how much should I be charging for these shared appliances..

Page 1 of 6  
I share a well with my neighbor we have 2 dwelling condo. My unit concest of myself, and her unit has 3 people as of now. We share the following which are all connected to my electric Meter... well pump, water conditioner system, electric base board heater that keeps the pump room warm during the winter all in a room in my garage. Also a sprinkle system that shared on the front property. It's a 50/50 shared property. She had nationally agreed with hand shake when she bought the unit next to me back November 2014, I came up with a charge $ 50.00 which she agreed and was paying this till past May 2015 she stopped paying her monthly obligation To me. I was willing to drop the price down, she putting up a fight. She is reneging On everything, I had no choice put to seek legal advice and the issue is still not resolved. She wanted to use a kill- a- watt gizmo in my garage, I'm Not her landlord to be checking each day that this gizmo is functioning Right, and again given her the convenience Every month timeing this and that off my electric bill. I think not... It's not the long term solution, especially if I want to sell my unit no one wants to be involved with a gizmo. Then my neighbors chopped up with a internet chart from Runstone Electric Association energy from Alexandra M,N from 2014, We live here in New Jersey not M,N. The chart says it varies from family to family. She only wants to pay $ 15.00 a month for her Calculations We're wrong from that chart, also there was no mention how much a sprinkler system runs on electric, my neighbor has no idea.... I think the best solution would be a second well... Do you have any other ideas, well can be costly, she would have to pay half since it's a shared property..
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
You should be talking to her, not to us. We don't even know what you pay for electricity. $250/month? More? Less? Where I live $50/month for what you describe seems very high. My last bill was $47. (Though we don't leave things on when we're not using them; we don't have AC or microwave; we have gas for heat and stove.) $15 sounds about right to me. If I had to guess I'd say you were gouging them. But I'm not in your condo association and don't know the details. What if $15 is not enough and it should be $20? Who cares? $5/month. You're thinking of paying a lawyer to take it to court over that? It sounds to me like you and the neighbor need better communication.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 8:11:00 AM UTC-5, Mayayana wrote:

I agree (for the most part), but she will be using the well, with multiple people, more than he.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 9:11:00 AM UTC-4, Mayayana wrote:

If it's just the operating costs, I agree. But who pays if the pump needs to be replaced? The well stops producing? The sprinkler system needs maintenance? If all those are treated as split costs if and when they occur, then $50 a month for electric to run what's on that list does sound like a lot of money. I would also hope the electric heater is just keeping the temp reasonably above freezing. I wouldn't think the total operating cost for both units is $50 a month, except maybe in the coldest winter months when the electric heater is running.
Killawatt thing would solve it, but you'd have to do some temporary rewiring to get those loads on it and probably have to do them one at a time. The sprinkler system controller is negligible, the well pump part of that is what matters.
Interesting that this was in place and nothing in the closing documents address how it's going to be handled? It's just a very bad arrangement. Even if it's spelled out, it's still ripe for trouble, as he's learned.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 09/13/2015 8:49 AM, trader_4 wrote: ...

The well here is on separate meter and during summer months can reach nearly $200 if sprinklers are run significantly and even during winter $50 isn't unheard of. So on average that might be about right here altho I've not totaled up for any number of years to see what a long-term average might be. Of course, there's a pretty sizable yard area and garden here so it's likely a larger usage and that's total not just half, but may not be as far out of line as one might think...particularly if count something for the maintenance going forward, etc., ...
But it is a nightmare arrangement.
Neighboring place up the road a ways sold off a corner of the ground around the homestead (farm house and associated outbuildings corral area, etc., the original dairyman who built the place died and the widow kept the farm ground but had sold the roughly 20A); the new buyer cleverly made sure the boundaries included the well; the seller wasn't wary (and apparently either just did the deal himself or had an equally bonehead lawyer) and let it go that way.
Within a month of moving in, the new guy cut the line serving the other property off and that was that...the original owner ended up drilling a new well.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

That could have been the intent of both parties from the outset.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 09/13/2015 9:15 AM, taxed and spent wrote:

No, I know very well it wasn't the seller's intent whatsoever or he would have dug the well prior to coming home from work one afternoon to discover he had no water...
--



Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 09/13/2015 9:33 AM, dpb wrote: ...

...
Although it became very clear after the fact it was indeed the intent of the purcharser all along... :)
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
In alt.home.repair, on Sun, 13 Sep 2015 13:07:13 -0500, dpb

I thought the seller was a widow. Who is "he"?

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 10:05:55 AM UTC-4, dpb wrote:

A 1hp pump runs about 7 amps, ~1700 watts. Using 13 cents/kwh that's 22 cents an hour. Water 5 hours and it's $1.10 Assuming you water 3 times a week, that would be $3.30, or $13 a month. If you watered 10 hours at a time, it's still $26 a month. I don't see how you get near $200 unless it's a much bigger system. Given that it's a condo with a shared well, seems the watering would probably be closer to the $13 to $26 a month. And that's for the whole thing.
The heater could be running more than that, but it's for just a few months. Also it's probably not too much for the heater, because he says it's a room in the garage, so I'm thinking it's more like closet size.

