On 8/30/2013 2:12 PM, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
I'm trying to think of where they're common in electrical work and I'm
not thinking of many uses. Typically the box screws and the screws on
the side of devices are either slotted (old) or combo head (modern), and
those are the only places you could even use a Phillips driver. Cover
plate screws are traditionally all slotted, and most of the circuit
breaker screws that I've seen are Robertson.
All of the new outlet covers I've put on lately have had Phillips head
screws but most of the covers I've installed these days have been for
network and phone jacks. The breakers and breaker panels I've installed
in the past few years have the square (Robertson) head screws on the
breakers, neutral and grounding bars. The large lugs have hex (Allen)
socket set screws. The new duplex outlet and switch covers that I've
installed lately still have flat head screws. The mounting screws for
new receptacles and switches I've been installing have Phillips or combo
screws and the steel outlet and switch boxes have the combo screws. The
grounding screws in the boxes and the stingers (grounding
wires) with screws have a combo screw that's Phillips, flat head and
5/16 hex that fits a nut driver. Things are really screwy with screws
these days so you must be careful not to screw up. ^_^
I wish I had my 64 Valiant and 65 Dart with the Slant Six and automatic
transmission. I even had a full sized 63 Dodge with a 225 Slant Six and
the darn big old hunk of steel would get up and go. I also had a 64
Dodge cab over engine pickup, the pickup made on the van chassis with
the cab forward and engine between the front seats like the van. It had
a Slant Six and was a neat little truck. The vehicles were simple and
easy to work on plus they rarely quit on you leaving you stranded. All
you had to do was keep them serviced and the critters would run forever.
I miss those old crates. ^_^
Farther north of you, the DOT salts the roads a
bit much in the winter. We still have drivers
who don't know how to handle road conditions.
Even with all the salt and sand, people still
go off the road, wreck up, and so on. So, the
vehicles from the earlier years all disappear in
a pile of rust and decay. A lot of folks have
historic cars, but only drive them in good
weather with no road salt.
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
On 8/30/2013 8:14 AM, The Daring Dufas wrote:
On Fri, 30 Aug 2013 08:33:00 -0400, Stormin Mormon
And the "go forever" is just faulty memory. VERY few lasted 100,000
miles without major engine work. I had a lot od old Mopars in my day -
'53 Coronet Red Ram (hemi) , 57 Fargo 261? flathead, '63 Valiant 170
slant six, '69 dart 225 slant six, 1975 Dart Sport 225 slant six, 1976
Ramcharger 318, and numerous later mitsubishi-based 4 and 6 cyl
vehicles. The red ram was purchased with a blown motor at 100,000
miles and it had been apart previously. The Fargo had 225,000 miles
on the clock when I sold it - head and valves had been done at least
once while I had it, and who knows what in the first 20 years of it's
And the mopars were the GOOD vehicles back then
On Fri, 30 Aug 2013 12:09:23 -0400, email@example.com wrote:
Yes, it's relative. I'm not a Mopar fan, and only owned one.
A '74 Dart Swinger with a 225. Can't remember the miles on it, but it
went over 100k. First car I had with "electronic ignition."
Bought it used and put maybe 30k mile on it.
Until almost 20 years later, it was the most trouble free engine I've
had. Just did fluid changes, plugs and a rocker cover gasket.
It was a dog with torque, but otherwise sweet.
But the body of that car dissolved REAL fast.
The 1974 225 was longer-lasting than any V-8 I had back then.
That was before "lean burn."
Chevy had a good straight 6 too, 250 I think.
So it's good to remember "it's all relative."
A well-maintained VW Bug might only go 60k before you got excessive
blow-by and had to replace the jugs/rings.
As a professional mechanic I did a LOT of engine rebuilds on cars
built from the fifties to the seventies. Lots of valve jobs. Lots of
ring jobs, lots of bearing replacements. Replaced a lot of oil pumps,
timing chains and camshafts. Replaced a fair number of cyl heads too.
