Tite Bond II...Hardware Store says it has the fewest complaints

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Does Tite Bond II have any track record with you guys? I was an elmers wood glue guy, but am willing to try new things. This TB II stuff claims to be for exterior use as well (water resistance, etc.)
The hardware store says that of all the wood-specific glues, they sell by far the most of the TB II. And of all the glues total, it's the one with the least complaints (none), and the glue with the most complaints is the elmer's wood.
Looking for experienced comments here. Having used everything to repair chairs before (from plain vanilla elmer's white to PL-400 <---- don't ask) I'm always looking for a great glue. When clamped properly the EWG was superb.
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Thomas G. Marshall wrote:

TB2 is a good, all purpose wood glue. Elmer's white softens easily with water, TB2 doesn't; it doesn't creep as much either.
--

dadiOH
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wrote:

Along those lines... What, besides the markeering on the bottle, is the difference between TB2 and TB3. Price, I know.
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krw wrote: ...

TB-III (3) passes ANSI Type-2 waterproof test; TB-II (2) only Type-I (I know, that TB product #3 is a #2 test is cornfoozing).
The difference is the level of water resistance; neither is truly waterproof as epoxy/resorcinal/etc. but use TB-III for exterior work that does get wet; otherwise no real reason to use it. Well, there is actually one other reason but not particularly related to the water-resistance issue; TB-III has quite a lot lower chalk temperature (I forget the exact number and am too lazy to look it up at the moment :), after all it is Labor Day <vbg>) but it's roughly 50F. That can be a benefit in exterior use as well.
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On Mon, 07 Sep 2009 10:27:50 -0500, dpb wrote:

TB3 also has a slightly longer open time than TB2 and is less runny than TB2.
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Larry Blanchard wrote: ...

There are also versions of TB-II that are more viscous (less runny) high tack. Particularly useful for trim, etc., but shorter open time.
Want to say it seems I recall that perhaps there's another that is longer open time but not absolutely positive w/o looking at full-line catalog. There's a darker Type-I as well that's less expensive than -III if want the color; don't recall about that for --II for sure, either.
All in all, if look at full product line, there's about anything one might want... :)
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On Mon, 07 Sep 2009 11:38:57 -0500, dpb wrote:

There is, but IIRC it's more like TB1 than 2 or 3.
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Now someone here is confused... I know I am. ;-)
http://www.titebond.com/ProductLineTB.asp?prodline=2&prodcat=1 "Titebond II Premium Wood Glue is the only leading brand, one-part wood glue that passes the ANSI Type II water-resistance specification. It is ideal for exterior woodworking projects, including outdoor furniture, birdhouses, mailboxes, planters and picnic tables."

<Didn't know what "chalk temperature" was so>
According to the Titebond site, TB2 is good to 55F and TB3 to 46F. Not too much of a difference.
The bottle also says that TB3 has a longer set-up time, which can be a benefit for klutzes like me.
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krw wrote:

...
...
Yeah, I realized later I'd turned the ANSI numbers around--see, I _told_ you it was confoozing... :)
You caught it before I got back to correct meself...thanks.
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krw wrote: ...

Almost 10F and that _can_ be key in cooler weather, particularly outdoors or in an unheated shop.
Note, of course, that not only the glue but the wood being glued needs to be at least as warm as the chalk temperature else it will simply cool the glue to below the threshold. Once there before set up and cured, it will not bond at all and will turn powdery (hence the term "chalk" temperature).

Doesn't have to be klutzy; complicated glueups can tax the skills of most anybody so the time is often useful indeed as well...
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My understanding is that TB2 sets rapidly, while TB3 has a longer setting time, thus allowing more time for adjustments in aligning complex glue-ups.
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There was a test done about 5 years ago compairing the wood glues. TB3 "claims" water proof over weather resistant for TB2. The magazine test showed TB2 to actually be more water resistant than TB3. If you read the fine print on the back of the bottle of TB3 you find that there is a reference to the testing lab qualifications for "water proof". Other than "Water Proof" being mentioned in the title of the test standard, from that point forward water resistant is the only compairison. The TB3 lable is as misleading as hell.
That said, TB3 is still a pretty good glue. Price wise 30-40% better than TB 2, IMHO no. I mostly buy TB3 because of the color of the product. It is tan in color and dries to a medium brown. For me the medium brown color looks better than YELLOW.
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Leon wrote:

