Does the body feel a shock on a GFIC protected circuit?

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How's about a float of some kind in the middle. No sense having the entire top open to lose heat. Leave a donut shaped area for the horses to drink. A donut hole saved, is a donut hole earned.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
or you could insulate the tanks and slow down the heat loss and reduce but not eliminate the need for heat.
bury them in the ground so the horse can't tip them and help insulate them?
paint the inside black pick up a least a little solar heat?
are the heaters controlled by a thermostat so they heat the water only a bit above freezing??, no sense heating it up to 50 or 60F.
not an easy problem...
Mark
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wrote:

Ya never know, but I wont try it.....

I'm still looking for a way to insulate them.

That would not work too well, they would get filled with horse poop, and impossible to clean. That pony that pushes them around wont be doing that anymore. I drove 3 steel t-posts around his tank today, and put bungie cords around the whole works. (hope he dont chew up the bungies).

I painted the outside black on a few of them. Seems to help a little in winter, but is bad in summer.

The bigger heaters (1000w) are, those smaller ones are not. I'm constantly unplugging them, or just push the GFI test button and leave it off when the weather is warmer.

You got that right!!!
Thanks

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On Jan 28, 5:24 am, snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

Well of course the current flows until the GFI trips, so for that fraction of a second you or the horse are going to feel the shock. I think I would put the cords into flexible aluminum conduit and make sure the conduit is grounded. Adding a 6ft grounding rod near the water would also be a good idea to supplement the one back at the meter.
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/metal-flexible-conduit/conduit/electrical/ecatalog/N-8aoZ1z0yb1f
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On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 16:45:44 -0500, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

If you (or anyone else) can tell me where to buy it, I'd do just that. That would save lots of hassles.....
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On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 05:24:10 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

It is several milliseconds and you do feel the shock.
The old adage is the GFCI keeps you from being electrocuted but it doesn't keep you from falling off the ladder.
Falls kill a lot more construction workers than shocks
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On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 05:24:10 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

Horses can be a pain in the ass, no matter what you do, if they want to be. And they usually do. Nothing against horses - but there is a reason for the expression "a horse's ass"
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On Saturday, January 28, 2012 12:57:06 PM UTC-7, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Lots of good answers for the electrical situation. Hie yourself down to your veterinarians office and get some FREE advice about the horses and their chewing problem. We seldom had any chewing problems with our horses so it would be best to seek professional advice.
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On 1/28/2012 2:44 PM, Roy wrote:

veterinarians office and get some FREE advice about the horses and their chewing problem. We seldom had any chewing problems with our horses so it would be best to seek professional advice.

I was kind of wondering about that. My horses have thrown the heater OUT of the tank a few times, but never chewed the cord. And no, it's not on no frikkin gfci GD outlet.
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Steve Barker
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On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 18:00:08 -0600, Steve Barker

Think of what you pay to feed and vet those horses. Is it too much to spend another $10 to $20 for a GFI outlet? As I said in my original message, I installed the GFIs after a heater went bad, and would have electrocuted the horse, had I not run out of the house and ripped the cord out of the outlet. The horse was already down, and could not release from the tank. Scared the shit out of me!!! I've had several tank heaters stop working, but that was the first time one shorted where it was shocking the animal. Then too, if you have children help do chores and they were to touch a tank with a shorted heater, they could be killed too. I now feel that whereever an electric cord enters water, it needs a GFI.
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On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 10:05:17 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

And the stock tank NEEDS to be grounded. A shorted heater in a grounded tank will trip the breaker or blow the fuse.
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On 1/29/2012 3:42 PM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

LMAO! well if it's plastic, it's a little hard to ground. If it's metal, it IS grounded. Duh, hello? It's sitting on the ground.
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On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 18:35:59 -0600, Steve Barker

If it is sitting on gravel or dry sand the "ground" is useless. Same if sitting on concrete. Our watering troughs were always grounded.
A steel t-bar driven (usually also part of the fence) connected to the (galvanized) tank.
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On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 18:35:59 -0600, Steve Barker

