1. Home
  2. Home Repair
  3. GFCI must be 20 amps.

GFCI must be 20 amps.

Hi,

My contractor told me that by code a 20amp GFCI outlet must be on a

20amp circuit. True or false?

Thanks,

Sam

Reply to
Sam Takoy
Loading thread data ...

Look here:

TinyURL -

formatting link
Full URL -

formatting link

Reply to
DerbyDad03

True. The National Electrical Code permits putting 15A outlets on 20A circuits, but not the other way around.

Reply to
Doug Miller

I'm assuming it's OK to put the circuit in question on a 15A GFCI breaker. That would solve the problem.

Reply to
Mikepier

I'm assuming it's OK to put the circuit in question on a 15A GFCI breaker. That would solve the problem.

He still can't put a 20 amp receptacle on it.

Reply to
RBM

Yes a 20 amp outlet GFCI or regular would need to be on a 20 amp circuit. This would be an outlet with an additional slot for a sideways prong.

Reply to
Bill

No, but I think the OP's problem is he wants a certain outlet which is on a 15A circuit to be GFI protected. If he did not want to re-run the whole circuit to be 20A, he could just simply install a 15A GFI breaker.

Reply to
Mikepier

No, but I think the OP's problem is he wants a certain outlet which is on a 15A circuit to be GFI protected. If he did not want to re-run the whole circuit to be 20A, he could just simply install a 15A GFI breaker.

You may be correct, but sometimes people want to use 20 amp devices because their built "stronger". There is no reason that the OP can't install a 15 amp GFCI outlet on the circuit.

Reply to
RBM

The OP (me) has a 20 amp GFCI breaker for the garage circuit in the breaker box. The overload tripping the GFCI breaker is so infrequent that it is hard to pin down what happened to cause the breaker to trip. Maybe the refrigerator and freezer happen to be running at the same time that I use the garage door opener, but if it did, I would know immediately since I wouldn't be able to close the door. . Nothing else in the garage is running all the time nor is anything plugged in that automatically starts and stops, other than the refrigerator and the freezer. Absent that knowledge, I would just like to be able to reset the circuit without having to make a trip to the basement to reset the breaker . I already have a solution to warn me when the breaker has tripped. The garage door wired opener with the red light being moved to inside the abode, as mentioned in an earlier thread. I think I may buy a power strip for each of the three outlets in the garage, and when the circuit is overloaded, the tripped breaker in that power strip will let me know where the problem is.

Reply to
willshak

That is not really true if you compare apples to apples. Most 20a receptac;es are "spec grade". You can't really compare that to the 49 cent economy grade 15a receptacle but if you buy a 15a spec grade it will be as well built as the 20a, for about the same price.

Reply to
gfretwell

OK, it turns out that I misunderstood what my contractor was telling me.

According to him, in a new work bathroom, all circuits must be 20amp and GFCI. So I'm not allowed to run a 15 amp circuit there. True or false?

Reply to
Sam Takoy

True. And it needs to be a separate 20 amp circuit for just the bathroom.

That is so you can use a hair blow dryer and not trip the breaker...

If you have other power hogs in there like an electric heater, might want additional circuits. The idea is you can use the things in your bathroom without breakers tripping. Makes life more enjoyable! You use your bathroom everyday...

Reply to
Bill

False.

2008 NEC, Article 210.11(C)(3) requires a minimum of one 20A circuit to supply bathroom receptacles -- but it does not prohibit installation of 15A circuits in addition to the required 20A circuit.

Not quite correct.

That one 20A circuit is permitted to supply receptacles in *multiple* bathrooms. It may not supply receptacles anywhere else, but it it *not* required to have one 20A circuit *per bathroom*.

Reply to
Doug Miller

Do the same rules apply to first floor powder rooms?

Reply to
Sam Takoy

[...]

I have no idea what you mean by a "powder room".

Here's what the NEC means by "bathroom": "An area including a basin with one or more of the following: a toilet, a tub, or a shower." [2008 NEC, Article 100]

NEC rules applying to bathrooms apply to any room meeting that definition, regardless of what you call it, or what floor it's on.

Reply to
Doug Miller

..

That approach of finding the overload will work IF it happens that a major short or overload of some kind is happening at whatever happens to be plugged into the one particular strip that may trip. But it's not going to tell you if the sum total of ALL the loads everywhere on the circuit is just exceeding 20 amps. To do that with your approach, you'd have to have a 20 amp power strip and plug ALL the loads into the one strip.

As I suggested previously, I'd start by getting a Kill-a-Watt or an amp meter and measuring what each of the various loads on that circuit is pulling to determine if any one is out of range. Also, again, if it's the STARTING current from the fridge that's tripping it, changing the breaker to a delay type may solve the problem. And if it's one appliance, like a freezer that is pulling way too much, the solution may be to replace it with a new one which could use $100 or more a year LESS electricity and pay for itself.

Reply to
trader4

This is just an interesting story about the differences between local tax codes and NEC Codes - which I know are in no way related.

re: " Here's what the NEC means by "bathroom": "An area including a basin with one or more of the following: a toilet, a tub, or a shower." [2008 NEC, Article 100] "

When I moved into my house, it was listed as having 1.5 baths and I was taxed as having 1.5 baths. The 1/2 bath in the basement had a toilet and a shower but no sink.

My town's tax code considers any room with 2 fixtures to be a half- bath, more than 2 to be a full bath - regardless of what the fixtures are.

So, per the NEC, I guess that room wasn't a bathroom but per my town it was.

re: "I have no idea what you mean by a "powder room"."

I don't know if you were being serious or not, so...

In many parts of our fair country, that first floor room with the sink and toilet is often referred to as a "powder room" as in the room you go to right after you say "Excuse me, I'm going to powder my nose."

Reply to
DerbyDad03

And whether it's a bathroom for the purposes of your local electrical code is a completely separate question from whether it's a bathroom for the purposes of your property tax assessment.

Of course I was being serious. I know what *I* mean by that phrase, but the only thing that's relevant here is what *he* means by it. And since he didn't explain that, there's no way to know. We can guess, but we can't know.

And that, of course, is a bathroom as defined by the NEC. But that still doesn't tell us what the OP meant by that phrase.

Reply to
Doug Miller

If there was a sink right outside the door of that room it would still be considered a bathroom because the code says "area". It is not uncommon in McMansions to have a sink and vanity outside the room where the toilet and shower is. (similar to what you see in a hotel) The whole area is the bathroom.

Reply to
gfretwell

OK, let me belabor this point. There is a toilet and a sink in an area of 7 sq. ft. There is no place to plug in a radiator. The only place to put the outlet is in the same electrical box as the light switch. The light is already wired with 14/2 and the ceiling is closed.

I can break the code in one of three ways:

  1. Put two circuits in one electrical box (15amp and 20amp)
  2. Have only one 20 amp circuit with 14/2 wire running to the light
  3. Use a 15amp GFCI outlet.

I'm thinking of going for #3.

Reply to
Sam Takoy

HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.