StaBil for gasoline

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I was told today that Stabil was not too effective with gasoline that contains ethanol. They said there is a new product that works better.
---MIKE---

>> (44 15' N - Elevation 1580')
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snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (---MIKE---) wrote:

I'd like to see something a little more than hearsay. Stabil is a brand, not a formula. Seeing as ethanol as a gasoline additive has been standard around the country for decades, it's hard to believe that Stabil hasn't been modified to work with it.
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On 8/27/2011 12:07 PM, Robert Neville wrote:

I have not had any trouble with it but believe that it may leave more residue in your carburetor if it evaporates there. A couple of years ago, I left it in my snow thrower and it would not start and a guy that owned a gas station that did repairs and now does lawn work and services all his machines told me that some carburetors are prone to this.
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wrote:

I have been told Stabil is Butylated Hydroxytoluene in a light distilate base.BHT.The same stuff that keeps food fats from going rancid. I was told this by an organic chemist.
From Merisol's website (major manufacturer/supplier of BHT to the Americas)
BHT is used predominantly in the production of plastics and is also an important ingredient in rubber, elastomer and styrene production. It is used in lubricating oils, gasoline, specialty oils and synthetic lubricants, as well as in food, feed and forage products. BHT prevents oils from turning rancid and is an excellent antioxidant and gum inhibitor in fuels. It functions as a stabilizer in plastics, waxes, natural and synthetic rubber and resins.
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I was told today that Stabil was not too effective with gasoline that contains ethanol. They said there is a new product that works better.
---MIKE---
And I heard cell phone use causes stupidity and brain cancer. I believe the stupidity part. Stabil has been around for a long time. So has ethanol. I would believe they have altered the formula to include ethanol, or have an ethanol variant. Go to the store. Take a bottle in your hand. Read the instructions. I bet your answer is there.
Steve
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In addition to regular Sta Bil, they do have an ethanol treatment. Small engines are supposed to be more prone to ethanol problems so it may be worth considering. One of the local equipment dealers here sell five gallon cans of gas that has no ethanol it it.
http://www.goldeagle.com/engine_care/411onethanol.aspx Fuel Stabilizers & Ethanol Treatments.Fights the damaging effects of Ethanol in gasoline including corrosion to the fuel tanks, fuel lines, carburetors and injectors.GUARANTEED Safe to use in gasoline, E10 and E85 fuel.Stabilizers added to fresh fuel will maintain gasoline freshness for 9-12 months
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Of course, untreated gasoline will stay "fresh" for 270-360 days if properly stored.
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You have a reference for that? And what defines "properly stored"? Everything I've seen says you get a few months in typical storage conditions most of us would use. Gas now has ethanol in it which makes it even more problematic. I'd use stabil to go from one season to the next, but would never let untreated go a year.
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On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 07:48:48 -0700 (PDT), " snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net"

I never used Stabil or other additives. Have a 5-gal plastic jug for the mower (4-stroke Craftman with Honda engine) and a 1-gal jug for the mix I use in the whacker (cheap 2-stroke from Sears.) Transfer from the 5-gal to a 2-gal I use for filling the mower. If I'm not pouring caps and vents are closed. That's "proper" storage to me. My gas usage gets me to the gas station every other year where I fill both the 5-gal and 2-gal jugs. So I'm using one or two year old gas often enough. Never had a problem or noticed anything amiss. Don't pay attention to running anything dry either. They always have gas in the tanks when cutting season is done. They sit idle about 6 months here near Chicago. Mower always starts first pull, whacker 3 or 4, but you have to know how to choke it. Both machines are 8 years old. Just my experience. Not my intent to interrupt any Stabil voodoo ceremonies.
--Vic
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wrote:

You seal the unsed gasoline in the containers. Most containers and all lawn mowers that I have seen have ventilating caps and that's where the prolem lies.
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On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 08:32:20 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) snipped-for-privacy@att.net"

Never saw a ventilating cap in a gas jug. Not saying they don't exist. Even the old metal cans I used were spill proof. The plastic jugs I use are sealed tight. When it gets hot they bulge a bit but never popped the vent cap. The machine tank caps must be vented to prevent vacuum, but I never had a problem with the gas going bad after 6 months. I usually fill the mower for the first mowing so that gas gets "refreshed" a bit. Takes an almost full tank to do all the lawn. But with the whacker I usually start the season with the gas that's in the tank. Sometimes that gas is more than 2 years old because the 1-gal mix lasts more than 2 years.
--Vic
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On 8/28/2011 11:55 AM, Vic Smith wrote:

