work to help people. I think it is likely tied to some extent to my Jewish background.

Moderation is censorship and inherently wrong.

You like spam?

Are you really Vladimir Putin?

I don't have a messiah complex. Un some cases 'help' is straight forward. For example I contribute to the local food bank. I don't participate in the distribution but hopefully it's without an agenda. Drunk, stones, PTSD, whatever, a person in need of food assistance should have it available. Dorothy Day of the Catholic Worker movement, was criticized by the bishop for providing shelter to those in need without judgment.

Too often 'help' has strings or preconditions and is an attempt tp 'improve' the person being helped. Liberals certainly have an idea of how the world should be and try to impose it on everyone in the guise of 'help'. It is hubris, pure and simple.

In any event, government censorship is wrong. Private entities naturally censor speech. Everything from me controlling what's said in my own home, to film studios preventing scriptwriters from using the word "f*ck", to newspapers deciding which letters to the editor they will publish, and so on.

alt.home.repair will never be moderated. Anybody who wants moderation should go to Facebook or something.

do you have big t*ts cindy

You must watch different films than i do. iirc it was '69 when I went to a Jefferson Airplane concert. Gracie Slick got the ball rolling by asking, very innocently, 'Is it legal to say "f*ck" in Albany New York?' It probably wasn't but the cops didn't haul her away.