upstairs now too warm

[ronald]

I have gas warm air heating and I only had 100mm insulation in the loft so decided to increase it.

I now have about 300mm in the loft.

And what a difference it has made. Before if downstairs was 21C upstairs was the same. Now when downstairs is 21C upstairs is 24C, in fact when the heating is on upstairs is always about 3C warmer.

I can even turn the heating off an hour earlier at night now than last year.

I have experimented with the vents etc but upstairs is always warmer. I know that heat rises but this is too much.

The problem with this is that I sit upstairs on my computer and my wife, who always feels cold, sits downstairs watching tele and won't hear of turning the thermostat down so downstairs is cooler.

My house was built in 1991 with no insulation between upstairs and downstairs, just plasterboard for the ceiling and chipboard for the floors with a 100mm space.

So if I put insulation betweeen the floor would it make any difference or just take longer for the upstairs to heat up. Because we are both retired the heating is on from 8:30 to 22:00 and as I said there is no way my wife is turning down the temp downstairs. Of course it doesn't help that there is a computer in the room upstairs pumping out warm air as well.

I have a min max thermometer with a remote sensor and last night downstairs went down to 12C while upstairs was 17C, Before the temp was about the same. Of course the large temp drop downstairs is because of the large draughty vents BG made us put in. You can practically see the heat escaping to the outside. And they made us take the cupboard door off as well

I would cover them up but that would mean getting up and going downstairs to uncover them before the heating came on in the morning.

Or do I just have to live with it and open a window and heat up the outside?

And I am using less gas as well Ron

[mogga]

Change the way you use your house? Have a living room upstairs?

[Cicero]

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You could experiment with a large down-draught fan (one of those 36" light fans) located at the top of the stairs. They are recommended for this kind of use although not usually in a stairwell as far as I know.

Cic.

[ronald]

I did suggest that but my wife said no :-)

[John Rumm]

I think you are trying to solve the wrong problem. Perhaps a solution would be to reduce the heat loss of the downstairs area such that it matches that of upstairs.

Have you got cavity wall insulation? Failing that could you dry line etc?

[ronald]

Of course the large temp drop downstairs is because of the large draughty vents BG made us put in. You can practically see the heat escaping to the outside. And they made us take the cupboard door off as well

If I keep the kitchen door shut during the night there is a difference in temp between the living room and the kitchen, however because of all the vents as it is warm air heating, keeping doors shut and trying to isolate rooms is a bit difficult.

Ron

[Peter Andrews]

Are the vents that BG put in absolutely essential - the reason I ask is that a neighbour asked me to install a vent in the front of her kitchen cupboard, that houses her floor standing gas heater, because BG said the regulations required it - despite that the cupboard has no top and didn't reach the ceiling!!

Equally when we had a water CH system and condensing boiler installed in our village hall they insisted on knocking a 6 x 6 inch hole as a vent for the now disused wall heaters - despite that they had been keeping the hall warm for 25+ years without the vent.

Peter

PS I'm not a gas fitter but I do have a bit of common sense.

[Dave Liquorice]

Are these for combustion air? Can that not be drawn directly from outside into the heating unit, presumably the combustion gases are vented outside already... Just like a room sealed boiler does?

Alternatively can the cupboard with the heating unit in it (with door refitted and draft proofed) be given sufficient ventilation from outside? You can get "draft proof" ventilators that have a long baffled path inside them that still allow the free air ventilation but slow down drafts.

The heated air within the house being circulated with only the minimal trickle ventilation as required for health of the occupants and building.

[Chris J Dixon]

To what degree have you been able to close off the upstairs vents? What happens if you temporarily blank off the vent(s) completely in your computer room?

Do you have an open plan staircase, or all you downstairs doors open?

Chris

[GMM]

On my warm air setup, the combustion air is drawn from an external vent (Only found this when it became blocked by a wasps' nest). Nonetheless, there seems to be an awful lot of 'other' ventilation built into the place and every time the blokie comes to service it (not BG, thank god), he witters a bit about adding ventilation. I'm sure the OP will be thinking what I'm thinking, ie 'let's junk the whole lot and get a proper system'.

MInd you, this thread is a good excuse for not going up and unrolling the extra fibreglass rolls that have been sitting in my loft for a while.....

[NT]

Why has noone yet suggested turning down the TRVs upstairs? Or, failing that, turning donw the flow valves on the other end of the rads. Or failng that, adding a separate thermostat plus electrically controlled TRV heads.

NT

[ronald]

every year it was always something, first he took the flyscreen off the vent and ruined it, I had to buy a new vent without a flyscreen. next year the holes in the floor under the vent weren't big enough.

Next time he stuck a notice on the cupboard door saying keep it closed all the time. Next time the vents in the door were too small.

Then it was either cut a hole through the outside door or external wall as under floor venting wasn't enough or take the cupboard door off so the cupboard then became part of the kitchen. I'm just wondering what they will come up with next time when it comes up for its service.

I am determined that I will not get rid off my heating, next door ripped it out and put in radiators and a new boiler in his garage I asked him if he was using less gas. NO he said slightly more. Yet every time I go into his house it feels cold.

What do people have against warm air heating? Gas heats the air the house gets warm. With radiators the gas heats water which is pumped round radiators to heat the air. seems wastefull to me.

Wife went out 2 hours ago so I turned off the heating. Temp still the same as it was 2 hours ago.

Wonder what will happen if I put another layer of insulation in the loft?

Ron

[ronald]

Why has noone yet suggested turning down the TRVs upstairs? Or, failing that, turning donw the flow valves on the other end of the rads. Or failng that, adding a separate thermostat plus electrically controlled TRV heads.

Because if you read the OP properly you will see that there are no radiators it is WARM AIR

Ron

[Owain]

You don't have to unroll them, but you might need more to cover the same area :-)

Owain

[Owain]

I guess the clue's in the 'warm air' bit.

Owain

[NT]

lol, very true :)

Then its even easier, partly cover the air outlets

NT

[Jules]

If the system's been done properly you should have more than one vent for return air back to the heater, and assuming the vents you have have an adjustment flap you should be able to 'tune' the output somewhat to individual areas. Trouble is I've heard of a lot of bodges where they run return air just via a single big vent...

I don't think it'll ever be as good as CH/raditors, but there should be a certain amount of adjustment to the system.

cheers

Jules

[js.b1]

You should be able to balance the heat to upstairs/downstairs vents. Is there a damper so you can adjust accordingly?

Re ventilation, there is a (very) significant difference in requirements for open-flue vs room-sealed appliances.

Wet GCH sucks unless CWI & Loft Insulation due to the convection draughts. Wet GCH is usually superb when underfloor, indeed all new-build should be forced to use underfloor heating so in the future they can easily switch to CO2 ASHP GSHP when gas/gas-boilers-depreciation tips economics.

[NT]

noise distribution of whiffs, especially bathroom ones

NT

[GMM]

But should they be lying down or standing on their ends? On second thoughts, I think I'll unroll them - it was hard enough work lugging those few up there.

Actually, what's stopping me is that the eaves are boarded off from the rest of the loft and you need to wriggle through a 15 inch square hole to get in there. Still haven't worked up enough enthusiasm to start togging up and crawling in there. Maybe a bit of real winter weather or a gas bill will give me the motivation.......