No, not at all. That degree of bow is a nominal curve, in both drawers, an d should be easy to reverse, to some extent, using the wetted technique. I f it bent one way, it should be able to be bent the other way. If still in doubt, bend it slowly, over time, then allow to dry. At least see what e ffect that has.
Sonny
and should be easy to reverse, to some extent, using the wetted technique. If it bent one way, it should be able to be bent the other way. If still in doubt, bend it slowly, over time, then allow to dry.
Yeah, it took ~100 years to bend one way, and my daughter doesn't graduate for another month, so I have lot's of time to reverse the bend. ;-)
So what about simply leaving the bottom in the drawer, wetting the raw bott om and then placing the drawer face down under a table with an upside down dea d man wedged between table and the center of the bottom - over correcting the curve - and letting it dry? I'd use the "bottom" of the deadman to spread t he pressure out (slightly) as opposed to it being a single pressure point.
Thoughts?
Plywood is simply veneer over another surface. The technique is old. The wood core is likely thick, e.g. 1/8" and veneers half that or less. It was a matter of putting 'exotic' wood display with a stable core.
Mart> "dadiOH" wrote >>
And what happens if you push up on the bottom while it is clamped? Sag disappear? If so, then either the bottom isn't fully seated in the grooves or the grooves are too big. If not, try loosening the clamps THEN pushing.
It doesn't matter what technique you use to reverse (over correct) the bow/ curve. If need be, try several techniques, see which one might work the b est.
Again, as you bend it (slowly), listen for small/tiny cracking sounds. Be nd the wood slowly (over a few hours, maybe), rewetting it periodically (if need be), if those small cracking sounds are heard. Old air dried cured wood will act like kiln dried wood.... sometimes difficult to rebend/reshap e, with either wet or steam bending. In these difficult cases, you heard those small cracking sounds, as it's being bent/shaped.
Sonny
OK, when I say fully seated in the grooves, I mean that as much wood as can be seated with a *bowed* bottom is in the grooves.
Of course if the bottom is bowed the wood has to pull out of the grooves and can no longer be fully, 100%, in the grooves.
Bottom line is that the bottom is bowed into a shallow bowl shape and simply securely the bottom to the back of the box is not going to eliminate the sag in the middle of the bottom. There is no way that your "simplest fix" of 3 screws across the bottom into the back is going to flatten the 1/2" sag in the center of the bottom. Yes, it will flatten the *back* of the bottom but not the center of the bottom.
w/curve. If need be, try several techniques, see which one might work the best.
Bend the wood slowly (over a few hours, maybe), rewetting it periodically ( if need be), if those small cracking sounds are heard. Old air dried cure d wood will act like kiln dried wood.... sometimes difficult to rebend/resh ape, with either wet or steam bending. In these difficult cases, you hear d those small cracking sounds, as it's being bent/shaped.
Thanks for the advice. I'll rig up something that I can extend downward in small increments to apply pressure as I listen to the drawer bottom.
Martin Eastburn wrote in news:IiEOy.11705$__ snipped-for-privacy@fx28.iad:
Well, no, not really. To be plywood the layers have to have the grain going crosswise (or, rarely, at 45 degree angles). That is what gives plywood it's dimensional stability.
Granted there are modern day composites used for "plywood" cores that don't have grain, but those didn't exist when the first manufacturers started making plywood.
John
DerbyDad03 wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@googlegroups.com:
So you're saying there's 1/8" of sag? Based on a prior post where I think you said the sides extend 1/2" below the groove.
I don't think I'd worry about 1/8" of sag.
John
"...the gap between the straight edge and the bottom of the drawer at the center of the bottom."
That's pretty deeply bowed, indeed. Wonder what was in the drawers but
36" is a long unsupported span for what appears to be pretty thin material.
I haven't mic'ed the bottom, but it's probably 1/4". I'm not home right now, so that's just a guess.
No, I'm saying there is 3/8" sag on one drawer and 1/2" sag on the other.
I wouldn't either, but that's not what I have.
The hardwood brace/support also serves to strengthen the drawer structure somewhat - joining the drawer-front to the drawer back at the center. All the other discussion about just reversing the drawer-bottom curve, without adding bracing - seems like it might be temporary ? John T.
--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: snipped-for-privacy@netfront.net ---
...
