Siezed Up Bolts

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Howdy Folks,
I am new here, so allow me to introduce myself. My name is Aaron Fagan. I am a professional magician and own the company NewLine Magic (www.newlinemagic.com), I build custom made magic stage props, as well as perform professionally.
Here is my problem: Ive started work on a project that requires a fairly large bolt to go through a 4X4. Anywho, the nuts I am using have the plastic on the inside to make the hold more strong (pardon me, im still elarning all the proper word!). Anyways, when screwing one on, I got it just tight enough that the bolt just broke into the plastic, I realized that the bolts were far to long for what I need. So naturally, I started to take the nut off to replace it with the proper length of bolt.
Long story made short, after lots of heaving, sore knuckles, and a can or two of WD-40 later, the nut will not move at all!
What should I do to remove this?
Thank you For your Help! -Aaron
--
--
http://www.newlinemagic.com
"The Impossible Made Possible."
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Hack saw
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Blue wrench. Dave

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wrote:

whaaaa......?
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I think that means "gas wrench"?
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Blue Key Blue Wrench Hot Key Hot Wrench
Cutting torch :)

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You forgot my personnal favorite...
the Chevy wrench

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Ah . .scenery.
If it's truly a custom job, you should dry fit with conventional nuts to make sure you didn't miss any details. You know that now, I'm guessing.
This is a job for a Sawzall. Cut off the offending bolt. Measure Twice, cut once, and all that good stuff.
Also, since it's scenery, it doesn't need to withstand close inspection--indeed close inspection is Death to the illusion, so feel free to remove and replace any facia elements.
Wouldn't a liquid threadlocker be more appropriate for this application? Seems you have to maintain the device, right?
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Aaron Fagan said:

Greetings and Welcome,
Nylon insert lock nuts are usually meant to be used once. The locking material deteriorates through multiple uses. As for removing the old nut, just cut the shaft of the bolt with a hacksaw. The hardware is much cheaper than your labor, right?
In the future, you may want to consider doing your mock-ups with regular nuts, and for anything that is to be repeatedly assembled, use two nuts jam-nutted together. Easier to remove and cheaper to boot - and just as secure if not more so than a nylon insert locking nut.
P.S. - Make sure to use large flat-washers between the heads of the screws or/and nuts and wooden material to prevent them from pulling into or through the wood.
FWIW,
Greg G.
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On Fri, 01 Oct 2004 14:10:32 -0400, Greg G. <> wrote:

That will work, but I'm not sure it's appropriate for this application.
If someone's going to be walking on this or it matters for safety reasons, you definitly want either a rated nylon insert or a threadlocking compound.
This is a case where you KNOW it'll hold X versus the vaguaries of hand torque.
Of course, if it need not be flown or stood upon, your method will work just fine :)
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U-CDK_CHARLES\Charles said:

Double nuts are used in many machinery applications - where the vibration and heat ranges they are subjected to far exceed anything a stage platform will be subjected to. The rocker arms on your car come to mind. On average, each one is subjected to temperatures ranging from -10dF to 250dF and slammed over 25 times per second and they don't come loose - that's 90,000 times an hour.

But they DO require proper tightening to be effective... I guess if you are dependant upon a bunch of drunken carnies's to assemble your stage, the nylon lock nuts would be more reliable... ;-)
By the same token, most machinery manufacturers require the replacement of said nylon locknuts on each disassembly.
FWIW,
Greg G.
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Greg wrote:

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Greg G. wrote:

Actually, the MIL-SPEC for them calls for 50 reuses. The all-metal nuts are rated for 5 if I recall correctly. There are also some with a Vespel insert that are good for 500, and they do achieve that--I remember commiserating with the poor tech who got to spend his day turning bolts in and out of those nuts.
This though assumes that the bolt is not burred--if it is burred the burr can cut the locking material, effectively destroying it.

This though, does not address the real issue, which is why the nut seized on the bolt to begin with--the nylon insert should not hold it that soundly--it sounds to me like there's something else going on there. If the nuts and bolts are stainless the metal could have seized--we ran into that problem on some bolts on the P-3 and C-130.

--
--John
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On Fri, 01 Oct 2004 15:51:31 -0400, "J. Clarke"

the nyloc ones wear out pretty quickly. the ones where the whole of the nut is made of spring steel- and is sprung slightly oval- last a long time.

right. if anything, the nylon should lubricate the bolt a bit.

stainless galling.

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snipped-for-privacy@thanks.com wrote:

That's a common misconception. When we had a problem with the nylon nuts on the P-3, the first thing my boss suggested was all-metal nuts. Checked the Mil-spec and found that they were rated for a much shorter life than the nylon nuts. Took it to the lab and found out that the spec was right.
Of course this was with mil-spec nuts procured to an MS number. It might be that the ones that one buys from hardware stores that do not specialize in MS and aviation-grade fasteners might not last as long.

Yep. Was a real pain--some genius had designed the thing with flat-head Allen bolts, which have a little tiny recess compared to regular socket-head cap screws. So they'd go in all right but trying to get them out after they'd been torqued the wrench stripped the hole every time and they had to drill. Fixed it with dry-film lubricant (I forget the brand now--it was 20 years ago).

--
--John
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J. Clarke said:

I seriously doubt that he is using MIL-SPEC fasteners. More likely he is using Chinese locknuts from the Borg. ;-)
From my experience with the BORG's fasteners, the heads break off before you can get a normal amount of torque on them...

This is true.
FWIW,
Greg G.
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The plastic insert is normally used only to prevent the nut turning under vibration or pressure. Sounds more like you jammed (cross threaded, or wrong thread pitch) the threads. As WD-40 didn't work, try lightly heating the nut with a torch then, with a box or socket wrench around it, tap lightly and repeatedy with a hammer.
If that doesn't work, you could get a nut splitter to remove it, but if the threads on the bolt are shot, you might as well use a hacksaw. GerryG

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No, No, No fellas. Didn't you guys read that he's a professional magician? All that's necessary is a large scarf to wave and the special words, Abra Ka Dabra, and whoosh, it's fixed!
Back to reality, I agree the simplest thing might be a hacksaw. If you can saw it down almost to the threads, you can possibly take a large chisel and spread the cut so that the rest of the nut breaks away from the threads or at least will back off with a wrench. I did something similar last week on my tractor. On it there was a 1" pipe screwed into the manifold. The pipe was once a part of the muffler itself but it had all wasted away. Using a pipe wrench on the pipe extending from the manifold, of course the pipe broke off even with the manifold leaving the rest embedded. I took my air-powered hacksaw and sawed down through the pipe almost to the threads. Then a chisel and hammer managed to break through the remainder of the pipe where I had sawed it. At that point a large pair of side-cutting pliers was used to grasp and twist the remaining pipe out of the socket sparing the threads. The new muffler then screwed right in like it should. Good luck. sdh.
GerryG wrote:

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I'm told the most effective stage prop any magician has is the scantily-clad assistant. It keeps your eyes from noticing the things that are "hidden in plain sight"
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Since no one has mentioned the obvious.
Have you waved you magin wand over it? '~)
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