Was chain sawing a dead Monterey Pine today & had a few basic questions

[Danny D.]

Terry Coombs wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 07:39:49 -0500:

That is useful information; but ... what confuses me is that the lady at Oregon clearly told me the (quixotic) datapoint that the chain is

*different*, even with the same pitch, gauge, and number of links, when used with the "micro-lite" bar.

So that's a confusing datapoint, because the pitch, gauge, and number of drive links is the same for both the Oregon G72 chain (that, they say, belongs on my bar) and for the Oregon H72 chain that I bought (which apparently does *not* belong on my bar).

To get another datapoint, I called Husqvarna today at 800-487-5951, where they patch you to a 3rd-party 1st-level support person, who can only look up stuff before referring you to the local Husqvarna service personnel.

The lady who answered at 800-487-5951, named Keisha, didn't know all that much, but she was nice enough to ask me to read off the numbers on my bar to find the right chain, which she says, is the Husqvarna H30x-72 chain, which she says, is a "special" chain, which I can order from them, for $34.84 (i.e., $24.85 + 9.99 S&H).

She told me I did have the special "micro-lite" bar, after she asked me for the numbers stamped on the bar itself, which were:

1. Part number = 5089261-72
2. Pitch = 0.325"
3. Gauge = 0.050"
4. Drive Links = 72DL
5. Other unknown stampings: U49, 15, 1103, & 18

So, the weird (and confusing) datapoint is that both Husqvarna and Oregon told me that, even with the right pitch, gauge, and drive links, there still are *two* different chains, depending on whether I have the standard bar or the micro-lite bar (and I have the micro-lite steel bar).

Who would have known it's this inexplicably complicated, but, I still fail to see how the micro-lite bar (which takes thinner cutters) could be damaged when the part below the midline of the chain is supposedly the same gauge.

Doesn't make sense (yet).

[Danny D.]

Pico Rico wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 10:52:42 -0700:

You, and SMS are close, so we should at least help each other with data on here about local suppliers.

Thanks.

[Danny D.]

Danny D. wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 05:36:57 +0000:

Since nobody answered, I just called Oregon chain customer service again, at 800-487-5951, who explained the "20" stamped on the Oregon H72 chain indicated that it is a "Type 20" drive link, which, if you have the secret decoder ring, corresponds to a 0.325" pitch, and a 0.050" gauge.

The weird thing is that this new representative, named "Becky", confirmed that the Micro-Lite bar that I have does not take an Oregon H72 chain, but it takes the Oregon G72 chain, both of which have the exact same pitch, gauge, and number of drive links.

The only difference is the cutter.

Anyway, when I looked at another of my older chains (maybe the original? ), it had a "30" stamped on each of the drive links, which, Becky told me, indicates an H30 micro-lite chain, with the smaller cutters.

Some diabolical epiphanies that come out of these conversations are:

1. Knowing the pitch, gauge, and drive links (apparently) isn't enough!
2. You also need to know if the bar is designed for smaller cutters!
3. The Oregon G72 & H72 chains have the same pitch, gauge, & drive links.
4. But only the Oregon G72 fits my Micro-Lite bar (thinner rails?).
5. The 20 or 30 stamped on the drive links indicates an H20 or H30 chain.
6. I can *find* the drive links by looking for that specific stamp!
7. There are two kinds of sprockets, but I apparently have the "spur".
8. A chain with 62 drive links will chatter & damage the sprocket spurs.
9. The H30X-72 chain costs about if I have Husqvarna ship it to me.

The only inexplicable thing that comes out of these two phone calls are that a chain of the exact same pitch, gauge, and number of drive links can be different in cutter dimensions, such that it won't fit a standard bar.

I find that confusing because the Oregon package doesn't say what both the Oregon (800-223-5168) and Husqvarna (800-487-5951) support personnel say.

[Terry Coombs]

It's Frawley's Saw Shop ,

. I think they cater pretty much to the pro logger market , I really like the chains I bought from them . My last purchase was a bar/chain for my 16" Stihl 025 , it's branded Forester , and it's the cuttingest mofo I've ever used . It came from the ebay seller winrider in KCMO . I'm kinda new to woodcutting , we just started heating with wood last winter . But I learned real quick how not to dull a chain unnecessarily , and how to sharpen one properly .

[Terry Coombs]

I suspect the wider chain puts more stress/wear on the slot . I have no experience with Husqvarna saws , though I've heard they're pretty good . I've learned just enough past the basics to keep my equipment running and cutting well ...

[Terry Coombs]

Couldn't tell you which type , but that sprocket looks almost new . A worn sprocket will have grooves on the top and drive face of the teeth .

[Danny D.]

Terry Coombs wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 15:11:11 -0500:

I had never even *looked* at the sprocket before, so, thanks for letting me know.

I hate to throw away tools but I just can't think of an alternate use for the S62 and Y62 chains that I have in my chainbox.

I wonder what a used chain is good for? :)

[Danny D.]

Terry Coombs wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 15:06:35 -0500:

Apparently even Oregon bars can be "micro-lite" as this explanation shows:

"Micro-Lite is the name for the lean, mean narrow-kerf chains and narrow-kerf guide bars from Oregon. The advantage of using a leaner narrow-kerf cutting system is that it requires less power from the saw to make the same length of cut. By cutting a narrower kerf, the saw does not have to remove as much wood."

You'd think the Husqvarna owners manual would mention that a 'standard' chain, even if it's the right pitch, gauge, and number of drive links, will eventually damage the narrow-kerf bar.

The Oregon PDF goes on to explain what's *different* about the narrow-kerf bars, which still makes no sense to me because the incompatible chains are the *same* pitch, gauge, and number of drive links!