I hate the new spill proof containers. No vent cap and delivery is blurp, blurp, blurp. You have to force it to stay open and often they do not rapidly close and I end up spilling more gas then the old containers.
That said, the chief enemy of gasoline is oxygen and once any antioxidant in the gas, like BHT, is consumed the decomposition reaction accelerates. Most gas cans these days are polyethylene and oxygen can actually permeate the plastic and get at the gas. The best way to store gas would be in a sealed metal can with little air head space. Air does not permeate a metal container.
I get by with 2-3 years adding Stabil in the plastic cans.
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There are still vintage gas and oil cans available on Ebay. Dad and his neighbors used to buy oil from the Farmers Coops in five gallon cans. The cans were sure handy for other things as well.
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On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 18:09:07 -0400, Frank

I used the term "spill proof" to mean the cap wasn't ventilated, and that might be the wrong term. Just meant if they fall over in the trunk and the vent doesn't get popped open nothing will spill. My 5-gal can has no vent to pop, but the nozzle is vented. Goes blurp, blurp, but never stops flowing. My smaller cans have vents that pop open. The 2-gal (maybe it's 2 1/2) is easiest to use. It has an upper cap you screw off, and a flexible nozzle with stops on both ends. Just pull the nozzle up, pop the vent and pour. The 5-gal and 1-gal have stiff nozzles in the jug that have to be reversed, and a cap plug that has to be set aside when using them. Messy compared to the pull up nozzle. I nearly always spill a little gas. Just have to top off. Can't resist. I didn't pay any attention when I bought them 8 years ago. This might be a real "no spill." (Amazon.com product link shortened) Pretty pricey for a small gas jug that still spills gas. Well, I see what you mean now that I've looked around Looks like new cans are "CARB-compliant" or something. How come everybody's complaining about light bulbs? This is the real BS here. Glad I bought my jugs when I did and hope they outlast me.
--Vic
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On 8/28/2011 6:37 PM, Vic Smith wrote:

(Amazon.com product link shortened)
I'm glad the people who designed our new and improved safety gas cans weren't the ones to design our new and improved water saving toilets. Imagine a toilet as difficult to use as one of those gas cans. ^_^
TDD
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On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 19:46:05 -0500, The Daring Dufas

You mean the ones where you have to remove the spout from the can before you can dump it?
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On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 08:32:20 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) snipped-for-privacy@att.net"

The Honda manual states that the mower should be stored with gas in the tank. Containers are all sealed.
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They state the tank should have stabilizer and be full to keep out oxygen also.
Honda also notes fuel can deteriorate in as little as 30 days.
Fuel Gasoline will oxidize and deteriorate in storage. Old gasoline will cause hard starting, and it leaves gum deposits that clog the fuel system. If the gasoline in your mower deteriorates during storage, you may need to have the carburetor and other fuel system components, serviced or replaced. The length of time that gasoline can be left in your fuel tank and carburetor without causing functional problems will vary with such factors as gasoline blend, your storage temperatures, and whether the fuel tank is partially or completely filled. The air in a partially filled fuel tank promotes fuel deterioration. Very warm storage temperatures accelerate fuel deterioration. Fuel deterioration problems may occur within a few months, or even less if the gasoline was not fresh when you filled the fuel tank. The Distributor's Limited Warranty (page 19) does not cover fuel system damage or engine performance problems resulting from neglected storage preparation. You can extend fuel storage life by adding a gasoline stabilizer that is formulated for that purpose, or you can avoid fuel deterioration problems by draining all the fuel from the fuel tank and carburetor. Adding a Fuel Stabilizer When adding a fuel stabilizer (page 18), fill the fuel tank with fresh gasoline. If only partially filled, air in the tank will promote fuel deterioration during storage. If you keep a container of gasoline for refueling, be sure that it contains only fresh gasoline. 1. Add fuel stabilizer following the manufacturer's instructions. 2. After adding a fuel stabilizer, run the engine outdoors for 10 minutes to be sure that the treated gasoline has replaced the untreated gasoline in the carburetor. 3. Turn the engine OFF and turn the fuel valve to the OFF position
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wrote:

No, just your intent to disparage those of us who follow the very accepted practice of using Stabil. Note also that you failed to mention the storage conditions of the gasoline. The length of time is one aspect. Whether you keep it in a typical garage where it's subjected to 85F or store it in a basement at 65F is another. I guess those of us using a gas stabilizer, as recommended by all the leading engine manufacturers, are just idiots according to you.
How can one person be so wrong about so many things?
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