liquid hide glue

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Hello seasons greetings for all members. I am new to your group. I like to learn from the experience of members about making liquid hide glue.No branded liquid glue is available here in my and nearby cities.Hide glue is available. SaeedCh
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Hello seasons greetings for all members. I am new to your group. I like to learn from the experience of members about making liquid hide glue.No branded liquid glue is available here in my and nearby cities.Hide glue is available. SaeedCh
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Tue, Jan 18, 2005, 6:53pm (EST-3) snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (SaeedCh) claims: Hello seasons greetings for all members. I am new to your group. I like to learn from the experience of members about making liquid hide glue.No branded liquid glue is available here in my and nearby cities.Hide glue is available. SaeedCh
Seems pretty farfetched, no glue available, except hide glue. Where are you located?
JOAT Charity ain't giving people what you wants to give, it's giving people what they need to get. - Albert
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I am near lahore.Various glues are available but are not of animal origin.I want to make liquid hide glue to use it easily.Thankyou.SaeedCh J T wrote:
claims:

hide
people
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Wed, Jan 19, 2005, 7:45pm (EST-3) snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (SaeedCh) says: I am near lahore.Various glues are available but are not of animal origin.I want to make liquid hide glue to use it easily.Thankyou.SaeedCh
Well, here's instructions for making hide glue, from scratch, which is what Iake it you want to do: http://www.uqac.uquebec.ca/PleinAir/toolsgl1.htm
This site has a LOT on using it: http://www.frontier.iarc.uaf.edu:8080/~cswingle/archive/get.phtml?message_id 3866&submit_thread=1
I take it you're going to use it for woodworking. What type of woodworking?
JOAT Charity ain't giving people what you wants to give, it's giving people what they need to get. - Albert
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On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 12:14:57 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (J T) wrote:

You can make hide glue by cutting rawhide into tiny pieces and cooking it gently with water until it becomes thick and vicsous. Strain it, pour it onto a metal sheet and alow it to dry. Then flake it off and pound the larger chunks down to a convenient size.
Result: hide glue.
Here's a method from a Web site: (note that vellum is pretty much the same as rawhide for our purposes)
If you want to make your own hide glue to use in gesso, or for other projects, it is easy enough to do.
4 ounces of vellum scraps 2 pints of distilled water a small enamel pot piece of loosely woven cloth (to use as strainer) bowl can be disposable plastic
Bring the water to a boil then reduce the heat to simmer and add the vellum scraps. Do not let the water boil once the vellum is added to it. This will reduce the effectiveness of the resulting glue. Allow this to simmer for one and a half hours (about half of the water will evaporate). Remove the pan from the heat and allow it to cool slightly. Strain it through a plain white piece of loosely woven cloth into a clean bowl. Let the glue to sit at room temperature in a cool, dry place out of direct sunlight overnight. It will congeal into a jelly. Turn the bowl upside down and remove the jelly onto a piece of plastic wrap. Slice the jelly into inch slices and allow to dry out of sunlight. This will take several days.
To use the glue: take a slice or two of the dried glue and warm it in a bit of water. You can do this in a small metal or ceramic dish over a candle or on a stove burner. Once again do not allow it to come to a boil or it will be useless as glue. "Sometimes history doesn't repeat itself. It just yells 'can't you remember anything I've told you?' and lets fly with a club. -- John W. Cambell Jr.
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On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 22:56:18 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@TAKEOUTmindspring.com wrote:

I was warned off this for archival work and told to always work with fresh hide, not dried rawhide. Rawhide isn't entirely "raw".
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On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 01:03:42 +0000, Andy Dingley

For archival work, perhaps. But I don't think it matters for carpentry/cabinetmaking. However if you can get fresh, de-fleshed and de-haired hide, then by all means use it.
--RC "Sometimes history doesn't repeat itself. It just yells 'can't you remember anything I've told you?' and lets fly with a club. -- John W. Cambell Jr.
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On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 01:48:03 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@TAKEOUTmindspring.com wrote:

