Electrical Regs - Ramifications

[TheScullster]

Has this been done to death? I've seen a number of discussions and links to the official documentation about the impending laws on DIY electric work. Does anyone have any info on the likely consequences of the law? I'm looking for authorised proposals rather than conjecture but am not sure if this stage has been reached yet. Implications, as I see them, include:

DIY stores asking for id/approved electrician status before sale of electric goods. Sale of electric components through controlled re-sellers only. Is it time to stock up on junction boxes, cable etc before the nanny state gets a grip?

Why can't they use the same approach as gas? Competent persons only to DIY! Can we do all work except final connection and get the install "approved" by qualified sparks?

Bit of a rant more than anything, but as I am only half way through my 1970s house re-furb, I'm trying to get a realistic handle on the likely impact to my speed of progress (and wallet).

Phil

[Tony Hogarty]

Yes.

[Andy Hall]

If you want the official stuff it's in the Statutory Instrument and the Approved Document to Part P of the Building Regulations. It's worth saying that the latter does not have the force of law but is a policy for BCOs and others to follow.

In terms of availability of materials because there is nothing that bars the DIYer from installing replacement wiring accessories or adding spurs to existing circuits or replacing a cable in a circuit, there would be no reason to restrict the sale of materials.

Moreover, one can still DIY any electrical work, but must now do a building notice to the local authority and hav it tested and inspected.

From a general policy point of view, it's not typical in the UK to restrict the sale of products. The only ones that spring to mind are drugs and medical equipment. Wholesalers (but not electrical ones) sometimes won't sell to the end user, but that's for commercial reasons.

Having said all of that, availability may, and this is conjecture, change through retail outlets. For example, retailers might take the view that DIYers may not install consumer units (not true) so not stock them. However, trade places will continue as before, I'm sure.

Yes you can via the use of a Building Notice at the local authority.

Budget for the stealth tax to the local authority.

[tony sayer]

Which like everything nu-labour has done, is what it really is.

Nothing else....

[Andy Hall]

Well it is also an attempt to get more of the construction industry into official income tax and VAT.

[Mike Harrison]

Is the latter actually true..? My reading was that you only had to notify them and it was in theory up to them to decide whether it needed to be tested/inspected.

I can't see stuff disappearing from at least the larger DIY places (e.g. B&Q Warehouse) as professionals often shop there as well (but only during the week of course...). The only reason they would stop selling CUs for example is if demand dropped off - the bottom line is all they care about.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

They don't ask for your qualifications before selling you gas parts...

[Gordon Henderson]

If you are into SCUBA diving that is - you can't buy spare parts for regulators, etc. because the dive shops and manufactirers have gotten together in a cartel to stop selling spares, etc. to ordinary divers. You need to be "in the trade" (ie. work for a shop) and have been on an "approved service technician" course to stand a chance of getting spare bits.

It really drives me nuts - I can change the brakes on my car which has the potential to kill and maime lots of people if I get it wrong, yet I can't servcice my own regulator.

Now I can see their point if I were doing it for money - just like the Corgi cartel, but for my own personal kit, I just don't get it...

Ho hum.

Gordon

[Andy Hall]

it was in theory

From the householder's perspective, true. Whether the LA has an obligation to physically inspect, I don't know. They certainly collect a fee, so put it this way, if I forked over a fee and had no inspection or more importantly certificate, I would be after them.....

Warehouse) as

the bottom line

Of course......

[Andy Hall]

OK...... I did say that not many sprang to mind. Obviously one can see the ramifications of a cocked up regulator - presumably no air or rather a lot of it. Even so, it's not going to kill anyone else if you make a mess of servicing a regulator, presumably?

Is this actually a legal restriction, or manufacturers doing it because of product liability concerns?

[Lurch]

On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 09:11:42 -0000, "TheScullster" strung together this:

Yes.

Never, don't do it for gas.

Never, don't do it for gas.

Nope, doesn't need doing for gas.

Actually, anyone can DIY gas, competent or not.

Yes, and no, depending who you ask.

Don't bother, ignore it and it'll go away. It's a total f*ck up, seeing as how half the affected trades are clueless I have no idea how they expect anyone DIYing it to understand what's going on.

[Gordon Henderson]

Theres no legal requirements that I'm aware of - just the shops & manufacturers creating a nice little cartel where they can charge you an arm and a leg for servicing.

I could whinge on about the diving "industry" in other areas too, but lifes too short!

Gordon

[TheScullster]

Hi all

Thanks to all respondents. I'll sleep a little easier now!

So, what if:

a) I get my brother in law (electrician with IEE quals) to do the work

OR

b) I get my brother in law to inspect/certify/test my work.

Do either or both of these avoid the need for BCO involvement?

Phil

[Andy Hall]

Doesn't help unless he has the right qualifications. It's possible to be an IEE member, chartered engineer and have loads of years of professional experience, but it doesn't count unless he has the specifics and membership of one of the self certification organisations.

[Andrew Gabriel]

I don't believe the UK can decide which products are restricted, it's decided EU-wide nowadays.

[Tim S]

In the case of him checking (but not doing) the work, it's not "self-certifying", is it.

Or is it?

I thought the whole point was that teh NECEIC members could certify their own work (like FENSA member window installers) to save on the sillyness of one electrician having to employ an inspector on every job they did.

But this really isn't self certification. This is a normal certification of an installation that may or may not have had work done on it by someone else.

It would only be self certification in the case that the qualified person also did the work for hire or reward. Even then, if that person is already qualified (as opposed to a quango member) then what's changed?

From what I can fathom out of this whole steaming pile of s**te (Part P, not your posts!) is that due Part P requiring more installation tests than were done before, it was "arranged" (as quangos often are) the NECEIC members were deemed competant enough to check their own work and sign off on them.

I don't remember seeing anything that says that someone who is way more qualified than a typical NECEIC member cannot perform installation tests to order.

Timbo

[Mike Harrison]

Not entirely - radar detectors are illegal in some EU countries, as I think are scanning receivers that can receive police frequencies.

[Andy Hall]

scanning receivers

Although there may be a difference between buy and use in such cases.

[tony sayer]

In article , Andy Hall writes

Not a lot of cop since they moved over to the tetra system!...

[Mike]

There's actually a case going to the European court (slowly) from some pissed off French guy on this matter.