I need some advice from the experts.
I have been debating with my niece regarging fitchen flooring and so far we
have determined the following:
Ceramic tile: Too hard. Any glassware that drops to the floor will
instantly shatter. Grout sucks up spills like a sponge leading to the
dreaded sour milk smell.
One piece linoleum: Generally looks like crap. A real bitch to install.
Peel and stick squares: They move over time and they generally don't last
too long. Looks cheap.
Wood Flooring: The right floor lasts but installing over a concrete slab
can be a real challenge if one wants to avoid that hollow sound. The
finish doesn't wear well with high traffic and the dogs running with their
nails is a concern. The added height of the wood floor can be an issue.
Then there is the issue of spills.
She mentioned cork flooring. Sounds ok but periodic re-coatings are
necessary. Are there any disadvantages to cork flooring that I should know
What is your take on cork flooring?
Never had that problem in my last house. Some day I'll have at again in
this house. Loved it. Easty to care for, always looked fantastic. We used
some Italian quarry tile. As for the glassware, I've never dropped a pice
on any floor that did not break. Ceramic is my first choice.
It has improved from what it used to be. I had mine installed by a pro
though. Not as easily cleaned as ceramic, it is decent looking and has good
Yes, last choice.
Consider engineered wood or laminate. Done right, they are durable and the
spil problem is minimal. I have an area with WilsonArt laminate that is in
perfect dondition after about 8 years. I have Mannington engineered wood in
my family room and hallway and it is still good after two years. Factory
finisher are verey durable.
I don't know a lot about it, but it would not be my choice for a kitchen.
not sure I agree with you there. the kitchen i'm redoing has 1 ft.sq vinyl
tiles that looked great. They've stood up remarkably well to the abuse of
the kitchen demolition and construction. We're going to be putting
porcelain tile over them because I like it but I was pretty impressed with
how well the vinyl holds up. I suppose riverdancing on it in golf shoes
would tear it up pretty well though.
Mine is laid directly over the slab and it doesn't provide much protection
against glasses shattering. Some underlayment would have done wonders for
it but I suppose that adds it's own problems.
It sounds as if things like dogs and kids and spills are major factors.
Sheet vinyl doesn't have seams, at least not many of them, is reasonably
easy to install, wears ok, and isn't too hard to replace or even floor over
for when those kids are grown (and have stopped spilling things). It's not
going to be gorgeous but it sounds as if wear and ease of cleaning are your
drivers at present.
I think you a re referring to commercial vinyl tile, *not* peel & stick, The
stuff like you would see in a grocery store. It's attached with troweled on
mastic. I put this on my laundry room/untility space and I really like it.
On Sat, 28 May 2005 14:21:50 GMT, "R. Pierce Butler"
Have it, love it.
I don't know about "re-coatings." I installed a cork laminate (8" x 4'
planks) which is prefinished (doesn't that sound oxymorinish?).
What we love about it is the feel, both with and without shoes on.
It's not soft. It doesn't exactly feel cushiony. But you know you're
on a comfortable surface. It's also a "warm" surface. Not so
temperature-wise, but imagine what your bare foot feels like standing
on stone or tile. There is absolutely none of that with cork. And it
feels "warmer" than wood. It's hard to explain, but when you go to the
flooring store, put down a sample of cork, take off your shoes and
socks, and stand on it and see if you experience the same thing before
they throw you out.
What really impressed me was, expecting it to be quite soft and easily
damaged, after having the dining room table in place for several
weeks, I had to move it and there wasn't even a hint of a mark from
the four quarter-sized plastic feet. Nothing. Again, ours is laminate
(approximately 1/8" surface layer), and other installations may not be
Although one thinks of cork as very soft and porous it doesn't act
like it. Water spills wipe up easily and don't seem to soak in,
although the care instrudtions advise not to leave any liquids on the
The one downside? Unlike the wood laminate flooring I've installed
elsewhere whose seems are virtually invisible, the seams on our
laminate seemed as if I had hammered the planks together too hard and
raised a slight, I don't know; welt? where the boards meet. I assure
you I didn't hit them too hard, especially in the final 3/4 of the
installation after I saw how they looked.
However, seams are seams, and every floor has some sort of quirky
Now, having said all that, we barely have a year with our floor.
However, based on what we've experienced so far, we would install it
There was anotherr advantage; I now have a lifetime supply of material
from which to make clamping pads from the leftover planks.
You have to assume that any thing that falls to ANY floor will break. If it
does not, you are LUCKY. I have had ceramic tile floors in my kitchen for
16 years and before that I had vinyl flooring. Since we seldom drop
breakable items on the floor we seldom have a problem even with a 2 year old
16 years ago. I would not use glass breakage as an excuse to not have a
nice floor. Additionally I have never witnessed any smell that developed
Actually linoleum is pretty nice. You are probably talking about vinyl
flooring. Linoleum is pretty rare these days and yes vinyl flooring does
look pretty crapy.
IMHO worse than vinyl flooring.
Agreed, especially for a kitchen. Consider also, laminate flooring. While
I would not consider the Pergo type floors an "upgrade" it does wear very
well and pets wont scratch it.