That's for sure. It could work OK if you have a reasonable neighbor and the relationship doesn't go south for some other reasons, etc. Even then it could lead to disagreement, one wants to water every day, the other 2x a week, etc. But for sure if ownership changes on either side, who knows who the new owner will be. Clearly this special arrangement should be spelled out, probably in the closing documents for both units. I would suspect that this shared well was probably added after the condos were originally built and sold.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 11:17:23 AM UTC-4, trader_4 wrote:

Actually, on second thought, I think my numbers are high. A 1hp, 240V motor pulls about 7 amps, but part of that is reactive current, so it's less than 1700 watts. If you just did a 100% efficient conversion from 1 hp to watts, it would be just 750W. The motor isn't 100% efficient, but it's not a resistive load either, so somewhere in between, maybe 1000 watts is more reasonable? If so, then using my previous numbers, it would 13 cents an hour or 65 cents to water the lawn for 5 hours. Do it three times a week, it's ~ $8 a month. Ten hours of watering, 3 times a week for a month would be ~$16. Unless I'm missing something here....
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 8:49 AM, trader_4 wrote:

Plus 1 - In an arrangement such as this ALL expenses need to be calculated. Some may be fixed (heat to prevent freezing in that room) others will be variable, e.g amount of water pumped for the unit with 3+ vs. your unit, etc.
You say you need legal advice and I would agree. Problem is you won't get it here. Contact an attorney NOW, before you do anything else, and get his/her advice. Do NOT disconnect the neighbor without checking first with the attorney.
Expense? Sure but the MOST expensive question you can ask your attorney is "Did I do the right thing?" Chances are great that the answer is "No!" and the remedy will cost you far more than the advice going into this would have cost.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Save some money.
Look at the property documents to see what if anything it says. The most it will say is the well is shared and expenses will be shared. It won't have a dollar amount.
Do the proper analysis. Put a kw meter on and keep track for a month. Try to figure how much each household uses. Do the math. Get with your neighbor and come to an agreement. Or sue in small claims court, using your figures.
Note: cost will vary over the year. In winter, less water used, more heating to prevent freezing.
Maintenance will be a bigger problem, down the road.
Why go to a lawyer before you have done these things?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, September 13, 2015 at 12:04:50 PM UTC-4, taxed and spent wrote:

I agree, I'd try to work it out. The neighbor asking for a killawatt measurement isn't totally unreasonable. I took it like you did, that it could be used to take some measurements for a few months, not long term. But even that would require some rewiring to do and since the thing is in his unit, would the neighbor believe and accept the results? When it's at the point where she's stopped paying altogether, it's not good......
I'd be curious on the history of this, how it came to be, etc.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload


He could use hour meters, easier to tap in.
I wonder if his electricity company charged on tiered rates.
Here is the history of this:
I recently bought one of a two unit condo. Near closing, I learned that the water well and the lawn irrigation was shared with the other condo, and was under his control and on his utility bill. We verbally agreed I would pay $50 per month, but I didn't know how that was figured - I just wanted to close. I knew it would be possible to determine how much electricity was used and we could do a proper calculation.
Now, this neighbor is having nothing to do with any such calculations. It is $50 per month, tough beans! Based on advise from others, and my own common sense, I did some research and rough calculations, and think $15 per month is the right number. I gave this information to my neighbor, hoping he would accept it or more likely come up with his own numbers based on actual electricity usage. But NO. It is still "tough beans, $50" with him.
Since I already paid him for three months ($150) at the fictitious monthly rate, I figure I have paid for 10 months of actual cost. I will pay him nothing more for the next seven months, to use up my credit with him, and then I will begin to pay him $15 per month. Of course, if he comes up with some actual data and actual math showing a different number, I will be reasonable.
Be careful who your neighbors are, especially when you are sharing something with them!
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 11:39 AM, taxed and spent wrote:

Per the original post " I was willing to drop the price down, she putting up a fight. She is reneging On everything, "
Why do you say that the OP says "Tough Beans?" Even though, under the circumstances, the court will likely say that he's entitled to just that.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload


because the OP is not necesarily to be believed. He keeps adding stuff. And what is this "Everything" she is reneging on? There is somethign else? Hmm.

no, the court is going to look long term. $50 will be too little some day. The court will say what the documents should have - sharing actual cost.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 2:52 PM, taxed and spent wrote:

[snip]

No, the court will look at that which is within the four corners of the contract. Unlike most liberals the court will only decide if the contract is enforceable, not decide to ensure that one party or the other benefits in some way other than originally intended.
You've heard it said by others here that on the face of it - considering the OP's stake in the game, as it were, and water rates they experience, that $50/mo for an unmetered supply of water is not unreasonable.
I get it that the neighbor no longer wishes to pay $50, but on the face of it (and I'm not reading into this as you are by calling the OP unbelievable), she hasn't made any counter offer. Given what I've said and what I'm sure than any attorney looking at the same facts (anyone raise their hand?<g>), if he wanted to be a gigantic pr*ck, he could tell her to pound sand even if she offered him $49.50/mo.
SHE agreed to a contract price and now she doesn't want to pay it. What part of a contract do you not understand. There has been no mention of fraud or an illegal transaction which, as I see it, would be the only thing capable of voiding the contract.
Are you so dense as to believe that if you came over to my house in response to a Craigslist post for a shiny, low mileage 2012 Corvette I was selling for $55,000 and purchased it, you could demand your money back or stop paying for it four months later because a) you no longer like climbing in and out of it, or b) you grew tired of the wind in your hair? Mind you, the car is pristine, has low miles and is in perfect mechanical condition.
If so, what alternate universe do you live in?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 9/13/2015 4:41 PM, Unquestionably Confused wrote:

Nothing in writing though. Judge Judy would toss it out.
In the contract there should be an agreed upon maintenance or breakdown system to get it up and running if one owner is away. That would prevent a future problem. Something like: We both agree to call Bob's Pump Service and pay his bill.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Judge Judy would get a lot more facts out on the table. And probably call them both liars!
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.