Light Bulbs are getting Expensive / New Tax

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wrote:

I'll dip my toe in this pointless discussion- a banned-gun island in the middle of a non-banned area is close to meaningless. There are no <border controls> around DC, Chicago, et al. All people (black-market gun resellers, usually not end users) have to do is drive an hour, and drive home. Most big-city violence is not done by educated people with marketable job skills- it is done by people to whom the city (or their local neighborhood) is their entire universe, who are incapable of even conceiving of living elsewhere, and voting with their feet. There are parts of this medium-size city like this- they have been undergoing 'revitilization' for 30-40 years, with 3rd and 4th generation residents who keep asking 'why doesn't somebody do something?'. All the while, there are stable and safe neighborhoods less than a mile away. But they ain't 'home'.
Standard disclaimer- yeah, I own guns. But I wish there was a way to keep stupid or intoxicated or drugged-up people from having them available when their anger or desperation overpowers their common sense or fear of punishment. (A five-minute time horizon tends to lead to doing stupid things...)
aem sends...
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aemeijers wrote:

Yep. Consider a New Orleans resident who was forcibly relocated to, say, Salt Lake City. His immediate reaction: "Damn! You means all I has to do is stand behind dis counter and make Slurpees and I's gets PAID? Shit, man, dats cool!"
It's a revelation to the fifth-generation poor.
Since, as you say, a banned-gun island is close to meaningless, wouldn't that argue convincingly for abandoning the banned-gun island so that the righteous folk there would have some way of defending themselves?
As for whackos getting guns, well, you can't build a house without making sawdust.
Goblins getting guns is the price we have to pay so the rest of us can protect ourselves from goblins getting guns. Wait...
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wrote:

Japan and England are islands with strict gun control,yet they still have gun crimes.In this day and age,there's no such thing as a gun-free zone.
BTW,police and government lose firearms a lot. Then there's smuggling and home manufacture of guns. Australian police caught a guy making 100's of handguns illegally and he had already sold many on the black market.
Even a "total" civilian gun ban would not keep guns out of the hands of criminals.
All gun control does is make it safer for the criminals.
--
Jim Yanik
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My high school English teacher hated bumper sticker wisdom, claiming that a short, catchy phrase does not an argument make.
But I still think this says it all:
If you outlaw guns, then only outlaws will have guns.
duh...
If that has to be explained to someone, well, then they probably should not be carrying a gun.
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and worse,you can't keep your government in line. that is the true reason for the 2nd Amendment. (see Declaration of Independence..)

People tend to overlook that criminals can carry OTHER items as weapons,and the best defense for most people IS a handgun. No other item is as effective,for the widest range of people(elderly,handicapped,small,outnumbered),with as low a risk to themselves.
--
Jim Yanik
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Now, how does the rate of gun crimes in Australia, England and Japan compare to that of USA?
- Don Klipstein ( snipped-for-privacy@misty.com)
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snipped-for-privacy@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein) wrote in

why not look at total violent crime? People lacking guns cannot defend themselves against criminals as well as armed citizens can. I note that UK is now banning pointy knives.
--
Jim Yanik
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Don Klipstein wrote:

Nowadays in UK they don't bother trying to get guns, they kill with knives.
--
If you really believe carbon dioxide causes global warming,
you should stop exhaling.
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Gun control laws have to be national in order to do any good. Municipal gun control laws merely make crooks get guns from out of town.
Meanwhile, national gun control laws will probably fly about as well in USA as Prohibition did.
What I do think we need is repeal of a few of USA's 28,000 gun laws, such as:
1. The one banning computer records of gun sales where law enforcement can trace from. So when a gun is traced from a crime, law enforcement has to go to the gun shop where the gun was sold and look at a paper record of who the gun was sold to.
2. The law allowing only ATF to make routine inspections of those records.
3. The law allowing anyone to get a license (FFL) to buy/sell guns across state lines as long as there is no criminal record or record of mental illness found within some time limit (I forget - 30 days?). This license has a stated intent of being for gun shops. However, this license cannot be denied on basis of lacking commerical property, business license if located where one is required, etc. Last time I checked, about 75,000 people had this license. There are nowhere near that many gun shops. Many have their addresses being non-gun-related businesses such as gas stations, or residences. I'm sure probably 60,000-plus of those license holders without gun shops do nothing worse than get guns to their friends and relatives without sales tax. But with 75,000 of these licenses around and limitations on inspecting records, it gets a little tough to find the couple thousand or whatever who are selling guns to criminals.
I know, fixing this is mere drops in a bucket.
- Don Klipstein ( snipped-for-privacy@misty.com)
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on 9/9/2007 2:21 PM Don Klipstein said the following:

