Battery Problem

[NSN]

I know that this may not be the best group to post this question but I browse this group every day and feel certain that someone out there can help.

I have a new 2003 Infiniti QX4 (SUV). If I let it sit for 3 days or more, the battery needs to be charged .. it will not start. I took it to the dealer and he checked the battery. It checks out good on his meter showing no bad cells and a normal amp/hour rating. According to their policy, they cannot replace the battery because their test unit shows it to be OK. Obviously, by the time I drive it to the dealer it has fully recharged.

As I see it, there are two possibilities: the battery is defective and looses its charge over the 3 day period or something is drawing current over those 3 days. Can anyone advise me as how I can test for both of the above problems and convince the dealer that something is wrong. ( I prefer not to leave it with the dealer for the 3 day period.)

I could always go over to Costco and pick up another battery for under $50 which would be the easiest thing to do if it were a battery problem. However, I would like to accurately diagnose the problem since I am under warrantee.

Norm

[DaveG]

Make sure no interior lights are on, and make sure the underhood lights shut off when you close the hood. Sounds like it may be something like that. Or try having someone else test your battery. Dave

[Jerry Levine]

[*CBHVAC*]

Your dealer..sounds like...from your posting...an idiot. Now..granted, they probably put the newbie on it, and he knew nothing about parasitic draw.

Well, even if you do, it is Infiniti's policy to make sure you are in a loaner that is equal to what you have should you need to leave the vehicle.

Actually..you might not be. Unless you are under 12,000 miles, the battery MIGHT not be covered. Its been a while since I had to know the warranty for Infinity inside and out and alot has probably changed...but at one time not long ago, the battery was considered a wear item, and the factory installed unit was a 12-12 item.

The dealer needs to check for parasitic draw..thats something thats drawing more current than it should be..when the vehicle is off. It could be as simple as a glove box light....a short in a door jamb switch...they will need to simply pull the positive cable off, run a DMM inline with the cable and see what the amperage draw is.

If its under .6 amps....and it should be, even with the clock, computer and such, then its a no brainer....shorted cell in the battery...and if they had used a good old carbon pile load, that would have shown in moments.

[rj]

[jim]

next time you plan on not using the car for three days, just remove one of the cables from the battery and in three days put it back on and try to start it up.. if it starts up then something was pulling juice from the battery and a new battery will not do you any good... so that takes car of if the battery is good or bad.... next thing you need to know is what is pulling the battery down in three days??? remove one of the battery cables and with the aid of a test light (a 12 volt bulb with two pigtails on the light or socket) put one on the battery post and one on the cable.. if the light comes on its because something is pulling juice from the battery.... if the light does not come on then nothing is pulling juice from the battery.... make sure you key is off, no headlight, no trunk, interior or hood lights.... did you ever test the trunk light???/ thats the most common thing that would draw a battery down in three days??? take the bulb out and see if you have the same problems???

[Joseph Meehan]

I agree with Jim's suggestion, however I would make two notes.

Before doing this, make sure you have any codes necessary to reactivate the radio if it uses a security system. Check your manual for instructions. Otherwise you could end up paying to have the dealer turn your radio back on.

Second, expect your car to run a little funny for a day or so after doing this. That's normal, don't worry, it is just the computer figuring out how best to run your car. Don't do it right before bringing your car in for a pollution test. ;-)

[RB]

My wife's 2003 QX-4 will sit for weeks without discharging. You may have conductive debris on the surface of your battery. Most auto batteries that discharge are because of this. A way to see the discharge happening is to take a volt meter and place one lead on a terminal and drag the other lead along the battery case starting near the terminal you connected one lead to towards the other terminal. The voltage will increase as you progress.

Wash the battery off with hot water and bak> jim wrote:

[m Ransley]

What others have said is correct, but to help you locate a short when using a test lamp or meter remove the fuses one by one till you locate the circut.

