# Load capacity of 200-amp panel

On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 22:28:14 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

and it would need to be a 3 phase panel - which would NOT be a 240 volt service. (It would be 208 in most cases)
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So the question was never answered. What do you call a panel with a dual main breaker 200/200. Is that called a 200 Amp service or a 400 Amp service? M
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On Saturday, June 25, 2016 at 11:23:00 PM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

It's a 200 amp service. But check in with Claire, the village idiot. If he says it's 400, then you know for double sure that it's 200.
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wrote in message
So the question was never answered. What do you call a panel with a dual main breaker 200/200. Is that called a 200 Amp service or a 400 Amp service? M
When you say dual breaker do you mean dual pole are two separate breaker (Confusing isn't) If your Breaker is dual pole 200 amp. (Breakers do come in single, double, triple and 4 poles) If you are home owner and you are going to use only 120 volts it is 400 amp. service If you are going to use only 220/240 then it is 200 amp service
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On Sunday, June 26, 2016 at 2:12:55 PM UTC-4, Tony944 wrote:

So, if you needed capacity for 400A of 120V loads in a facility, you'd call up the power company and request a 400A service? Buy a 400A panel?
In my world that's still a 200A service from the power company, using a cable that supports 200A, using a 200A panel. There is never more than 200A flowing into the facility.
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On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 22:50:27 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

The triplin harmonic problem is on 3p wye (typically 120/208v) but there is another configuration where you will have 120/240 (center tapped delta). It is basically a regular 120/240 transformer with one (or rarely two) other transformers providing the 3d phase. This is what 120/240 delta looks like from the ground, using 2 transformers. If you look around a light industrial bay area or other customers who need some 3P but mostly 120/240 loads. The 3d leg is 208 above ground and you have 240 between phases.
http://gfretwell.com/electrical/red%20leg%20transformers.jpg
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wrote in message wrote:

and it would need to be a 3 phase panel - which would NOT be a 240 volt service. (It would be 208 in most cases)
That would be incorrect it could have 208, 220, 240, or 270 it all depend on costumer setup, in most cases through out heavy industries 270 is standard but for Homers use it floats 208-240. Some chip organization may use one leg of 480 for 240 & Neutral. when you work with industrial people do not take anything for granted!
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Typical 480v 3p will be wye connected and the line to neutral will be 277 (close to that 270 you posted). That is very common in office buildings for lighting loads. 480 delta is as likely to be ungrounded or impedance grounded as any other configuration. That will be a very special installation, like a glass plant or some other place where a ground fault shutdown would be disastrous. The first fault is free ;-) It requires special ground fault monitor devices to be sure it stays ungrounded. If you wanted 240 line to neutral you would need center tapped 480, which I have never heard of or corner grounded 240 delta. That will look exactly like a single phase installation to the uneducated eye. (2 hots and a grounded neutral but it is 3 phase). I see that in sewer lift pumps where there is not really any line to neutral loads and they can use cheaper switch gear since there are only 2 ungrounded legs to protect.
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"notX" wrote in message wrote:
[snip]

In other words there is 200A here (one ungrounded conductor) and 200A there (the other ungrounded conductor) and 0A (the difference between the two, never more than 200A) in the grounded conductor. NEVER 400A anywhere.
That would be correct!!!!!!!
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On Saturday, June 25, 2016 at 11:24:26 PM UTC-4, Tony944 wrote:

Then you now agree your previous post was incorrect? Where you posted this:
"Each "leg" of 120 Volt, will give max. 200 amps. assuming that neutral is rated for 400 amps. "
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On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 19:01:51 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

Arguing any point of fact with trader is a total waste of time and bandwidth, and means I have to see his (reposted) drivel.
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On Saturday, June 25, 2016 at 6:18:45 PM UTC-4, Tony944 wrote:

Ah schucks, don't just go away on us like that. I was looking forward to you explaining this:

You see many 200 amp services where the two hots are sized for 200 amps and the neutral is sized for 400 amps? Where do you buy that cable? There is never more than 200 amps in any conductor. Nor does there have to be to support 400 amps of 120V load on a 240V, 200A service.
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On 6/25/2016 3:18 PM, Tony944 wrote:

