Meters going backwards

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

Some daft tart on 'You and Yours' was complaining that after fitting solar panels her meter was going backwards on sunny days. Her elec co told her it shouldn't and they fitted a 'backstop' meter. Now, if the solar panel output exceeds your demand, the meter going backwards is exactly what should happen, so what the f*ck is her problem? She seems to think it's not normal, and the technologically-challened Jenny Murray agreed with her.

It seemed to elude both of them that the meter goes back, then forwards, then back, then forwards again as conditions change. The energy company is getting the benefit of her generation, but it's simply not set up to pay her for it, so that's a shortcoming on their part. In the early days of solar, the Californian energy cos took backfeed into account and paid up for contributions - not fitted a backstop meter.

There was no mention of FIT, etc.

I give up. I'm surrounded by idiots.

[The Other Mike]

Nope, you are wrong.

Usually they: Meter solar panel output Pay FIT on solar panel output Meter infeed to property for demand Export assumed as 50% of solar panel generation Pay additional (small) sum for export The displayed main (and solar) meter registers should only increment positively regardless of the variation in export power flow to the grid system.

Alternatively, on 'large schemes' you get a full import export metering in which case meter still only increment positively, but they record import and export in separate registers.

Domestic Commercial or Industrial meters should *not* go backwards. Some mechanical ones might, but generally any fitted for the past 20 or so years either as a new fit or as a replacement on a refurb shouldn't because of a mechanical stop.

[Dave Liquorice]

That's your first mistake, the radio equivalent of the Daily Mail. B-) I reach for the "off" button when You & Yours comes on as I only end up shouting at the radio.

Correct it shouldn't but there should also be other metering so she can send in that reading for her FiT payments and, unless it's a fully metered system, get the deemed 50% of generated as an export payment as well.

Having the main meter running backwards would effectively mean she gets paid twice for any export.

No the export FiT rate is only 3p/unit running the meter backwards will "pay" at what ever her tariff is, that will be around 10p/unit or more.

Agreed that she has done herself out of her tariff rate per unit on any exported energy by complaining and having a backstop meter fitted. As you say incorrect metering is the suppliers problem not hers.

[Graham.]

I'm sure that is correct, but I think the point being made is that on the level of this radio program why would the idea of the meter going backwards when there is a net export be counter-intuitive?

[Muddymike]

On a similar note I know of one household that has no electric meter. When the current owners moved in they pointed this out to their previous supplier only to be told "that address is supplied by X company" On contacting "X" they were told the house was supplied by "Y" company, on getting a similar reply from "Y" they gave up and have enjoyed free electricity for 10+ years!

Mike

[jgharston]

I had to deal with a similar bit of casework about five years ago.

A house that used to be a shop with a flat upstairs, owned by somebody who lived a few doors down, so bills were sent there. The shop was merged with the flat, but the gas board never got around to updating their records. The lady who lived in the now-house kept phoning them to sort things out, the gas company kept telling her "there's no gas supply to that address". Telling them "I'm stood in front of the gas meter looking at the dials go round" didn't have any effect.

In the end I advised her to just appreciate that she's going to live out her final years with free heating, and if the gas company do suddenly notice she has a supply insist that the unpaid back bills be added to her monthly bills at no more than about 10% of the usage.

At the current rate, she'll be dead before they cotton on. In fact, it looks like she'll be dead before the council get around to finding her a ground-level flat she can get her wheelchair in and out of.

JGH

[Jethro_uk]

It's not "free". Somebody else is paying for it. Electricity companies are very good at being able to work out that they supplied X Megawatt- hours, but only got paid for Y. They are also very good at knowing how to whittle down the offending houses to a handful.

[Mike Barnes]

It's just a totally insignificant part of the distribution losses.

[Tim Watts]

So the meter tails went into the cutout???

[Dave Liquorice]

The grid is owned by National Grid down to 135kV IIRC. 135kV and below as far as the company cut out is local distribution handled by the Regional Electricity Company (REC or now DNO - Distribution Network Operator).

The connection from the cutout to the meter and the meter itself is the responsibilty of who ever you pay for your electricity supply.

The tails from meter to CU are yours.

[John Rumm]

Cheaper than having to pay for all those solar setups at four times the price per unit though ;-)

[Adam Funk]

You would think so, but Muddymike's story shows their systems aren't perfect.

[Dave Liquorice]

Correct it does.

to "Q I'm confused. Who is responsible for what?"

There is a nice simple piccy out there somewhere that shows who is responsible for what but can I find it now can I heck. I thought it was on the ENWL site.