If you are considering cork flooring, you might want to revisit REAL
linoleum flooring, not vinyl flooring. You will probably have a hard time
finding a supplier or installer unless you live in a large city.
My mothers kitchen floor is >32 years, real linoleum. Cats in the
house. Apart from a few tiny (less than 1mm diameter) burn marks where
burning coal pieces fell out of the kitchen stove it looks as good as
Armstrong makes a floor which is similar to wood floor but looks like tile.
It comes in 15" x 45" sections which latch together like the wood floor but
have a nice strong covering. I've dropped stuff on them a few times
without damage, seems to hold up real well.
On Sat, 28 May 2005 14:21:50 GMT, "R. Pierce Butler"
Looks beautiful, and is easy on the feet. I like it an awful lot, but
I'm just getting around to installing it, so a review would be
You forgot to add the engineered products that are around. Some of
those that are made from recycled pop bottles and the like actually
look pretty close to a real wood floor, but are very tough and
completely waterproof. A really good choice for a kitchen, IMO.
They're not always cheap, but neither is cork!
This is just not true with a proper installation (seal the grout).
Not a bitch if you pay a pro. This is a job where I definitely hire a
pro.It's not that expensive, it requires that you have a some experience
while not requiring a decades of apprenticeship and most importantly, the
popential screwups have costly fixes.
I've had the peel and stick vinyl tiles in a decent pattern that lasted
18 years and was still in decent shape when we sold.
The dog factor led me to install a Pergo laminate floor a few years ago.
Looked good even though it was a bitch to install(kept moving around on
me) and has held up great. Does not take moisture well at the edges so
make sure to finish out per factory specs. We used the older glue down
which was a real pain. Glue all over everybody. The new stuff can be
laid down without glue. Haven't tried it though so I cannot comment.
Dogs did not scratch it since it is really hard.
You might take a look at bamboo also if it is locally available. I have
not seen it up close but it is hard and is renewable. I think it looks
Good luck with the project whatever you choose.
Am I the only person who thinks dog ownership is a really bad idea for
most people? I like dogs as much as the next guy, maybe even more than
most people who actually own them, but I just don't see owning one is
rational in the 21st century. The same goes for cats for the most part,
although some of them serve a purpose in keeping rodent populations at
bay, although the cure is arguably as bad as the disease. The problems
I have went through because of dogs is just too many to list, but here's
a sampler: getting bitten riding my bike on a public street. The fear
of being attacked just by walking, jogging or biking down any street.
Constant barking from every direction day and night. Yep, my next door
neighbors have six dogs between the three houses. Two of them are rabid
Rottweiler looking things that just go apeshit every second I'm in my
backyard. Fortunately it's just a strip behind the garage and there
isn't much reason to go out there except to mow the grass or take out
the trash. Incalculable property damage done. Whole houses full of
carpet destroyed, furniture, grass, window sills, siding all destroyed
by dogs. Men, women and especially small children maimed and killed by
dogs. I know of a few tragic cases just in my circle of acquaintances
over the years and seeing some of the dogs people kept, I'm actually
surprised there weren't more. I know most people aren't going to agree
with me, but it really doesn't make much sense. Most of us don't have
any sheep to herd or fox to hunt, so what's the point?
This will probably turn into a rather long thread. I have to agree with
much of what you wrote. We've had dogs for many years, but our last one, at
14, had to be put down last year. I don't miss having one. No worries
about getting back home if we go out, no boarding if we go away for a couple
Dogs can be good companions though. What gets me are the people that treat
dogs like children, or even better. No dog has ever slept in our bed.
A couple of houses away, there are five dogs. I'm not looking forward to
sitting out this summer if they don't get some control over the barking. Of
course it is the owner, not the dogs at fault here and in many dog related
Dogs are given much more lenient treatment than any human being. I
can't think of anyone who would sit on a couch after a naked man who
seldom bathed had been rolling all over it, but replace that image with
a dog and it is suddenly A-OK.
The last time I was bit by a dog, it was a pure-bred, pampered Dalmatian
that was just running around loose. It wasn't a particularly mean dog,
but I was riding my bike and that's just what dogs do. I was able to
find the owner and she acted like the whole thing was my fault. She
said I should have acted aggressive to the dog instead of just trying to
ride away. I sent her the doctor bill for the tetanus shot and she
complained about that too. I don't remember what I said to her, but she
paid it without any more arguments.
I just love dogs. The clumsier, the bigger, the goofier, the better.
My wife insists that I was a dog in a previous life. Dogs and I get
along. The odd one that wants to bite me as I ride by on my bike, gets a
shot of pure lemon juice in the eyes... sorry pup.
I currently don't own one, because we want to some travelling and we
don't want the bother.
From a practical standpoint, I completely agree with most that Hax has
written. They're basically a pain in the ass. They do a lot of damage
and cost a lot of money and time.
But i love them just the same. My friends' dogs.
If, as someone said, the measure of a person's intelligence is how much he
agrees with you, then you are an absolute genius!
I replaced a front lawn with roses, at least in part because I was tired of
cleaning up after other peoples' dogs. It's _not_ less work, or less
water, but it smells better!
ps: I have a neighbor with a bumper sticker: "Life begins when the kids
move out and the last dog dies!"
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