turning mud and slush into a driveway

[Vass]

Right, preparations for work on my front garden to start this bank holiday. I'm intending to dig out the clay, mud and slush and make a hard standing for parking cars (area is approx 25 feet x 8 feet) Now I'm probably going to get many different answers to this, but hopefully I cant find a common theme and work from that. or someone can point me to a decent link, (lots out there on google but they all contradict one another) so here goes... How deep to I dig? What do I put in there? (hardcore? mix of something else? etc) I'm planning on leaving enough room for block paving (when funds allow) so for now I will park on top of the rubble/hardcore/whatever. Should I hire a mini digger? (funds are tight or I'd get a man in!) TIA

[JimK]

most sense IMHO

JimK

[Tim Watts]

Vass wibbled on Monday 29 March 2010 11:05

From personal experience, reclaimed railway ballast whacked down with a plate whacker makes a fine standing for cars. It's grey and not too ugly, but will eventually silt up and sprout weeds (year or two), but will free drain quite well despite this. Hopefully you'd be able to top it off with sand and paving before it gets too weedy. 8" whacked to 6" will be enough to put a 10 ton truck on (notwithstaning shallow drains and services below mind). Prolly 6" whacked to 4" would do most people as either a standing or a base for paving.

I have heard of people deliberatly presilting it with earth (about 1/2") and planting grass on top. The car wheels find the rocks but there isn't enough topping to turn into a mud slide. Looks like a lawn.

[Tim Lamb]

In message , Tim Watts writes

Did something pop up recently about building control regarding drainage provision for hard standings?

regards

>

[Cod Roe]

Yes

[Ian Middleton]

Yes drainage is needed for hard standings now, not allowed to discharge in to drains.

Just watched a nice new block paved drive way, near my parents house in Essex, be dug up, large hole excavated, the dug up broken paving filled the hole, capping stones put on and new block paved drive way put on top. They didn't conform to building regulations and were asked/ordered to make it comply.

Interestingly they were replacing just slabs of concrete, all cracked after years of car parking that had absolutely no drainage provision.

[Vass]

they can see the swimming pool of water sitting on my clay front garden going nowhere if I'm supposed to fit drainage, where's it supposed to run to if it can't go into the drain?

I have a drainpipe from the garage running into the ground, no idea if it goes to a drain or a soak away if its a soak away, the water on top ain't getting there. I'm buggerred if I'm paying some council to tell me its ok though.

[Invisible Man]

Up to you whether you take the risk of having to take it up again.

We had an asphalt drive and expected problems getting it replaced by block paving. When I spoke with Chelmsford BC they said they consider block paving porous.

Marshalls do porous block arrangements but they are more expensive, require a survey, the correct subsoil and special foundations. Probably no good where clay is involved.

When our drive was done I think it was 4 inches of crushed concrete and

2 inches of sand under the blocks vibrated at various stages.

New law was brought in to reduce run off to public drains causing flooding.

If you can get the drive to run off onto your own property I believe impermeable is fine.

[Vass]

all good info, thanks

[Dave Osborne]

Another vote for

recommend you settle down for the evening with a cuppa and read the whole site. It truly is an education.:-)

[sm_jamieson]

What about "repairs" to an existing paved area. I had block paved area covering most of the garden, but filled in the original flower bed with a concrete surface. If I want to replace the temp surface with block paving is that OK ? The area to be "repaired" is about a 10th of the whole area. Simon.

[Ian Middleton]

I think that's the attitude why they had to dig up their newly laid drive and fit a soak away.

[Tim Watts]

Ian Middleton wibbled on Monday 29 March 2010 14:27

That "attitude" is entirely appropriate IMHO - there is now far too much bloody nonsense coming from they who think they are above us and it's about time people started stamping their feet.

However, the pragmatic way to handle all things like this is quietly: Bugger the Council, but:

a) Do something where it is trivial to bring it to the right standard if anyone whines;

b) Do it according to the regs, in which case they might whine that you didn't tell them, but they can't make to do remedials because none are needed;

c) Do something where you don't mind if they do tell you to take it apart.

In this case, that would translate as:

a) Slope back into your property towards a flower bed or grass so rainwater doesn't go down the road drains for the sewer which is the main point of all this and where it wouldn't be hard to add an ACO drain if needed. Or use a permeable drive. IME block paving fairly flat on sand on hardcore is actually quite good at absorbing water with little if any runoff. I get very little runoff on mine and if the base where more permeable (it's a mismash of broken concrete and crap down there) and there were slightly bigger gaps between the blocks filled with sand, I think it would take any amount of rain.

b) Engineer the slope and stick the drains in from day one. Probably the best solution other than a permeable drive.

c) N/A here.

[Vass]

I might just do that, a quick glance shows hiring a digger is favourable any ideas on daily cost?

[The Natural Philosopher]

not a relevant question.

That's the relevant question.

For me, nothing worked better than MOT type 1. after a few thirty tonners have been over it.

About 4-5" of it.

A lot depends on how you expect to edge it, and whether its OK to have the resultant drive proud of the surrounding ground: I recommend you do, as that will keep it flood free.

ALL you have to do, is throw down bout 5" of MOT type 1, and rake and level it, and then drive on it as much as possible. After a year it will be either grass or driveway, depenmding on how much it gets driven ON, and you can apply whatever top is needed.

The only think you MIGHT decide to do is lay down edging to contain it and make a clear demarcation to the garden.

[Dave Osborne]

Well, it's whatever your local hire company charges ;-) HSS are expensive. Your friendly local independent should be worth checking out.

A small 1-tonne class excavator will be about £50-75/day or £100-£125 a weekend. Plus VAT, fuel & delivery, natch.

[Vass]

this sounds along the lines I was thinking.. nice one.

[Dave Starling]

Once you've got the digger, learnt how to use it you would probably be on balance better to pay a man on day rate to do it. I considered hiring a mini-digger (boys with big toys and all that) but given the skill needed and the potential damage that could be done with one, I paid around =A3120 a day for a driver. I'm glad I took that decision. It would have cost a lot more than that if I had knocked a wall over by accident, or worse.

Also when you are digging out for that area, consider the amount of waste that needs to be carted away. It won't be a trivial amount.

Dave

[Me Here]

Call a local Pikey and get 'em to do it for you.

Fasand pahnd, garunteed for as long as you can see 'em, only special offer as they got a few cube spare from a road laying job about 20 miles away, and

10% off for cash guv..... Swear on me babys life that it's gonna be a good deal and perfect.....Swap shoes boy.

[The Medway Handyman]

My drive is about that size. I used about 2 tonnes of type 1 compacted in stages, so its about 100 - 125mm thick, topped with 2 tonnes of 18mm gravel.

Benefits - drains perfectly, looks good, very cheap, no problem with oil leaks, no weeds etc.

I just followed the advice on paving expert.