Krimped House Water Supply Pipe

[Terry Shaw]

My public water supply pipe is krimped just after it enters the house and just before the shutoff valve. It has been this way for a long time and I have no reason to suggest it would continue to be fine. Water pressure is very strong in the house and there are no leaks.

I'm being told to fix this. Since there is no simple way to work on this pipe, and shutting off water from the outside would be extremely difficult, is there a way to strengthen the pipe with something that would clamp over the existing pipe?

Thanks!

[George]

Why would shutting the water off be extremely difficult? In every place I know you can call the water utility and tell them you need to do maintenance and they will schedule a turn off at no charge.

[trader4]

Ditto. Or in many cases you can shut it off yourself with a street key. Don't see why it would be hard to work on. As long as there is a long enough piece of good plastic pipe to be able to re-insert the fitting and double clamp it.

[Tony Hwang]

Ditto, here city water dept. will be happy for the asking. It is part of their job. Remember Murphy's law.

[GTS-NJ]

Here in my North NJ town it's a $65.00 charge/

[Terry Shaw]

In this situation, the city can do it (for a fee to turn off and then turn on), however the shutoff is in an inconvenient location which could require quite a bit of excavation/restoration. And that is assuming that all the old plumbing near the underground valve wouldn't be disturbed by the digging.

The copper pipe is crimped, not kinked, and was probably done by some "helpful" joker with a pair of pliers when the foundation was poured many decades ago. The pipe extends from the cellar floor. I'd like to leave it as is (no problems detected) but am being told to "fix" it.

Solder joints are prohibited before the cellar shut off valve, so a flare joint would be required at minimum. The city suggested that any work before the valve may entail running new 1" copper all the way to the street, which is another reason why I'd prefer not to involve their services.

[trader4]

Are you sure there is no valve accessible without excavating? That would be rather unusual. Where is the water meter located?

Who's telling you to fix it? Home inspector prior to sale? If that is potentially holding up the sale, why not just call a plumber and be done with it?

If solder joints are prohibited and you're talking flare fittings, then it must be copper tubing that you have, not pipe.

I don't see the big deal here. If it uses a flare fitting to join to the valve near the entry point, the only issue is if you have enough tubing extending into the house to cut off the kinked pieced, flare a new fitting and make the appropriate re-connection. Since you seem unfamiliar with what you have and it appears this is something where the consequences of screwing it up are high, why not just call a plumber?

[George]

What are you going to do if say they really need to shut it off? Wait hours until they dig it up or whatever needs to be done?

Sounds a little unusual not to have a surface accessible without anything more than removing a cap to access shutoff. If it were me I would remedy the access problem and while doing that make the repairs.

[Joe]

New Jersey is out of money, so be sympathetic.

Joe

[Tony Miklos]

Who is telling you to fix it?

[Steve Barker]

screw that, i just walk out, stick my water wrench in there and turn it off. I got no time for water companies every time i need water off.

[hallerb]

Well SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE:(

some years ago I did some plumbing at my moms home, turned main water valve on at meter and a old line split.the valve refused to close again.

called water company as basement flooded, water company came right away:) but took 2 hours to find main shut off, buried by road repaving, found main sewer floor drain didnt work good either......

I ended up hooking a garden hose to meter out to get water outdoors.

lets just say my first future move is to always be able to close main street valve.

my best friend found my experience funny, till one christmas eve his main lead line split at meter and water company had trouble closing main street valve, its over a 100 years old.

he had 2 seperate ball valves installed after his adventure.

always make certain your main shut off valve location is known and accesible for any utility!

[Terry Shaw]

The water meter is in the basement next to the cellar valve. The crimped pipe is before the cellar valve.

No, it is actually rigid copper pipe, but code does not allow solder joints prior to meter.

I am working with a plumber, but looking for other ideas to strengthen pipe.

[harry]

Any solution I can think of will involve turning off the water supply. I think you should concentrate on that side of it first. You need access to that outside valve anyway in emergency.

[trader4]

We go onto the subject of tubing because you brought up flare fittings. That suggested that you must have seen one on in use there already. If it's copper PIPE, as opposed to tubing, then how do they run it from the street to the cellar without a solder joint in between? I haven't seen 50ft+ lengths of copper pipe. And AFAIK, you can only use a flare fitting on TUBING, not pipe, because the tubing is softer and has the proper characteristics to be flared.

So far all we know is there is copper pipe with a kink near where it enters the cellar before the valve and there is a meter.

How close to the wall is the kink?

What comes next, meter or valve?

What type of connections/fittings are there between all of the above now? Describe what's there in sequence.

You haven't answered the question of who told you to fix the pipe and that could be key to your answer as well. If it was a home inspector and this involves a sale, then some kludge solution to try to strengthen a kinked pipe, while already not the best idea, is probably useless. A buyer isn't likely to accept it.

[Jeff Thies]

Copper is tough and durable stuff, I'd be inclined to leave it be.

If I had to fix it I might consider freezing the pipe with dry ice, cutting it and repairing it with shark bite fittings.

I'd be nervous though! Very nervous!!!

The preferred method (in my non expert opinion) would be to make it look fixed, without really doing anything. I had to fix a main line recently where the street shutoff didn't quite. No joy.

Jeff

[Tony Miklos]

So who was the dummy who landscaped over the shut off valve without putting an extension on it?

[hallerb]

someday that shutoff might be critical, best to find and extend it before disaster is in progress.......

[Andy]

Wrap it with the Pasco 59054 Rubber Sealant Rapid Seal Pipe Repair Tape.

[mbeyer]

One thing never mentioned in this thread (that I saw) is WHO told you to fix this? If it's been there for years, just leave it. This sounds like a realtor's opinion, and half of them are idiots when it comes to home repair.