This is true.
15 years ago, a so-called "scientist" with a radio show and a doctorate degree, was advocating for the local utility to manage power shortages by installing a device on power poles that connected all the 120V loads, in both legs, together, which would turn off all the 240V loads (A/C, pool pumps, dryers, stoves, ovens, etc.). One 120V leg would power all the 120V outlets.
As one person pointed out, that would cause a lot of old houses to burn down since the neutral in older houses was not designed to carry these loads, since builders saved money by using smaller neutral conductors. With a balanced load in each leg, there is relatively little current flowing in the neutral. Newer houses have a neutral that can handle the "maximum unbalanced load."
"Scientists tinkering with electric switches at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory may have found a way to prevent blackouts across California. Researchers at the lab in the past week have successfully tested a simple electric switching device that could be placed on thousands of power poles around the state, shutting off partial power to homes and businesses during Stage 3 alerts in hot summer months, while keeping some lights on."
Fortunately, PG&E was not foolish enough to take these "scientists" seriously.
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This post is 7 years old, he probably has burned his house down by now or else the AC is working.
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On Friday, June 24, 2016 at 9:28:26 PM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@att.net wrote:

i was the poster talking about my neighbor with the griswald christmas light display.
i have sad news to report. jerry my neigbor was a smoker, he died from lung cancer. it was a slow cruel way to go, including a unsucccessful attempt at suicide.
worse his 16 year old son watched his dad die
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wrote in message
This post is 7 years old, he probably has burned his house down by now or else the AC is working.
No is not the same little different!
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On Thursday, October 22, 2009 at 12:02:51 PM UTC-4, JayB wrote:

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I own a tanning salon and want to add couple more beds.. however I only hav e a 200 amp service. We currently have 5 tanning beds, all are running on 2 40v, when we checked with all the beds on the amp draw at the main was 196 amps. When I then turned our towels dryer on the amp draw was 216 amps, but it did not trip the breaker. In addition we have all the other lights and central air and curling irons turning on and off etc etc. So how far past the 200 amps can I go before it will trip? The tanning beds only run for 20 mins.. so even if all the beds are on at the same time they never are all on for longer the 20 mins at a time so being past the 200 amps is only cons istant for 20 mins. So could someone please give me an idea how far past t he 200 amps I can go so I know if I can add another bed or 2? Thanks!
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wrote in message
On Thursday, October 22, 2009 at 12:02:51 PM UTC-4, JayB wrote:

___________________________________________________________________________
I own a tanning salon and want to add couple more beds.. however I only have a 200 amp service. We currently have 5 tanning beds, all are running on 240v, when we checked with all the beds on the amp draw at the main was 196 amps. When I then turned our towels dryer on the amp draw was 216 amps, but it did not trip the breaker. In addition we have all the other lights and central air and curling irons turning on and off etc etc. So how far past the 200 amps can I go before it will trip? The tanning beds only run for 20 mins.. so even if all the beds are on at the same time they never are all on for longer the 20 mins at a time so being past the 200 amps is only consistant for 20 mins. So could someone please give me an idea how far past the 200 amps I can go so I know if I can add another bed or 2? Thanks!
What you asking it is not simple answer. The circuit Breakers are not instantaneous they act as time delay it takes few minutes to warm-up before it will drop out. However I would not advise you to run even 196 amps. for longer time connection and wire could fined small amount of resistance that could cause the fire, Good luck
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On Sunday, June 26, 2016 at 2:23:10 PM UTC-4, Tony944 wrote:

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As I pointed out.. the tanning beds operate for no longer then 20 mins. So that would be the maximum time spent above the 200 amp line. But I still wo uld like a better answer as to how far past I can go before I start trippin g the main. In earlier posts I read that only after a sustained amp draw of 3 hours would it trip. If this is true then I shouldnt be anywhere clos e to having a problem if I am only doing 20 mins then a break then 20 mins etc. So could I go to 250 amps? or more? I understand what I am asking is pushing the rules, but would like a reasonable idea of how far past I can g o. I want to purchase one more bed and if that puts me at 210-220 amps for 20 mins at a time, just want to know that I can do that without tripping my main etc.
Thoughts?
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doing 20 mins then a break then 20 mins etc. So could I go to 250 amps? or more? I understand what I am asking is pushing the rules, but would like a reasonable idea of how far past I can go. I want to purchase one more bed and if that puts me at 210-220 amps for 20 mins at a time, just want to know that I can do that without tripping my main etc.

Forget about trying to push the limiits of the breaker. If you already have a load of close to 200 amps, either forget the other bed or upgrade the service.
You are not only pushing the limits of the breaker and may weaken it to where it will trip at a lower current at a later time, you are chancing over heating the wires feeding the breaker.
Looking at some typical tripping curves it could take from 1000 to 10,000 seconds if overloadded to about 120%. The more the overload, the faster the tripping.
It is also the ammount of heat build up. If the box is cold as in the winter time, the times will be longer and if hot as in the middle of summer, the times will be shorter.
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