[wayne]

You need to check the power seats. I had a car before that the power seat control did not always stop and the motor had a small draw sometimes killed

2 batteries before I figured it out. I would try pulling the fuse for the power seats! Especially if the seats move back when you turn the engine off for easy exit!

Wayne

[Charlie Bress]

This is probably not the best test. If you even see a voltage and a difference across the battery, the path is pretty high resistance. If it were not the voltage would not appreciably change with the distance to the terminals. Further using a voltmeter, whether digital or analog, that responds with so little current is not an accurate measurement. This minute current would be so much less than other parasitic currents as to be meaningless.

Consider the stuff that is supposed to be on when the vehicle is shut down. For example, the keep-alive circuit for the radio presets and the clock, an alarm system, remote door locks, etc.

Charlie

[Jim Yanik]

jim wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Removing the battery cable will cause your radio presets to be lost,and perhaps even the EFI will clear its memory and take a few days to relearn it's calibrations.

[Jeff Wisnia]

Well, a damn simple "no additional equipment needed" test would be to just disconnect one battery cable, let things sit for 3 days and then reconnect it. If the car starts like a charm, you have your answer. If it won't, it's the battery.

But, it sure sounds to me like the guy you're talking to at the dealer had his alimentary track completely reversed.

Jeff

[Peter Yao]

BMW 3 series has a climate control recall recently, if you let it sit for a couple of days it still draws current and the car will not start. Maybe this is similiar.

[chicagofan]

I fought this very same battle with Lexus for a year, when I discovered after early retirement that my car HAD to be driven every 2 or 3 days, or the battery would have to be charged. After many trips to their service center, and a letter to their home office, I was advised to buy a Sears battery charger. :-/ Which I did, because I was unable to determine what was wrong and they said they weren't either.

After reading this thread, I remember one day that I had charged my battery for

2 or 3 hrs, drove to my doctor's office, and being in unfamiliar territory, I forgot and set the car alarm by locking the doors. When I returned in probably an hour, my battery was dead. Is that any indication, there could be a problem with the alarm system, or would it normally draw that much power?

When answering, please bear in mind[if this is a stupid question], I'm female, and know nothing about mechanical things, other than how to charge my battery. ;) TIA for any responses. bj

[Joseph Meehan]

Security systems are a know problem with all cars. Sometimes they are drawing too much power. It is hard to say in your case. After draining the batter several times, the battery is usually damaged and will not hold a charge.

[William W. Plummer]

instructions.

I used to fight this problem every Spring and Fall (temp change). The cure is to totally disconnect the battery cables, use a terminal brush (inside and outside), reattach and coat with grease to seal out the air. The corrosion causes high resistence that lets the radio and lights to work, but won't permit cranking the stater.

Also, one time the problem turned out to be a slipping fan belt. The alternator wasn't recharging the battery.

[George E. Cawthon]

If the dealer did an amp/hour test is sounds like he really tested the battery. However, you can prove whether it the battery or parasitic draw by simply disconnecting one pole checking the voltage after 6 hours and use that as a base and then checking the voltage after 3 days. Harbor Freight has cheap digital voltmeters ($4.00) if you don't have one. If there is any significant change in 3 days you have a bad battery. Full charge should be around 12.75 V at full charge. And of course while the battery pole is off you can connect your voltmeter between the pole and the cable (in series) to measure the amps. (be sure you pull the hood lamp when you do the test. Any significant amperage will be bad.

As an example, my F-150 truck will sit for 2 months and not drop more than 0.3 V. I once installed a replacement radio in a vehicle and found that it drew so much power when off that voltage was low enough to make starting hard when left for 2 weeks. I liked the radio so I installed a switch in the hot lead and turned it off anytime I was going to let the vehicle sit for more than a day. Of course in lost memory of stations when switched off, but then I only listen to one station most of the time.

[George E. Cawthon]

[Joseph Meehan]

I should have noted in my original response that you may also have a problem with the charging system. It may not be charging fully.

Many auto parts stores will check the battery and charging circuits for free. It is not 100% certain, but they get it right most of the time.