Re: The EPA, whose mission is . . . to protect human health and the environment, has approved Monsantosrequest to allow levels of glyphosate (Roundup) contamination in your food up to a million times higher than have been found carcinogenic.

This information is regarding food with Roundup residue, but what about using Roundup to just kill weeds that never come in contact with food?

Another "Fact Free" post from Derald.

I would think that food that never came into contact with glyphosate would not be a glyphosate risk to human health. So I guess the question you are asking is what is your risk from exposure to glyphosate when using it to kill unwanted plants. The answer to that would have to do with how well you handle it to reduce your exposure. Did you get any on your hands? Did you eat before you washed it off? Did you breath any of it? Did you get any on your clothes, and then handle the clothes later? If you can say no to those question, then you probably have no personal health worries from glyphosate.

The Soil

Scientists Reveal Glyphosate Poisons Crops and Soil

Glyphosate binds with and inactivates EPSPS, the critical enzyme in the shikimate pathway required for the synthesis of aromatic plant metabolites including essential amino acids phenylalanine, tryptophan and tyrosine, as well as downstream products such as plant growth promoter, indoylacetic acid and plant defence compounds, phytoalexins [4]. But glyphosate has multiple adverse effects that act synergistically on crop health and productivity that extends well beyond the plant into the soil ecosystem and the wider environment.

The Food

Abstract: Glyphosate, the active ingredient in Roundup(R), is the most popular herbicide used worldwide. The industry asserts it is minimally toxic to humans, but here we argue otherwise. Residues are found in the main foods of the Western diet, comprised primarily of sugar, corn, soy and wheat. Glyphosate's inhibition of cytochrome P450 (CYP) enzymes is an overlooked component of its toxicity to mammals. CYP enzymes play crucial roles in biology, one of which is to detoxify xenobiotics. Thus, glyphosate enhances the damaging effects of other food borne chemical residues and environmental toxins. Negative impact on the body is insidious and manifests slowly over time as inflammation damages cellular systems throughout the body. Here, we show how interference with CYP enzymes acts synergistically with disruption of the biosynthesis of aromatic amino acids by gut bacteria, as well as impairment in serum sulfate transport. Consequences are most of the diseases and conditions associated with a Western diet, which include gastrointestinal disorders, obesity, diabetes, heart disease, depression, autism, infertility, cancer and Alzheimer's disease. We explain the documented effects of glyphosate and its ability to induce disease, and we show that glyphosate is the "textbook example" of exogenous semiotic entropy: the disruption of homeostasis by environmental toxins. =====

What isn't clear to me is if they are talking about fresh produce, of if this is residue that follows the grains and sugar beets through their processing.

I organic garden my veggies, but the rest of my yard where weeds practically overrun and I simply can't control them I do resort to using RoundUp! There just aren't enough hours in the day to weed everything.

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Well.. I didn't get any on me when I sprayed it, and I made sure I didn't walk in it after the weeds were sprayed. There was no wind, and I washed my hands before eating. Now, after I sprayed it on the weeds, I could smell the chemical on the weeds, so is just smelling it because I sprayed the weeds (not like I inhaled it alot) a danger?

Our resident nut job? Who would have thunk it? ;)

Seriously, I find billy, a chemist who is afraid of chemicals to be an anomaly.

He's a chemist? Interesting job, I imagine.

I'm one too, mostly retired. Lot of us chemists are geeks and nerds. I put billy in that group. Not, me, of course ;)

So, why did you become a chemist?

Might have gone back to the Chemcraft chemistry set I got as a kid. Back in those days they put in real chemicals that you could get in trouble with like making explosives.

Billy wrote: ...

for the sugar/sugarbeet connection i would not be too worried about refined sugar as it is so heavily refined.

as to what remains in molasses you would have to test it and see, i've not heard or seen anything on that score.

no comment on grains, corn, soybeans glyphosate residues... no idea how much or how bad it is.

songbird

I have no idea. And this is the problem. Chemicals are being released into the environment without adequate testing. Why? Profit. If I put you at risk for money, I wouldn't be considered a good person. Monsanto puts us at risk, because their products are unknowns, and potentially harmful. Like I say, I have no idea if Roundup is harmful, but there seem to be a number of reputable scientists who think they could be. I think we should know that a product will do no harm before it is allowed to be sold. O.K.?

Derald, how do you know that Roundup, and other Monsanto products are safe? Where did you find the statement, "what an increasingly educated public considers a form of institutionalized mass poisoning"

That may be inferred from the rapid increase in the sales of "organic" products, but if it was said, it would be pandering to the vanities of the consumers of "organic" products. It could just be that people no longer trust government, or business, and want to return to a simpler time, with simpler products.

