Garage door opener question

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Opener parts are fine. It just refuse to open or close fully. The new guy caome over today and only lubricated all the rollers and bearings and even the spring (????), but didn't change the door. It holds open at about 2', but drops like a rock from there. My only other options are to find yet another pro or put another 1/2 wind on the springs. I can't tell how many winds are on the present spring as the painted line is gone on both springs. I guess I could get a few bathroom scales to check the weight of the door and get new springs and try to set it up again myself. Any web sites with info on how to set up a torsion spring properly?
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On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 19:46:45 -0600, "Mike Dobony"

http://www.truetex.com/garage.htm http://www.garagedoorsupply.com/garage-door-springs.html
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Mike Dobony wrote:

I wonder how balanced it is throughout the entire movement range? Hard to tell from here. I might ask if you have only use the el-cheep-o HP openers? You can get more powerful consumer grade openers. How much does that door weigh? Why is it so heavy?
I suspect that the problem may be alignment of the opener and the door. But it is difficult to tell from here.
.... I seem to remember something . You mentioned you had used an IDrive unit. Have all the failed units been IDrive units? If so I would suggest that it might be something with that specific model or design and your heavy door. Do they specify a max door weight? Is your door under that weight. Remember that in many areas wood doors are heavier in the winter do to picking up moisture.

--
Joseph Meehan

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Hard
All 1/2 hp units.
You can get more powerful consumer grade openers.
3/4 hp, but it still comes with a stupid chain/cable combo. I want a full chain or the Chaimberlain lifetime belt.
How much does

Heavy duty aluminum skin inside and out and insulated. It is a standard 7x16 door from a garage door company, not el-cheapo from the home improvement center.

door.
When the pros came over they never said anything about the opener.

Chain/cable combo, screw drive, and then the Idrive. Forget what the 4th was somewhere in the middle. I have been having problems for 15 years. The Idrive is only a few years old.
If so I would

My father had a full wood double door and had either a 1/4 or 1/3 hp opener built around the 60's and it never failed other than needing a new belt-drive (from motor to gear box) and a few new remotes. That was an EXTREMELY heavy door. When I was 5 I could open it manually. The spring is supposed to do all the work and negates the weight of the door. That is what it is designed to do. A 1/4 hp opener SHOULD be able to open any properly setup door.

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Mike Dobony wrote: ..

Maybe not. Remember inertia from your high-school physics class? The tendency of a body to resist acceleration; the tendency of a body at rest to remain at rest or of a body in motion to stay in motion in a straight line unless acted on by an outside force.
Overall I still tend to believe that something has been missed. I have had 4 consumer garage doors over the last 30 years (two at a time) and I have yet to have any of them fail. BTW for the last 15 years they have been on insulated aluminum doors.
Go ahead and put in a more expensive opener, but I suspect you will either accidentally correct the problem, or you are going to find the same thing happening.
Maybe we have forgotten on thing. Cycling! How often are theses doors used every day. The real difference with commercial doors is that they are designed for many more lifetime cycles and heavier doors.
--
Joseph Meehan

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to
Yet isn't the spring's function to neutralize this force? The spring overcomes this to negate the user or mechanical opener from having to deal with the full weight and inerta of the door.

have
been
But this time if there is still a problem I will not be dealing with the problem. A call to the installer will have HIM dealing with it. For this reason I am temtped to go to the Allstar due to the 20 year waranty on the entire drive train, not just motor and conveyor chain.

doors
are
Used 6-8 times a day. 2 cars each being used twice a day except on very rare occasions when it might be use an additional time or 2.

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Mike Dobony wrote:

...
Yes. ...
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Mike Dobony wrote:

Well it means it does not have to deal with the full weight of the door, but the inertia is still a possible problem. From your description of the door, I doubt if it is any heavier than the norm and well within the expected weight for a consumer door opener.

That does not sound like a bad idea. Just make sure you read the warranty well before you buy. :-)
At least then, you have have someone who is going to be responsible for finding and fixing the problem without being able to walk away without fixing it.

That also sounds within reason.
Have a Happy Thanksgiving.