Ring jobs, bearing replacements, and even valve jobs are virtually
unheard of today. The average engine today goes to the scrapyard with
all of it's original internal parts and well over 100,000 miles on the
clock. It goes to the scrapyard when the body or chassis wears out -
usually with the engine still in decent mechanical condition.
Sometimes they go to the graveyard due to engine control systems
needing repair - engine not passing smog, etc. Some die an early death
due to timing belt failure (failure of owner to follow manufacturere's
recommendation to change the belt) or terminal lubrication failure
(failure of owner to change vital fluids) - but those are relatively
few in the grand scheme of things. Many go over 100,000 miles in SPITE
of poor maintenance,
Also, you had to tune them up once or twice a year, rebuild the
carburetor every couple of years, adjust or replace the choke several
times in a car's lifetime, atc, etc, etc. The vast majority of cars
today will go 100,000 miles on the original plugs, without having ANY
fuel system maintenance beyond possible fuel filter replacement, and
never having a single adjustment or ignition part replacement. Often
still on the original exhaust system too - remember a muffler shop on
every corner - always busy - and replacing the muffler every 2
As for the '74 slant six - and the electronic ignition - remember that
little 4 terminal ceramic block on the firewall? The dual ballast
resistor? That failed quite regularly? I always had 2 on the firewall
so I could switch without tools, and generally a spare in the glove
box. The '74 was the second year for electronic ignition on the
leaning tower of power. It had a very robust forged crank untill about
1978? and the 4 main bearings were the same size as on a 426 Hemi. The
block, designed to be built of either aluminum or cast iron, was
EXTREMELY stout in it's common cast iron form.- last used in North
American vehicles in 1987 trucks. and 1983 in cars.
GM's answer to the slant six was the 230/250 cu inch six - also a
pretty reliable and durable engine, used across the product line for
many years. Not quite in the same class as the slant six, but very
close.Also the 292 truck engine. In the US, GM produced other sixes
under the GMC label, as well as the Pontiac Sprint OHC
Ford had their 144/170/200/250 inline six that was no-where near in
the same class, Also the 240/300 truck engine - not a BAD engine, but
AMC had the 199/232/258 /242 which was a VERY stout and reliable
engine (as long as you kept the oil changed to prevent the rocker
shaft from running dry). It was a 7 main bearing engine,
Of all the "old" sixes, the AMC lasted the longest in production - as
the 4.0 HO in the jeep up until 2006, with minor changes along the
The AMC was the only one to survive into the Fuel Injection era, and
OBD2 engine controls.
On Fri, 30 Aug 2013 21:47:52 -0400, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
Nope, never had one fail. Don't know much about the engine, since I
never had to do any work on it except plugs/wires, and the valve cover
gasket. I did replace the spark module once, when I had some random
stalling. Unnecessary waste of 20 bucks.
I was about to drop the gas tank as a last resort, thinking somebody
had put something in there and it would block the pick-up randomly.
I didn't know squat about electrical testing then.
Got real lucky when I hung my head in despair thinking about dropping
the tank. I was leaning over the fender in just the right spot, and
the sun had moved to just the right spot. Caught a glint near the
back of the head. Primary ignition wire copper showing through melted
My fault entirely. The harness dropped there when I pulled the valve
cover, and I hadn't noticed it, and hadn't rehung it.
The head melted a tiny piece off the insulation and that bare spot was
bouncing against the head randomly, grounding it.
It's my favorite fix for something that gave me so much hassle.
One half inch of electrical tape and rehang the harness.
Well, pulling an orange peel from the throat of my Bug's carb when it
died on me is a co-favorite.
Yeah, the newer engines are leagues better.
I did plug/point changes, dwell/timing adjustment spring and late fall
with my old cars. Choke adjustment was part of that too, and making
sure the fast idle cam was setting. New spark wires every fall.
What did that get me? Cars always started and ran good.
One Christmas Eve morning it had dropped to -25F and I went outside
to start my van because my wife just HAD to do more shopping.
