Grounding straps on water meters

[tomkanpa]

Got this email from a friend in Columbus, Ohio. Can anyone explain why the straps were installed in the new homes.

There's a solid copper, heavy wire across my water meter. This puts the water pipes in my house at "ground" potential. Over the years, I've depended on that to find a convenient ground when I was working on things.

One of my Tuesday Crew buddies discovered yesterday that there are ground straps in the house we are building for Habitat. The problem is that the water line from the street is plastic, and the lines in the house are PEX. Either the plumber doesn't understand or the code still calls for grounding straps.

[SQLit]

grounded is not really the term I would use, I would use bonded. Metallic piping systems are to be bonded to the electrical system in most places.

Phoenix once tried to get electricians to put jumpers on sprinkler pipes in commerical work. Needless to say it the ink hardly dried before the complaints and lawsuits started. Sounds to me like the code was written last century and the city has not updated the section. Where I live the water meter is fed from concrete pipe. So there is only a short distance of metallic pipe involved. New construction is all plastic. The inspectors install a tag saying as much.

in the event that a wire

[Paul Franklin]

The electrical code no longer allows using water pipes as an electrical ground, in part because plastic water service lines are quite common these days. The local plumbing code may still call for a jumper across the meter, but there's really no point in new construction. Obviously, doesn't hurt, just rather pointless.

Paul

[Joseph Meehan]

I have not seen anything like that, I live in Columbus, but I guess it is possible. I do suggest that you don't rely on plumbing for a good reliable ground in any home. If you need a true ground, put one in.

[Bud--]

The 2005 NEC REQUIRES metal underground water services pipes to be used as the grounding electrode (along with ground rings and other electrodes if present). If water pipe is used, 1 or 2 ground rods are required as supplemental electrodes. Metal water service pipe is a much better ground than rods. Supplemental rods are required because metal water service pipes can be replaced with plastic in the future. The NEC requireds a bond across the water meter and an electrician would install it.

-------------- In another post someone suggested that when all the pipe is plastic the bond across the meter should be made with nylon rope.

Bud--

[w_tom]

Decade plus past, the water pipe was not acceptable for grounding. However a connection must be made to water pipe where that pipe enters the building to remove electricity from water pipe. Electricity from inside or outside the house. This is a requirement of all incoming utilities. Utilities must make a connection to the building's earth ground where entering a building. This bonding requirement for a gas line is subject to local gas company requirements.

An electrical connection to water pipe is only to remove electricity. Even water can be a conductor, depending on the type of electricity. Therefore bonding is a good idea, even if not required, to have incoming water also connect to a building's single point earthing.

That wire to water pipe is to remove electricity from the pipe. It is called b> The pipe system still needs to BE grounded, in the event that a wire

[Red Cloud©]

The pipe system still needs to BE grounded, in the event that a wire shorts to a metallic pipe. The pipe system, however is not to be used to function as the SOURCE of ground for the electrical system. There is no way to guarantee that future work or modifications on a new house will not include adding or removing metallic pipes.

rusty redcloud

[Red Cloud®]

Water does not conduct electricity. Please give me a good laugh and describe the special "types" of electricity that would be conducted by H2O.

It doesn't matter at all what you call it, I DESCRIBED it clearly. Only an extremely anal retentive pedant would argue with what I wrote. Everyone else knew exactly what I meant without knowing or even thinking that bonding and grounding were exclusive terms. (For the record, they aren't)

rusty redcloud

[Paul A]

.........>

Distilled water does not conduct very well. The water coming into your house conducts somewhat more, depending on the dissolved solids. See

[Jim Elbrecht]

-snip-

-snip-

Perhaps you can explain how my 'high water alarm' in my sump hole works. [and it *does* work] It consists of a couple leads that end at high-water level about 6 inches apart in the hole. If water gets up to them it completes the circuit. [or in the case of non-conducting water, some other force is at work] I thought this was DC electricity [9v in my case] being conducted by water.

I would assume then that all those warnings about dropping a toaster in the bathtub just apply to the old iron tubs with chipped porcelain? I always thought they were telling us that AC electricity can be conducted by water, too.

Jim

[Red Cloud©]

Pure H2O does not conduct electricity. Your sump does not contain pure H2O, and neither does your bathtub.

rusty redcloud

[w_tom]

Lightning. Your apology for being wrong is expected.

[Stormin Mormon]

I remember from my old school days that pure distilled water is a terrible conductor. However, mix some salt in, and it conducts very nicely.

Your sump water contains some dissolved, ionic salts.

[Red Cloud©]

If I was wrong, I would apologize. Since I am right, you can go pound sand, wacky_tom.

rusty redcloud

[zxcvbob]

I'm still trying to figure out what kind of grounding clamp is listed for use on plastic pipe... (in other words, how did they attach the meter jumper)

-Bob

[w_tom]

[John Gilmer]

Assuming you get your electricity from a utility, there already is a "true" ground at the service entrace for power. The "network protector" of the telephone company is also connected to that ground.

If you have metal plumbing inside your home, it probably a good idea to bond that to your electrical utility ground.

Some of this stuff goes back to the old days when the water distribution system was metal and there just wan't any better ground than a water pipe. A tradesman might just automatically connect the meter jumper just because it is quicker to install a jumper than try to explain why a jumper isn't needed.

A similar thing happened with the electric utility ground system. The rule was that you only needed one ground rod is you could show that the resistance to ground was less than 25 ohms. Otherwise you needed two rods. It was quicker to put in two rods than test the first rod.

>

[Red Cloud®]

Once again, Wacky_Tom shows that he lacks "The right stuff". He posts insults complaining about other people insulting him. He posts garbage.

He used to post over and over that lightning strikes happen ever 8 years like clockwork. He finally stopped that nonsense, but now he has new nonsense. Don't ever triust anythiong he says. He is a religious zealot with a narrow agenda. You have been warned!

rsuty redcloud

[w_tom]

Article 250.52(D)(2):

Water pipe al> Paul et. al.

[w_tom]