--
Joseph Meehan

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Joseph Meehan wrote:

...
It'll divide w/ the relative weight carried by the spring as well...as far as the motor knows, the door only weighs as much as the weight not carried by the springs in the fully closed position.
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Duane Bozarth wrote:

No I am sorry but the inertia is not reduced at all by springs. The springs can carry the weight of the door, but it does not change the mass of the door and it is the mass that the problem I was talking about.
However as I said, based on your description of the door, it would seem to be within the norms for a consumer door and should not be a problem.
--
Joseph Meehan

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I have an 18 foot wide, 8 foot high cedar insulated door. It weighs IIRC 800lbs. I have a screw type store bought opener. It has no problem.
It would have this mysterious symptom. close almost all the way down, then stop reverse and open. Drove me nuts. turned out it was the stupid rope getting in the way of the sensors. Happened again last week, after not having it happen for more than a year. Rope wasn't in the way[tied a knot in it] Looking looking, checking switches.......there was a tiny leaf, suspended on a spider web on the door, dangling in front of the sensor.
My neighbors door faces a bit more west than mine, and clearer in front of it. wouldn't work in the afternoon. The sun glitched the sensors.
duct tape the sensors together and try the door.
Wasn't it sherlock holmes? When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the answer.
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"yourname"> wrote

Heh, reminds me of a little thing I encountered with my 16'x7' Wayne Dalton. The door would open fine, but would not close with the vehicle remote or wall switch, at exactly 7:15 in the morning. Hmmm.....took me a little while to figure it out. Turns out the rising sun in the east (my house faces north) would shine right into the lens of the sensor. A 2" piece of garden hose slipped over the sensor stopped that issue. BTW: This would only happen at a certain time of the year when the sun was at just the right angle.
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that a

Problem is all day and all night when it happens. Door is facing north. Checked the sensors first and they are clear and the indicator light is on. It only does this in cold weather. It does it no matter what the opener is. When the opener is brand new it doesn't happen often. Next season it happens to the point it is impossible for the opener to open or close the door EVER. I end up having ot disconnect the opener and open and close by hand. I am getting a NEW commercial grade opener from someone who will do the servicing. I am tired of spending 15 winters with this problem and having various garage door companies telling me the same exact thing, the door is fine.

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on.
is.
Just curious as to exactly what happens. Does the door try to open? Does it open part way and then reverse?
I too think those tape units are cheap. For a heavy door I would want a screw drive. I presently use a Chamberlain chain drive but it is a very light weight door.
I lean a bit towards Genie products over Chamberlain.
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IIRC
stupid
after
a
front
the
by
do
the
Does
Traditional openers: It will open part way and stop with an error (blinking light). It will close part way and reverse with an error (blinking light).
The Idrive closes all the way and then opens again.

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new
arises
I had a problem with a Chamberlain a few years ago. I am trying to remember just what the symptoms were. I think it would only close part way. Maybe only move a few inches and then reverse. I came to the conclusion that it was quite likely the RPM sensor.
Something like this unit:
http://www.aaaremotes.com/lifgaroprpms.html
For the price I decided to give it a try. Put in a new one and it has been running fine ever since. I remember that the new one I ordered looked like a more sturdy design.
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My small, light, metal door opens/closes fine by hand, but binds when the opener closes it. The top panel of the door has just enough deflection to cause the mechanism to bind.
Perhaps trying to manually open/close the door while only touching the door where the opener touches the door will reveal some binding that does not occur when force is put on the door in a different place.
In networking, this is the "be the packet" approach, so here I guess its the "be the opener" approach.
Dave
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You stated the door drops from 2' and balances at 4' - 5'. What doe it do when it is at the 7' mark? Does it hang into the opening or is it hard to pull down? If it is heavy at the floor, balances midway and is hard to pull down when it is full open the torsion springs are too long. You simply have to shorten to the correct length for your application.
If it is heavy at the floor and balances midway with extension springs then the door is under sprung.
Get an exact door weight by removing all the tension from springs and with the help of some friends lower that door onto a scale. Once you get the proper weight, purchase the correct springs for your door. Any door regardless of the material it's made of or it's size should not be heavy at all to lift by hand.
If your "pro" is just guessing at the weight then you should seek another that will go through the process of obtaining the EXACT weight of your door and springing accordingly. Properly done your door should be able to be opened and closed with minimal effort and no stress/overload on your electric opener.
Rich http://www.garagedoorsupply.com

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to
I
roller
year
arm.
Thanks.
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