You may start with

Spread your amendments on the beds (No Need to Weed) N: 18.37 lb. chicken manure/ 100 sq.ft. (2.88 oz/sq.ft.) P: (rock phosphate) 3 lb. / 100/sq.ft. (.48 oz/sq.ft.) K: How much wood ash should you use in your garden? The late Bernard G. Wesenberg, a former Washington State University Extension horticulturist, recommended using one gallon of ashes per square yard on loam to clay-loam soil, and half as much on sandier soils.

Cover with sheets of newspaper

Cover newspaper with 3" to 4" alfalfa

Hose the bed

Wait 4 - 6 weeks and plant with seedlings. Use a dibble, ideally the pointy (sharpened) end of an old shovel handle, to make the planting holes.

For seeding directly to the soil Rake in the amendments to bare soil, Seed, add mulch as plants grow.

Mulch can act as cover for pill bugs, silver fish, and other insects that can eat the very tender leaves of sprouting plants.

With Reuters and other major news organizations finally pushing forward on our Feb. 16 story about Hubers letter to the USDA that warned of spontaneous miscarriage possibly linked to Roundup, the manufacturer Monsanto has posted a rebuttal on its website: In a January 17, 2011 letter to the U.S. Secretary of Agriculture, retired Purdue University professor Don Huber proclaims discovery of a plant pathogen that appears to significantly impact the health of plants, animals, and probably human beings. The letter also alleges this pathogen is more prevalent on herbicide-tolerant genetically modified (GM) crops. No data was provided nor cited, and no collaborators were identified . . .

In the next paragraph, Monsanto follows up by acknowledging what a pesky thorn Huber has been, ever since they hired him to research their genetically modified products more than two decades ago.

Huber has previously made allegations related to micronutrient uptake and diseases in connection with GM crops and glyphosate products, said the statement. Independent field studies and lab tests by multiple U.S. universities and by Monsanto prior to, and in response to, these allegations do not corroborate his claims. . . .

The statement in Monsantos letter of response is disingenuous, said Dr. James E. Rahe, Professor Emeritus, Department of Biological Sciences, Simon Fraser University in Burnaby, B.C. The published research from my lab done during the 1980s and 1990s showed that glyphosate (Roundup) causes increased susceptibility of dicot species to infection by root rot fungi such as pythium and fusarium.

Rahe is retired now to life as a row-crop farmer and has less at stake than his younger counterparts who still toil in laboratories that depend, largely, on funding from Monsanto and its brethren to conduct their work. He said he is inclined to accept Hubers letter and inherent warnings to the USDA.

On reading the letter, my impression is that it was sent in good faith, said Rahe, who said he still uses Roundup on a limited basis on his farm. The claims made in Hubers letter concerning a novel micro-fungal-like organism appear to be based on a substantial amount of unpublished research by several individuals in distinct scientific disciplines. If so, and now that the cat is out of the bag, it will be interesting to see what information appears in the domain of the scientific community in the near future with regard to the nature of this organism and its relationship to certain plant diseases and animal reproductive failure. . . .

If youre a practicing researcher dependent on a certain level of funding, it can be very, very damaging to come forward with any information that is considered detrimental to the GM industry, said Vlieger. It can literally ruin careers.

Making research involving genetically modified crops even more difficult is Monsantos overt squelching of any research by independent labs. The company wont make seeds available and will take scientists to court for attempting to take any independent research public. Farmers, by contract, are not allowed to share even a handful of seed with a lab.

Agritech companies have given themselves veto power over the work of independent researchers . . . Only studies that the seed companies have approved ever see the light of a peer-reviewed journal, said an article in the August 2009 issue of Scientific American.

That was a LONG time ago... I think I remember my brother getting one of those chemistry sets as a kid.

I'd like to believe we can know a product will do no harm before it's sold, but how often are products allowed to go on the market that passed current safety standards only to find out 10 yrs later the product does do harm? I'm wondering how we can know a product doesn't do harm at all?

Billy wrote: /////cut short - post read/////

Interesting ... I do use just about everything already mentioned here for my raised beds.

When I built them, I bought some bagged soil + cow manure to fill them up and from there have added composted leaves. I even used the plastic bags cut open flat to line my walk path between the raised beds and put composted leaves on top to hold the bags down. It' keeps the weeds at a bare minimum and I didn't have to send the plastic bags to the recycler because I'm still using them. This year I had to add some more soil + manure to the raised beds because of settling and I used those plastic bags to mulch what I planted in the beds. Again, it keeps the weeds downs, too.

Have you ever tried gardening via the French Intensive method? I do that on a regular basis, plus double plant when I can, too.