"mic'ing" is a little overboard... :)
That's what I'd judged from the picture. Couldn't tell for certain if was ply or solid bottom.
I'd still go with the "dampen and weight/wait" ploy first, but was coming back to add that while I know you'd rather keep it original, with that large of a drawer if you really want it to be a functional piece again rather than just collector/display item, it may be that you should consider building new drawer bottoms. If there's some clearance below, in the aforementioned TN shop for SHMBO I replaced failed drawer bottoms with 3/8" solid soft maple stock (rabbeted edge, of course, to fit existing 1/4" groove). Soft maple because it's strong and neutral color/grain and not excessively obtrusively "modern" as a piece of current ply would be.
The alternative is, as also noted elsewhere and by others, use some external stiffener either on bottom or inside the drawer--another ploy in that regard that makes some more significant changes to the piece is to add a middle divider so that you have another support in the middle like the back. That, of course, changes the piece more but can be done without terrible damage so can be (mostly) reversed but would leave signs.
Note to the daughter -- if you do get these unbowed, _nothing_ heavier than the lightest of down pillows can be stored in those wide drawers... :)
Which means that you have to get the bottom fully into the grooves. Or, at least, far enough to remove the "belly". Once there, a couple of screws through the bottom into the sides should take care of it.
The question is, why did it bow in the first place? I can only think of two reasons...
On 04/11/2016 9:07 AM, dadiOH wrote: ...
The length of the arc for a 1/2" sag in the center for a chord length of
36" is 36.0185" -- thus the movement on either end of the bottom is only about 0.01". Not significant. There's no chance you can prevent that kind of movement in wood w/ a mechanical fastener from the side (besides the damage done to the piece in trying to do that)....
The most probable reason it bowed was that it had too much weight stored in the drawer for 100+/- year and it's simple relaxation over the unsupported span. No different than setting the set of encyclopedias or a 100-lb bust of Beethoven on a long, unsupported bookshelf and leaving them there--over time the shelf _will_ sag unless it's far more than just a 3/4" ordinary shelf. In this case, we don't know what was in the dresser, but whatever it was was too much for a minimal initial design. 1/4" is not enough material for a 36" drawer for anything but the lightest of loads.
On 04/11/2016 8:47 AM, snipped-for-privacy@ccanoemail.ca wrote: ...
Depends on whether the drawer is subsequently overloaded again or not.
I understand that you are trying to help, but it appears that you aren't quite grasping the situation. That is completely understandable, because you haven't actually seen/touched the drawers.
I'm not trying to be argumentative, but let me try it this way:
No amount of edge related reattachment is going to force the bottom of drawers to flatten out. There is far to much "tension" in the bow for that to work. Even if I push down in the center to remove most of the bow, there is still some waviness out towards the sides.
Maybe, just maybe, if I flattened the bottom by sandwiching it between flat pieces of stock and then added a *substantial* number of screws around the perimeter, that might hold it, but I'm not going to try that for 2 reasons:
1 - I still think the wood will win 2 - I'm not going to butcher the drawers by adding a multitude of screws.If I'm going to have to alter the drawers, I'll just replace the bottoms and try to finish them as close to matching as possible.
There are at least 2 more possibilities, probably a combination of both. I list these in no particular order:
- Obviously, years of weight on a 36" x 18" piece of 1/4" wood (or even plywood) could cause considerable warpage. I can't speak to the contents of the drawers over the years, but anything other more substantial than linens could certainly have warped the bottoms.
- The bottom side of the drawer bottoms are unfinished, the tops are finished with what I assume is varnish. I can only assume (I'm no expert by any means) that the raw bottom would have absorbed more moisture over the years, resulting in swelling/uneven movement.
Add weight to a "wet" board and you're exacerbating the problem
Bottom line, and I know you'd agree if you saw the drawers, the bottoms are bowed beyond the point where edge attachments are going to flatten them.
No, not from the side, through the side and bottom from the bottom of the side; i,e, vertically, not horizontally.
Never work, DD's perfectly correct in that; it's the side of the fastener that you're expecting to constrain less than 10-thou movement with--ain't a'gonna' happen, wood simply isn't that rigid, plus, as he says, it'll cobble up the drawer itself somethin' awful in the attempt.
HomeOwnersHub website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.