Please...need help...ONE last electrical discussion...

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I'm new to woodworking, and thought I'd try here for advice first.
I just inherited my grandfather's tools, and one of them is an old Uniswaw. It's down in my basement now, and I would like to hook it up, but all the outlets down there are two-prongers and the saw is obviously three.
If I were to run a piece of wire from the cabinet of the saw over to one of the exposed water pipes, would that be enough grounding for me to be able to safely cut-off the third prong?
Also, if this is safe, how big a wire should I run? (The saw is 110 volts, BTW)
Thanks, Greg
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Does the house have well-water?
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No, it's city water.
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Hi, Greg.

I'd suggest you find a competent electrician who can: 1. determine what must be supplied to the saw, _and_ other devices that might share a branch circuit, 2. install appropriately-rated branch-circuit a/r, 3. in compliance with NEC.
Nothing like an electrical fire in the basement.
HTH, John
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"Kinda" is not the word!! ("Completely" would be my choice)
Unfortunately, my house is a rental, and I know my landlord won't pay to upgrade the wiring.
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wood snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote in

And he'd be less happy to clean up after the fire.
If this isn't a troll, after Rob's post, then call the electrician, like Barry suggested, or use this saw as an assembly table.
BTW, I don't belive Unisaws were ever delivered as 110v devices.
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I would recommend you seek help from one of the forums dedicated to DIY home wiring. I would personally recommend:
http://www.selfhelpforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f 
and
http://forum.doityourself.com/forumdisplay.php?f=9&page=1&sort=lastpost&order=&pp@&daysprune=-1
It is only code-compliant to run a ground to the water supply system in parts of Canada, and even then, it is not recommended. Do not cut the ground prong off the plug. There are other, better ways to solve your problem.
Steve
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I'm not sure what you mean by a "troll." But I can tell you that I don't think it's the original power cord. The cord looks a lot newer than the rest of the machine does.
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wood snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote in

In USENET terms, 'troll' is used like it would be in fishing. ie: Toss out a line, and see how many you can pull in.
Go find someone who really knows what they are talking about with regard to your grandfather's saw, and the wiring thereof. Have them come by, and look at what you have.
This hobby is fun, but ignorance can hurt you.
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snipped-for-privacy@sme-online.com wrote:

Not speaking to the OP directly since I'm not confident of his/her knowledge of basic electricals:
Another alternative - which may be more in keeping with the landlord/tenant sitchiation - would be to run an *appropriately * sized extension cord from an existing nearby correct voltage & amperage outlet to the saw. This custom cord would have the saw's female plug configuration on one end and the outlet's male plug configuration on the other.
--
Owen Lowe
The Fly-by-Night Copper Company
  Click to see the full signature.
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Recheck The motor, and that would be the inside wiring, not just the nameplate. Even our old R/I was wired 220, but it was capable of 110. Not that _I_ would ever do it, but some people have "made do" when they controlled both genders of plug.
Most basements, if wired to code, were grounded through the conduit, though a lot of folks, as you can tell, have done their own wiring. Think it's 9.95 for a polarity/continuity/ground checker at most home stores. Well worth it, because there are often hidden transitions to non-metallic pipe where plumbing has been repaired or moved.
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George wrote:

ground. This can be done by visual only.
Rob
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No, because you don't know if the water pipes are grounded or not - they could be PVC out to the street. They may or may not be bonded but it's not something you want to find out the hard way. Get some 12-2 with ground romex and run a new line from the panel box to a new grounded outlet. If you're not comfortable, have an electician do it. Shouldn't cost much at all.
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

Right answer, wrong reason.
Right reason is that you don't want to do that because an electrical fault in the saw could make the water pipes live. Bonding connections to metal interior water pipes are *always* made for the purpose of *removing* electricity.

You have no idea how much current that saw draws, and therefore no idea whether 12ga wire is suitable or not.

Didja see the part where he said he's *renting*? He can *ask* the landlord to do it, but if he does it himself (or hires it done) without the landlord's approval, he's probably violating his lease, and may find himself needing to look for other housing arrangements soon.

-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt. And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?
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Actually, I do have an idea how much that saw draws and 12-2w ground is fine so be sure to have some cream with your big cup of STFU. Yes, I did see that he's renting. I don't think that I need to spell out every step. Did you see that I didn't tell him to be sure to strip the ends of the wire? Didn't tell him to put a cover plate over the outlet either. Jesus but you're a pain in the ass.
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snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

You forgot to tell him which is the panel & which is the gas meter, too...
Rob
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wood snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

No. If you do that, and a ground fault occurs in the saw, you would electrify the water pipes. It is *never* safe to ground a circuit to interior metal water pipes.
It also is not safe to cut off the third prong.

First off, are you *sure* about the voltage? I thought Unisaws were all 240V (but I could be mistaken about that).
Second, wire size depends on *current*, not on voltage. No offense is intended, but if you didn't know that.... you shouldn't be trying to do your own wiring. Especially since (as you said in a later post) it isn't your house.
Check the rating plate on the saw's motor to see how much current it draws. If the motor is really 120V, and the circuit can carry the current that the motor needs, then you can ask your landlord to replace one of the receptacles with a ground-fault circuit interrupter (GFCI). That will accept your three-prong plug, and provide ground-fault safety even if the circuit isn't grounded.
-- Regards, Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt. And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?
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Are you sure it is 120v? Most motors over 1.5hp are 240v because the current requirement is too high. And if it is 120v, do you have 20a outlets in your basement? It is almost certainly over 15a. I suspect you will have to put in a new circuit whether you want to or not.
Assuming you make it through all that, and you don't want to put in a new circuit as someone suggested, and you don't have grounded conduit as someone suggested; a GFCI outlet ought to be good enough. There is no danger of a fire as a bunch of people said. The water pipe will either be a really good ground or a really poor ground; neither will start a fire. The issue is that you really don't want to get a shock while feeding wood into a table saw. A GFCI should prevent that. I have only tripped a GFCI once, but I didn't even feel it.
After putting in the GFCI outlet, you might want to attach a wire from the frame to a water pipe, as you suggest. It may not be adequate by itself, and it is certainly a code violation, but will act as a back up to the GFCI. No matter how bad the connection it, it will certainly be better than the path to ground through you. (I have said this mainly to annoy the electrical-police, but it is actually true. Any current through the "ground" (or through you, for that matter) will trip the GFCI instantly.)
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I just took off the motor cover and looked at the motor itself...it also looks relatively newer than the saw itself, and the voltage is listed at 110/220. I guess it's hooked up to 110, because it's a standard 110v cord.
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What's the amperage?
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