Since it appears there are other horse and livestock owners on here, this is exactly what happened.
The heater shorted. Horse came to drink at the plastic tank and got jolted. The older heater had the metal spiral (spring) around the cord. When he pulled back, the cord got around his leg, and just kept jolting him. He went down, but when he fell the shocks made him kick, and his loud kicking against the tank drew my attention to look out the window. Although I had never seen this happen before, I instantly knew what was happening. The heater was on an extension cord, plugged in to an outlet about 30 feet from my house. Wearing nothing but my underwear, I ran out the house barefooted in below zero weather and ripped that cord out of the outlet. I ripped it out so fast (and probably at an angle) that the outlet broke. But I saved the horse, and that was all that mattered. In fact I was out there at least 5 minutes comforting him, before he finally got up, and I didn't even feel the cold until I came back in the house and my toes were throbbing.....
An hour later I was driving to the store to buy a new heater and a dozen GFI outlets. By the end of the week, every tank heater was plugged into a GFI.
Since that day, I also installed a main disconnect lever on the power pole right under the meter. The pole is 12 ft. from my front door. Pulling this lever will disconnect the entire farm. The lever is on the outside of the box, so no box doors need to be opened. Just pull the lever and kill the power instantly. That lever came in handy last summer when a storm caused a tree to fall and rip the overhead power line off the barn.
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Wonder if the horses were feeling the 'tingling' from AC and found that the tingling source came from the heater, thus threw it out of their tank?
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On 1/29/2012 3:47 PM, Robert Macy wrote:

veterinarians office and get some FREE advice about the horses and their chewing problem. We seldom had any chewing problems with our horses so it would be best to seek professional advice.

no, they just get pissed when the tank is empty.
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On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 18:37:22 -0600, Steve Barker

EXACTLY !!!!!!
I have to fill my tanks manually, which is sub zero weather is a chore in itself, because hoses freeze real fast. I cant fill a tank, shut off the water and spend 15 minutes feeding or petting a horse, because the hose will be frozen by then. Normally, I do all my feeding, grooming, petting, and other stuff first. Then I drag my 125 feet of hose out of the house, and begin filling water tanks. (While feeding I make a mental note of which ones need to be filled). That way, I fill one, and move the hose to the next one immediately and keep going from tank to tank until finished. When it's a larger tank, I get a few minutes to warm up in the house and look at my watch to time it. I know just about how long it takes to fill any tank. When I'm finished the hose is dragged back in the house and drained as best as I can as it comes in the house door. Since I dont have a basement, those damn hoses are laying on the kitchen floor all winter long for me to trip on, and leave small puddles to mop up after I bring them in..... Every two days I have to struggle with this, all damn winter long. The small stall pail I fill with a bucket in the in-between days. Aint worth dragging out the hoses for that one bucket....
But yes, the do toss the heaters when they are out of water because they are pissed..... They also knock the tanks over and shove them around. I have a Shetland / crossed pony who tosses he heater, then pushes the tank outside the electric fence. HOW DOES HE DO THAT???? (But that's his way of communicating....) Shetland ponies are extremely intelligent!!!!
One other thing. I bought three 16 foot hoses. A local farm supply can order any length, from 10' to 100'. I hang them on 8' high hooks on the barn wall so both ends barely touch the ground. When the weather gets real bad, those 3 hoses can be screwed together, which is 48'. That will fill 90% of my tanks. I always have a heat gun near those hoses too. There is always a little ice that prevents the female end from turning. A few seconds with that heat gun, they will turn....
Do anything often enough, you learn the shortcuts and tricks!!!
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On 1/28/2012 3:24 AM, snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

GFI is often a good idea. If you ground anything that the animal can touch, the GFI should trip long before the leakage got high enough to hurt anybody. but....
There's no reason for an animal to be injured by a defective heater. It should be easy to cover the tank and have the water drip into the trough so there's no electrical contact.
They invented conduit so critters couldn't chew through cables. Burying cables also helps. They can't chew what they can't get at.

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A GFI doesn't require everything or anything to be grounded to work. Grounding all the metal within a barn, stall, etc would be impractical. Which is why a GFI should be in place.
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On 1/28/2012 1:21 PM, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

What I meant was, "grounding stuff that has potential to get shorted to Hot wiring causes the GFI to trip, so you don't have to wait for the animal to trip it." You only have to ground stuff that has potential to short to the grid. A ground rod is pretty simple and inexpensive. This is in ADDITION to the GFI. And renders the question, "what happens if the animal trips the GFI" moot. It's already tripped.
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On 1/28/2012 1:21 PM, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

What I meant was, "grounding stuff that has potential to get shorted to Hot wiring causes the GFI to trip, so you don't have to wait for the animal to trip it." You only have to ground stuff that has potential to short to the grid. A ground rod is pretty simple and inexpensive. This is in ADDITION to the GFI. And renders the question, "what happens if the animal trips the GFI" moot. It's already tripped.
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