Entire street had cars with hoods up, no exhaust from any of them.
Can't say I was confident my 350 would start.
Did my usual 2 pumps on the accelerator to prime it and set the choke.
Took foot off gas.
Turned the key. Took a couple seconds before it even cranked.
Then it SLOWLY turned, probably not even 45 degrees, and fired up.
Screeched a bit on the cylinder walls. Used straight 30 weight then.
Oil is better now too.
I helped 3 neighbors with jumps. I had excellent heavy cables and
cranked them all. None even fired. Already flooded, or just poorly
maintained ignition. Had to almost fight my way out of there to get
my wife to her shopping. Stores were almost empty, with skeleton
Those temperatures are a good test to find out how you've maintained
No way I want those old cars. I priced a carb for that 350 later.
Last time I had replaced one, it cost 25 bucks for a rebuilt Carter
single barrel. Cheapest 2 barrel I found for the 350 was +$400.
You're also right about valve jobs, worn rings, etc.
The last few cars I've had didn't even blink, as they passed 150k
miles. My 2.8 Celebrity went to about 190k with only injector
replacement. My 3.1 Lumina disappointed me by breaking the cam,
but it went 165K miles trouble free.
Both rusted out anyway. That's what always gets mine.
If it wasn't for rust, I'd have a new crate engine in the Lumina.
Not all years' engines were created equal. Mopar went through several
years where they were cheapening the slant-sixes to where they were
junk. Chrysler hasn't made a decent car since.
Copper ignition wire? Really? Though, ignition wires are first on my
list of suspects when such things happen. They're cheap and usually
easy to replace (my Vision TSI and Intrepid were the exceptions).
Why not replace the wire?
Agree 100%, though it was usually the rainiest 33F day in November
when I had to replace the points and wires. I *definitely* like newer
cars. Nothing to do.
Clearing a flooded engine isn't hard. Some will never start at that
temperature, though. My guess is that some of them had frozen fuel
My '78 Ford ate a carb once a year. It used to piss me off but a new
one was only $80ish. Rebuilts were a waste of time.
I haven't gotten quite that far yet. The best have rotted out before
that. I just replaced my '01 Ranger. ...and the wife's '00 Sable,
but she just had to have the shiny Mustang convertible, that matched
the truck I bought.
If it wasn't for rust (Fords) and transmissions (Chryslers), I'd have
kept my cars much longer. Repairs are cheap but once the rust sets in
there is nothing left.
The 1978 model year was the beginning of the end for the slant six -
different head, cast crank, lean burn, and all that crap combined to
make it less driveable, less reliable, less efficient, and overall
They HAVE built some very good cars since - if you compare them to the
older stuff. Mabee not so good if you compare them to some of their
On 8/30/2013 8:47 PM, email@example.com wrote:
I liked the Slant Six, 318 based on the 273 thin walled casting and the
360. I have a 318 with TBI in my 89 Dodge van with around 100,000,000
miles on it, it keeps running for some odd reason. I put a lot of miles
on a Ford Econoline with a 300cid six and I was quite impressed with the
engine because it was very reliable and pushed the short wheelbase van
on down the highway while I ran service calls all over the Southeast.
Like anything else, if folks would keep the contraptions serviced the
golly gosh darn things keep running. Darn it, I wish I could crawl under
and around my vehicles like I could 20 years ago and work on them myself
because it really frustrates me. I've never worked as a professional
mechanic but I was self reliant when I worked on my own vehicles plus I
had pals I could always call, ask their advise and pick their brains for
obscure bits of information not commonly found in the manuals. ^_^
This is apparantly a real exchange that happened in the 1900's:
Reporter: "Mr. Ford, you announced that someday Ford Motor Company will
build cars that will go fifty miles per hour. How is that possible?"
Henry Ford: "That's easy. We'll design them to go 100 miles per hour."
I got that quote from one of my Strength of Materials textbooks back in
my university days. There's a great deal of truth to it.
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