Sorry, not "archival". I meant restoration work on quality stuff, but woodwork not books.
No-one has been fool enough to let me loose on them yet, but there's a 17th century oak chest that needs a few replacement decorative split turnings making for it. I'm thinking of hide glue rather than wax as an adhesive.
Also some sword work (I've never worked on anything before 1800 before 8-) ), but that's rice glue.
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I know glue making in detail as I served for 20 years in a quality hide glue factory in a senior position.The problum is to make liquid hide glue to avoid daily heating.
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Fri, Jan 21, 2005, 11:01pm (EST-3) snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (SaeedCh) says: I know glue making in detail as I served for 20 years in a quality hide glue factory in a senior position.The problum is to make liquid hide glue to avoid daily heating.
Ah. I don't know how to make it either, altho it might be on the web, somewhere. But, would milk (caesin) glue work for you instead? There are recipes for that on the web.
I don't think I ever read what you want to glue.
JOAT Charity ain't giving people what you wants to give, it's giving people what they need to get. - Albert
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Thankyou JOAT,SILVAN,and ANDY for your response.The others are discussing Kippling under the title Liquid Hide Glue.See You Again. SaeedCh
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I know glue making in detail as I served for 20 years in a quality hide glue factory in a senior position.The problum is to make liquid hide glue to avoid daily heating for making furniture..
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SaeedCh wrote:

So the problem is that you can't get commercially-prepared liquid hide glue in Pakistan?
--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan < snipped-for-privacy@users.sourceforge.net>
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yes of course you undrstand the problum.
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On Wednesday 19 Jan 2005 2:53 am, SaeedCh scribbled:

Hide glue is typically melted in a glue pot and applied hot. For some detailed instructions, you could go to:
http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Luthier/Technique/Glue/UseHideGlue/usehideglue1.html
or any number of luthier sites you can easily find on Google.
In North America, we can also get liquid hide glue commercially, but I have no idea how they make it.
Here in the Yukon, we also use water the same way as a wood glue. Melt it, apply it to the wood, clamp it, leave it outside and in a few hours and then it is impossible to take apart. Stonger than the wood. :-)
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Hello Saeed,
I'm not quite clear what you're after? Am I right?
You do have non-liquid hide glue. This is solid beads that you soak in water then heat in a pot.
You want a cold liquid hide glue, like this http://www.titebond.com/IntroPageTB.ASP?UserType=1&ProdSel=ProductCategoryTB.asp?prodcat=1 It's stored in a bottle, ready for immediate use.
Now as far as I know, it's not practical to make your own liquid hide glue. It's a complicated bit of chemistry and Titebond is the only brand commercially available, because the simpler formulations just don't keep well.
I have an old (1921) copy of Spon's Workshop Receipts, which includes a number of recipes for liquid hide glue. None of them are particularly reliable! Some use hide glue and nitric acid, one uses 2 parts of hide glue and one part of whisky, kept in a well-stoppered bottle ! These just aren't recipes that are easy to make, are particularly safe to make, or seem reliable for storage.
I like liquid hide glue and I use it a lot. But I could manage without, either by making up hot hide glue when I needed it, or by using white PVA glue that is cheaply and commonly available.
If there's a problem with hide glue, posssibly because of the use of cows, then you might be able to use fish glue or rabbit-skin glue instead. I also use rabbit-skin glue a lot, especially for paper and bookbinding. Unlike hide glue it is flexible when dried, but otherwise it's quite similar.
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On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 05:22:31 +0000, Andy Dingley wrote:

(idle curiosity) Do you know how cow and rabbit glues differ? Collagen is collagen, one would think. Perhaps the difference isn't species, but hoof versus skin?
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On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 09:40:21 -0600, Australopithecus scobis
Well I can tell which is which when I'm using them, but not as to _why_.

One is Kim Basinger's lips, one is a boiled cow ?

AFAIK, hide glue is made from hides, not from hooves. Although you could make glue from hooves and the various internal gristly bits, they take too much cooking to be worthwhile. So for at least a century or two the hooves went off for either fertiliser or case-hardening steel, and the glue was made from un-tanned trimmings of the tanning trade, or from old horses.
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On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 09:40:21 -0600, Australopithecus scobis

Don't know the chemical differences, but the differences in the results are quite obvious. This was known at least as far back as the middle ages.
There's also fish skin glue, which is like rabbit skin glue, only more so.
--RC "Sometimes history doesn't repeat itself. It just yells 'can't you remember anything I've told you?' and lets fly with a club. -- John W. Cambell Jr.
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