Disheartened

[limey]

Well, I think I've lost heart for gardening, after trying at this house.

Squirrels and birds stripped the peach and apple trees. Squirrels also attacked the tomatoes.

The deer this year are really bad. First, in the spring they ate my lilies. Then, during the season they stripped the tomato vines and/or ate the tomatoes. They then went to work on the cucumbers. After that, they ate the rhubarb leaves (I hope they got belly aches), but left the decimated stalks.

At lunchtime today, I watched a doe and her fawn eat the hydrangea vegetation, then the peony leaves, then they started on the azaleas in the back yard. I tried to shoo them off but they must have moved at least 12 inches then stared at me. Next, I suppose, they will be destroying the foundation plants. Give me a break.

Dora

[Anonny Moose]

I'm feeling the same way, but I'm in the desert and the culprits destroying my plants are woodrats, mice and burros. If you think a deer is hard to move, try moving a stubborn ass! A clever woodrat has even taken to building a nest in the engine compartment of my truck - complete with gallons of mesquite beans, cactus pieces, thorny sticks and burro dung. I clean it all out and park the truck in a different place and the little critter manages to find it and start all over again. It has so far eluded the traps forcing us to put out poison tonight before any more damage is done to the engine. In the meantime, the cactus and newly planted trees are surrounded by wire cages. *sigh*

Karen

[Janet Baraclough]

The message from "limey" contains these words:

I feel your pain, Dora. It's outrageous that gangs of criminal species roam around our planet vandalising it, as if they were h*mo sapiens. My advice is to move to a penthouse apartment in the city. No more deer jumping on the balcony, and any passing birds will feel dizzy from traffic fumes, fall into the road and get crushed by traffic.

Janet

[Doug Kanter]

Do you know anyone who hunts deer with a bow and arrow? Seriously.

[limey]

I know, I know - we're encroaching on their habitat more and more. However, deer aren't controlled in this area to any great extent, are multiplying fast and are proving a real hazard on the roads. We're lucky, I suppose - at least they're not hungry bears in the yard. I'm just hungry for my own vegetables, though, and fences aren't allowed here.

Dora

[bigjon]

limey decided to add:

...........and fences aren't allowed here.

why ?

[limey]

The homeowners association has very restrictive covenants.

[Frank]

Me, but not the ones in my back yard. Candidly, I would but wife will not have it. Local rules for county are that you cannot hunt within

200 yds of an occupied dwelling. Bow is effective as a firearm but will seldom down them immediately unless hit in spine. Otherwise you have to be skilled in blood trailing. Also takes considerable practice to become good shot.

[Travis]

How do you keep your children/grandchildren and the dog in the yard? Why would anyone want to live where you are? No fences? That is just crazy.

[John]

Yes, you must have fences ! And locks. Lotsa locks ! And an alarm system on your house and car and motorcycle is you have one. Don't forget the John Deere lawn mower. And every kid over the age of 8 gets a cell phone. Before 8 they should have LoJack implants . Don't forget Fido and Paws. They both absoluitely must have LoJacs tracking shock collars.

JD Right up the road from Jacks place. In a town of 600 with a single P/T policeman. Where I can leave my saw out by the mailbox for days without worry.

[bigjon]

limey decided to add:

ok, so move or alter things....

Something here may help more than a shotgun (presumably also frowned upon)

- repel deer - repel rodents/birds - scare loads of critters - repel bugs, spiders, ants, mice, insects, moles, raccoons, skunk, possum, just about everything!!

[limey]

"Doug Kanter" wrote>

No, but even if I did the wildlife restrictions wouldn't allow it so close to houses.

Dora

[Doug Kanter]

Right - can't hunt close to dwellings. But, at least the bow & arrow are silent. And, I have a friend who has been practicing head shots quite successfully. The guy is scary. I know, however, that this is totally uncommon.

[limey]

Well, in spite of it all we don't want to move. Thanks for your links to repellents and I think that's the way we'll have to go. I've also read that planting marigolds around the crops will deter them (can't say I blame them - I don't like the smell either). This problem became much worse when the neighbor across the road put down a salt lick, so the deer were attracted to our yard on their way to the salt. Their habits are extremely hard to break.

Dora

[Doug Kanter]

Deer? What deer? I haven't seen a deer.

Hint: Don't they forage in your area when the sun's barely up?

[Doug Kanter]

Since you've nixed the bow hunting idea, try something that worked for me, for almost 3 months: Irish Spring bar soap. Get some knee-hi hosiery and empty 1 quart yogurt or cottage cheese containers. Punch hole in bottom of container big enough for a wire to pass through. Put soap in knee-hi, tie shut with wire. Pass wire through hole and pull the soap assembly up into the container, so you have something like a bell with the soap in place of the knocker. This protects the soap from rain. Hang a few of these around the most vulnerable or valuable plants. If you get a LOT of rain, you might want to seal the wire holes with a little silicone caulk.

This has stopped working for me after 3 months. Not sure if the soap has lost most of its pungent scent, or the deer just don't care any more. But, the nibbling they're doing now doesn't seem to be hurting anything, and it's the end of the season anyway. I'll try it again in the spring.

[Frank]

I suspect he is not much of a hunter. When you practice, it is under ideal conditions and out in the woods, hanging out of a tree at a bad angle can mess up your form and aim. All bow hunters I know, aim for the heart/lung area where you can be off by several inches and still have a clean kill. Vast majority of gun hunters would also not shoot at head.

That said, only sure way I've found to protect plants from deer is with netting but I've given up on the tree rats.

Frank

[Doug Kanter]

Actually, he's quite a remarkable hunter. I'm amused by your logic, though. He's been bow & shotgun hunting for almost 40 years, taught by his father and grandfather. His way of choosing which deer to take are so closely focused on what's correct, in terms of conservation, you'd think he was one of those mythically perfect native Americans we see in movies. Spends two weeks with just binoculars, observing the group on his dad's 400 acre farm, choosing which deer to take. Gets the limit, and if there's another worth taking, gets a special bag limit extension from the NY DEC. Sometimes, not. I've watched him practice with the bow, using a bottle cap stuck into styrofoam that's glued to a 4x8 plywood sheet. He'll hit it repeatedly from

75-100 feet. Interesting to watch.

There are air marshalls who are trained (successfully) to make their first shot the head shot from a fairly challenging distance, using a sem-auto handgun with 5" barrel. You and I would be hard pressed to pull that off. Do you assume they are not so good at their skills because they can do something most shooters can't?

[limey]

Up to now, they've come through here at night or, presumably, very early in the morning. After a snowstorm we can see tracks crisscrossing the entire yard. That's why I was amazed that they were munching away on my bushes when we were eating lunch. Times must be tough. There's plenty of greenstuff around to eat but it hasn't rained in weeks, so I imagine thirst is a big factor.

Dora

[limey]

What an intriguing idea and one certainly worth a try. Like you, I would guess that the scent has dissipated after three months so it would pay to change the bars. I wish these deer weren't hurting anything here; I have been nursing a young bush for three years and the deer keep nipping off all the shoots.

Dora