"To help a Micro-Lite chain cut its narrower kerf, Micro-Lite bars are built slightly thinner than standard bars. If Micro-Lite chain is run on a standard bar, there may be hang-ups during the cut. And if standard chain is run on a Micro-Lite bar, all the performance advantages of cutting a narrower kerf will be lost."

That doesn't go so far to say that the bar will be damaged, but, clearly, both the Husqvarna and Oregon customer service personnel told me that using the non-microlite chain on a micro-lite bar, will damage the bar, even though the chains are the same dimensions for pitch, gauge, and number of drive links.

This data is confusing, to me.

[Danny D.]

Danny D. wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 20:51:58 +0000:

Since I was confused by the fact that the new H72 chain of identical pitch, gauge and number of drive links as the G72 chain would *not* fit my 18-inch Husqvarna 445 chainsaw recently bought at Lowes, I called Oregon directly at the number shown in that Micro-Lite brochure (503-653-8881):

At that number, I asked to speak with their most knowledgeable guy, who turned out to be "Vic" who told me that the 18-inch Husqvarna 445 could have come with any of three (3) different bars:

1. Standard-kerf bar, 0.050 gauge, 0.325 pitch, 72 drive links, or,
2. Narrow-kerf bar, 0.050 gauge, 0.325 pitch, 72 drive links, or even,
3. what he called a "3/8-inch 50-gauge bar".

I told him that the Oregon H72 chain package should say something like: ** ensure that your bar is a STANDARD-kerf bar! And he said he'd get that information over to the right people.

He agreed that, even though the pitch, gauge, and number of drive links are the same, the Oregon H72 is the *wrong* chain for the narrow-kerf bar that is on my Husqvarna 445 (the right chain is the Oregon G72).

Vic explained that the cutting edge is a "few thousandths" thinner on the narrow-kerf chains, and that the "rails" of the narrow-kerf bars is proportionately thinner (hence, the bar itself is thinner).

When I countered that the gauge is the same, he mentioned that the

*depth* of the groove on the bar is the same; it's just that the rails on the bar are different.

He wasn't totally sure what damage would result, but he said that the wider cutting edge "could" hit something inside the chain saw (which he agreed was probably unlikely); and he said that the top-heavy wider-kerf chain "could" possibly damage the admittedly thinner rails of the narrow- kerf bar.

All in all, the takeaway is that it is *not* sufficient to match a chainsaw by the pitch, gauge, and number of drive links. One also has to match the width of the kerf cut by the cutting edge.

Sigh. Who knew? Not me.

[Stormin Mormon]

Snag called me some bad names, and said he'd filtered me, so I filtered his ### back. I only see him in others reply. Sorry for the confusion.

[Stormin Mormon]

When my saw died,I had two chains, new in box. I listed them on Ebay with no reserve. One sold for a few bucks, other sold for a penny. Some lucky fellow got a nice chain, cheap.

. Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus

.

[Danny D.]

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 17:33:13 -0400:

I've *never* sold anything on ebay, craigslist, etc., and I'm not about to start.

Now that I'm in the mountains, even a car isn't worth someone driving all the way to take a look at it.

[Terry Coombs]

Exactly which mountains are you in ? I'm in the Ozarks myself ... North central Arkansas to be more specific .

[Danny D.]

Terry Coombs wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 18:35:43 -0500:

Santa Cruz mountains. They're really just hills, at 3,000 feet max elevation.

[Harry K]

It is a "spur" sprocket and it looks undamaged. The other type is a "rim" sprocket. Difference is the spur is part of the clutch and that "drum/spro cket" has to be changed to get a new sprocket. the "rim sprocket" is just what it sounds like, a circular rim gizmo with drive links fitting down thr ough the rim. Those are easily changed as they are held on with only a cir clip. Very few saws come with the "rim" but are easily converted. Once co nverted worn sprockets are very cheap to replace.

Harry K.

[Danny D.]

Harry K wrote, on Mon, 29 Sep 2014 21:52:48 -0700:

Thanks for confirming that the Husky 445 uses a "spur" sprocket. Mine has 7 teeth, so, thanks for letting me know they looked good.

The fact that it's undamaged is nice, as I used the wrong chain for a while on it, which had the wrong number of drive links (62 versus 72).

Given what I've learned today, I'm sending the H72 chain out to Husqvarna for a replacement with a G72 chain, even though both chains have the

*same* pitch, gauge, and drive link number (because the kerf is smaller with the G72, and my bar was designed for the smaller kerf by having smaller rails, I'm told ... although that doesn't really make sense).

[micky]

Is there a Freecycle where you live? A mailing list where people give away things they don't need anymore to other people subscribed to the list. Subscription is free too.

[Charlie+]

On Mon, 29 Sep 2014 21:25:04 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D." wrote as underneath :

So what is the difference between the kerf width of the three chains? I doubt that a few thou would start catching on the chainsaw body unless the body clearances are tighter than they should be on any chainsaw. You may get accelerated wear on the bar rails if you tend to tilt the bar in the kerf with the wider chains. But the chain you got should be usable in my guestimation, just try to keep the bar straight in the cut. C+

[Stormin Mormon]

Freecycle is a beautiful concept. Sadly, the one in my part of the world is horribly mismanaged.

. Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus

.

[Stormin Mormon]

I'd suggest you try it. If nothing else, it give you a reason to post to AHR.

"I sold my saw chain for a penny, by Danny D."

135 lines of original text. 472 follow up posts. 17 spinoff threads, which had 1063 follow up posts. (as reported by Badgolferman.)

. Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus

.