A friend of mine from long ago had a Federal Firearms License. He did not have a gun shop, nor any other kind of shop He was a police officer, though..
--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
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I don't remember the details offhand, and don't care enough to look them up, but I do know the number of FFLs in current status went WAY down with the last set of revisions to the law, and the price increase for the renewal, up to something like 200 bucks, now. Most of the 'kitchen table' dealers are now out of the business, just like they wanted. And you do pretty much have to have a business address. And yeah, it can be the same building as a bait shop/gas station. (Pretty common in rural areas.)
Personally, I miss being able to buy guns at the local ma'n'pa hardware, like was dirt common when I was a kid. People didn't demonize or worship guns back then, any more than you would a fishing rod or a crowbar. They were what they were, and nobody really thought about it a whole lot. And when you gave a kid a .22 at age 13 or so, and taught them how to shoot it, the 'forbidden fruit' aspect was close to nil.
As to banning them- sure, just as soon as everyone else turns theirs in, I'll give mine up.
aem sends....
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I believe it's around a $1000 now.

Prior to 1968 (1968 GCA),guns were sold in hardware stores,could be mail- ordered,no ID needed,could be bought across state lines,and yet gun crime was low.Of course,the drug and gang cultures had yet to appear.

WHO in their right mind wants only the GOVERNMENT and criminals to have all the guns? The US was -created- by the armed overthrow of the incumbent government(Britain),by CITIZEN arms.
and it began when Britain moved to DISARM the colonists.
--
Jim Yanik
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aemeijers wrote:

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(snip) in the hands of common criminals.

Who said I had a handgun? I ain't that rich. Just the vintage Belgium Browning bolt-action .22 I got as a kid (which I understand may actually be worth a few bucks now), and one of those cheap plastic-stocked Mossberg 'special service' 12-gauge pumps with the short barrel and 5-shot magazine.
I wouldn't mind having a stainless mini-14, but paying off the mortgage comes first. Ammo is so damn expensive these days, and non-club legal shooting areas so hard to arrange, that I haven't done any recreational shooting in years. 12 gauge with 00 buck doesn't take much aiming. (Light loads so as to not go through more than 1 wall.)
aem sends....
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snipped-for-privacy@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein) wrote in

What good is an AK for personal self-defense outside the home? Do you think that average people can defend themselves against criminals that are bigger,stronger or more numerous,carrying guns OR other items as weapons? Ya think a woman being stalked by an ex or other wacko is going to carry an AK or shotgun? Or the elderly person going to the store,a nice target for crooks? But they CAN use a handgun effectively,and with the least risk to themselves.
A primary advantage of handguns is that they CAN be concealed,and then the crook does not know you are armed,and does not plan for it. Open carry leaves you vulnerable,everybody knows you have the gun.
And despite ANY handgun ban,local or national,criminals STILL get handguns,besides saeed-off shotguns, and rifles,in EVERY country on Earth.
--
Jim Yanik
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snipped-for-privacy@manx.misty.com (Don Klipstein) wrote in

BATF-troop has been cracking down on FFL holders and has drastically reduced the number of FFL holders;there used to be far more than the 75K you mention.Now a FLL can lose their licens eover a simple error on their paperwork,like a misspelling or other meaningless human error.
It's interesting that Vermont allows concealed carry with NO permit needed;you carry if you wish to,and yet they don't seem to have any problem with it.
--
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