Dorf needs wiring help...

Dear All,
I am used to Leeson and Baldor motors where you open the cover and there are only three wires. You throw some wire nuts on the white-white, black-black, green-green and Keef's your list mom.
I have never seen a terminal bus under the motor cover with so many coloured (colored, Keith) wires before,
http://members.rogers.com/moreweb/images/wiring.jpg
And I find it hard to beleive that they have been so kind as to suggest where the wires should go with the two dinky brown wires. From the image, does it look that simple? Plug black and white into where the little brown wires are, with the green ground going to the green/yellow at the top of the bus in the image?
Background, this is a made in Italy, Lafert 3 hp, 220 volt, single phase, metric flange mount motor for my Wadkin/Bursgreen 20" bandsaw.
<<while idiot boy has his Klein linesmen pliers out, he decides to tackle wiring a magnetic starter, afterall, just how dangerous can 220 volts at 30 amps be?>>
I am pretty sure I have a handle on this one, but I thought I would check here with my imaginary friends,
http://members.rogers.com/moreweb/images/mag.jpg
I have my little red P1 and P2 where I am pretty sure juice flows in from the grid of mystery, and M1 and M2 where the motor should be wired to.
This is from a DanFoss magnetic starter.
Looks correct?
Thanks,
David.
Every neighbourhood has one, in mine, I'm him.
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Can't help you with the electrics, but was just thinking what a bummer it must be for you to have that machine so close to firing up, but not being able to because of wiring hassles! I had the same problem when I got my MiniMax bandsaw; had to run a new line from the breaker, mount a new plug, and build a pigtail before I could throw the switch. The torture! :-)
--
To reply, change the chemical designation to its common name.


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Have you looked for a web site about this motor. There are several sites that have info on American made motor wiring. Perhaps the Italians are as enlightened.
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On 03 Oct 2003 04:43:17 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.comGreg (Gfretwell) Crawled out of the shop and said. . .:

ok, here goes another pun thread, , ,
the italians may not be as enLIGHTened as one might like to think. perhaps they thought to hard about the engineering of this motor and had a BLACKOUT?
Traves *G*
sorry gang,,,but with this one i just had to
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Traves W. Coppock <newsgroups-AT-farmvalleywoodworks-DOT-com> wrote:

Given that it's an A.C. motor, I can state authoritatively: "That's re-volt-ing!"
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On Fri, 03 Oct 2003 08:27:54 GMT, bonomi@c-ns. (Robert Bonomi) Crawled out of the shop and said. . .:

LOL
im sure someone will get a CHARGE out of this one. . .
T
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snip of pun goobly guk
David: i sent an email to my B.I.L. who is an engineer over at Leeson Motors in grafton wi.
actually i sent him a copy of the OP, and the links to the pics...might have a solid answer by tomorrow night.
T
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On Fri, 03 Oct 2003 01:59:45 GMT, "David F. Eisan"

Yes.
If you care, try re-drawing the circuit, stretching the terminal block out into individual dots to represent the conenctions, and then comparing it to a standard circuit in a motors book (Try the old woodworking machines site)
It's a basic single phase motor circuit. One start cap, one run cap. The "SE" blob is a timer to cut the start winding in, then switch it out.
OTOH, I'd _never_ wire a workshop motor in with that grade of chocolate block connector. Get some decent stuff, with reasonably sized connectors and a shim under the clamp screw noses. If you put multi-strand cable into a bare-screw connector like that, it minces the end and you get a poor connection. Run a few HP through it, and it'll start getting hot.

BTW - when was your bandsaw made ?

Check the power rating for the overload relay.
Add a safety microswitch to the door(s) over the wheels and blade. This should be a proper industrially-rated switch for machine guarding; they're a "forced disconnect" (you won't care, your insurers might) but also they're a bit better sealed - and bandsaws are a high-dust environment that will kill a normal V3 switch.
If you care, you can borrow a contactor way to drive a DC.
-- Smert' spamionam
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On Fri, 03 Oct 2003 10:39:59 +0100, Andy Dingley
snip

death to spamers?
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Good morning David,
Comments here, there and everywhere.
"David F. Eisan" wrote ... in part ...

are
black-black,
Ah, those days of yesteryear ... the Duke of URLs happily churning out links to ... well, everything. Come back Keefer, all is forgiven! (1)

the
You may believe ... see note below.