...
I disagree; the label says what ANSI test the product(s) pass -- there is quite a lot of difference between the two test procedures and it is TB states the glue isn't to be used for locations that are immersed but is suitable for continuous moisture exposure.
Basically the difference is a water-resistant glue passes muster against the ANSI Type 2 Standard. TB didn't write the Standard; they simply developed products (as did all the other manufacturers) that meet the published specifications.
The Type 2 test is repeated cycle of a four-hour soaking of the cured glue joint followed by a dry bake. IIRC, the repeat count is also four. After this, the joint is tested for integrity.
The Type-1 ANSI Standard test for "waterproof" designation is similar except the test joint is boiled for four hours (instead of simply being soaked), then baked. The boil sequence is repeated then the sample is cooled w/ running water and tested for integrity while still wet.
What some other testing regimen may have done could be interesting if it represented some particular application one had in mind, but doesn't have much bearing on the specific qualification of any product to meet the ANSI Standard.
The ANSI Standard is simply what it is--a test regimen that indicates the ability of the product to withstand the test cycle as specified. It is simply a consistent measurement against which different products can be compared. It's really nothing different than a specific UL rating for other products; it has some meaning in that the product met the test requirements but one can't draw conclusions other than those directly observable from the results of the tests.
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Regardless of your interpritation of the fine details,
If you see a lable that says "WaterProof" would you expect more performance out of it than simply "Water Resistant" The lable is misleading as the glue is not "Water Proof".
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Leon wrote: ...

... Depends on what the meaning of "is" is, I guess... :)
I've been aware of the ANSI Standards for so long I guess I'm totally desensitized to the question/concern you're try to raise.
As for the determination that it doesn't perform better, I don't see any basis for the claim--they meet the standard they say they do and I've certainly never had a failure of TB-III in it's stated environmental usage to see there's anything whatever to complain about.
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Yeah! LOL

And if you are aware that is another case. I now know better. The trouble is the lable is bright green and pretty, it will attract the unaware.

IIRC it was Wood magazine that did a test on the products. There were 10 or so brands and types including the plyurethane glues. TB III and TB II were in the test and the tsts included water sprays, and soaks IIRC. Any way the article pointed out that TB II was superior to TB III in their test. There was a lot of noise about it after the article came out. As a result of the article I contacted Franklin and went back and forth with the Product Manager. He claimed that he was aware of the article and would be getting to the bottom of the situation. He sent me a case of TB III to give out to friends and I have not heard anything about it since. IMHO the lable should indicate "More Water Resistant" because to the comon knowledge customer, WaterProof is,
adj. 1.. Impervious to or unaffected by water. 2.. Made of or coated or treated with rubber, plastic, or a sealing agent to prevent penetration by water. n. 1.. A material or fabric that is impervious to water. 2.. Chiefly British. A raincoat or other such outer garment. TBIII is none of the above.
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dadiOH wrote:

> TB2 is a good, all purpose wood glue. Elmer's white softens easily with

Elmer's white glue is not Elmer's "Wood" glue. Elmer's Carpenter glue is not white, it is yellow, same as TB. One of the major differences from white glue and carpenters glue is creep. Elmer's yellow Carpenter glue creeps less than white glue, just as TB does. Personally, I've never had a problem with Elmer's Carpenters Glue, but would not hesitate to buy Franklin's TB. If they were side by side, I'd buy the one with the best price.
I don't particularly care what the salesman said about complaints, 35 or so years personal experience with Elmer's Carpenters glue w/o a complaint is enough for me. I have used TB and it was the same stuff, far as I could tell.
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Thomas G. Marshall wrote:

TB-I /-II are yellow carpenters' glues that are equivalent to any other on the market--I've used it by the 5-gal bucket over the years. I recommend it highly although there's little to commend it over any other reputable similar product; they're all essentially equivalent. In larger-volume times I've used the Woodworkers' Supply "Ol' Yeller" that's about 20% or so cheaper as well but one has to be in large production environments for the cost of "ordinary" glues to be sizable enough an expense to even be noticed.
All in all, use what's locally available at good pricing/convenience; there's really very little to pick one over another.
The only really significant difference is w/ the TB-III (and similar) products--they satisfy a higher level of water resistance and are indicated for exterior use or as noted in another response where the lower chalk temperature is a desirable trait.
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dpb wrote: ...

Sorry, forgot to add that the primary difference between the two is that TB-II passes the ANSI test for water resistance (note not water"proof")...
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Note: The ANSI Water Proof test that TB3 passes has nothing to do with being water proof, only water resistance. Kind misleading, huh?
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