With a few checks, you should be humming. Your motor, on the other (othere David?) hand should be humming AND working. (2)
Your motor appears to be connected properly, though you don't show the ground wire. And yes, I realize you are using SJO cord of the appropriate size, not the little bitty brown wires (though the electrons really don't care what color insulation you use).
The ~ symbol is the line input ... stands for a sine wave, which in this case indicates the connection to your AC power source. If you number the terminal blocks 1-5 from left to right (or as in your picture, lower left to upper right), you'll connect your line to 1 and 4, and ground to 5.
If you need to reverse the motor direction, you will need to swap the position of the wires marked A and C (move A (large black wire) to 4, move C (large red wire) to 1). Sure beats putting a 180 twist in the belt!
On your overload, we'll take the power side first, then the coil side.
Contactor: You show M1 on the contactor, NOT the overload ... which is the device below the contactor (has the red reset button. You also do not appear to have jumpered 2 and 4 on the overload (bottom left and bottom center. This allows current to flow through all three heaters (shown as two right angle wire turns inside the boxes).
Coil: If the red wire on the right side is connected from 95 (overload normally closed contact) to A2 (second contactor coil connection), and 4 is connected to 96, you should be able to pull toe contactor in. Wired this way, however, the ONLY way to shut it off is to kill the power to the input. I personally don't like this sort of arrangement; I'd rather have the Start and STOP buttons co-located. You can easily wire a remote start-stop setup, but beware that the voltage on the buttons will be 220 VAC. Connect a normally open pushbutton (properly rated, of course) across the contactor auxiliary (that's the thing with the green button). One wire to 3, the other to 4. You have placed an external switch in parallel with this auxiliary. Mark this switch START (it helps if it has a green button on it). Then, remove the wire from 4 to 96 (I think I see it there), and wire a normally closed switch (STOP) in place of the wire you just removed. It's helpful to have this button RED. If you notice, you have two switches connected to 4 ... this can be a single wire running from the contactor box to your remote start-stop box.
You can purchase a start-stop box with the required switches (in the correct colors), ready to wire and mount. Since the only current flow through these switches and the associated wiring is the contactor coil, you're only looking at a few hundred milliamps (less than 1 amp).
David, I hope this helps with your restoration project.
Regards,
Rick
(1) Yes, I know.
(2) I have heard that electrical devices hum because they don't know the words. This is incorrect; they do know the words, they just don't want to admit it.
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Dear Rick,
Thanks for all the wonderful info!

The little bitty brown wires were there from the factory, they will be replaced with 12/3 from the magnetic starter.
<snip of a whole bunch of stuff that I, mostly understood>
http://members.rogers.com/moreweb/images/mag.jpg
This box does have a cover with push buttons built into it. The little tiny green button on the middle right is pushed in by a large green button on the switch cover to start things up.
In the wiring diagram for the contactor it shows that 2 & 4 should be connected for single phase wiring. While my picture does not show a wire there, the "heater" does the connecting for me. Beneath the contactor you can see the overload protection unit. Protruding from it are two posts that are screwed in under terminal 2 & 4 on the contactor. The switch for breaking the circuit is on the overload, it is the red button on the lower right and is actuated by a big red mushroom button on the switchplate cover.
Does this additional info make my wiring layout work correctly?
Thanks,
David.
Every neighbourhood has one, in mine, I'm him.
Remove the "splinter" from my email address to email me.
Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ.
rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq / Archives http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search Crowbar FAQ http://www.klownhammer.org/crowbar
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Just glad to be here and pass along what I can.

Probably just enough wire to test run the motor (without a load you can get away with all sorts of silly things like that ... for a while.

What parts are unclear? I'm trying to improve my writing ... the curse of most technical people is an inability to communicate outside their speciality ... I'm trying to break out of that mold.

tiny
the
Saw that little green button and figured that would do it.

that
cover.
First, unless you have a wire or a link (big flat piece of wire bent into a "U" (not ewe!) shape) connecting 2 and 4, you won't get anything. IF 2 is connected to 4 below the overload unit (called a heater ... because when current flows, it heats little coils inside the unit. Too much current makes too much heat causing a bi-metallic spring to sprong and release the switch held closed.
You have a multimeter (digital or analog)? If so, you can press in the black "buttons" right below the Danfoss name on the contactor (without power applied ... please), and measure the resistance from 1 to 3 on the top (should be a short), and from 5 on top to 6 on the bottom of the overload (again should be a short).
No meter? Then connect a light bulb (one 220 volt bulb or two 110 volt bulbs in series) where the motor leads are supposed to connect. Apply power, press green button ... light should come on. Press red button, light should go off. (I think you knew that!)
I haven't worked with this type of motor starter in such a long time, I forgot the reset button is also the off button. You don't need to do further on/off wiring, unless you feel a strong need.

I think, Sir, that you indeed have tamed the wild electron. Well done, Sir, well done.

And thanks to you for all of your contributions to the public mayhem commonly mistaken for Rec.Norm !

Rick
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Check to see if this motor is for use in US or Europe, US uses 60 cycles and Europe 50, could be a big problem if mismatched.
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