Does having multiple RJ45 jacks degrade the Internet signal a lot?

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On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 15:06:14 +0000, Stephen

Best practice would be to use a POE switch at the entry point - it provides the POE and retransmits the data, breaking the network into 2 segments (both of which have the theoretical 75 or 100 meter length capability)

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On Dec 24, 10:52 am, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

It would seem to me the best thing to do would be to run one line from the outside antenna direct to a central distribution point in the house. At that central point, you put the switch. Then any RJ45 jacks in the house are run to the central point.
But a lot depends on what it is he's intending to do, the various uses, how easy it is to run cable, etc. For at least some of the uses, wireless may be a better option, as someone already pointed out. No wire to run. Wired to the various rooms/uses is still going to provide more reliable connection and better data rate. But if the WISP connection is the limiting factor, having 1 gig ethernet inside the house doesn't get you much, unless you;re moving data between devices.
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On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 09:32:21 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

I was remiss in not stating the intention.
I have a typical home setup (kids, wife, etc.) on computers.
Very little data is between devices (except to the wireless printer).
Some rooms are just too hard to wire - so - I just need to wire the game room (for the WII) and the office (for the VOIP phone & desktop computer).
I think I like best the option
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On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 08:04:38 +0000 (UTC), Chuck Banshee

at all [possible. Each connection can degrade the signal.
If you want to split the cable where it enters the building best practice would be to install an active switch (if you are running ethernet) at the entrance - you can go 285 feet (some say 100 meters, but that's stretching it) on both sides of the switch, and up to 4 switches in "series"
Terminate with cat5 or cat5e spec RJ45 jacks or plugs. (plug on end of cable goung ito and out of switch, jack in wall)
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On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 10:32:51 -0500, clare wrote:

Thanks for that idea! I had not thought of the option of an active switch...
Does this makes sense? - Start at the WISP antenna Bullet M2 radio (set up as a router) outside - Wire goes from that radio/router (set to serve as DHCP) to just inside the house - Just inside the house, that wire goes to the 15 volt Ubiquiti POE - From the POE, the wire goes directly to the 'active switch' also just inside the house - From that active switch, I presume I can have four (or more) ports - So, one port goes to the 25 feet to the center of the house to a wall jack (placed where I drilled the hole in the picture) - At that wall port, I can put the central WRT54G wireless router for the house - I assume I can send another wire out of one of the four ports of the active switch at the wall of the house to the game room (where the WII sits).
Would that work?
I think the IP address of the WII would then be different than the IP addresses of the devices on the other end of the WRT54G router ... so that's why I ask if this would work?
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On Sun, 25 Dec 2011 07:19:55 +0000 (UTC), Chuck Banshee

I don't see any reason why not - but a few questions. The antenna is a router ? - so inside for the wireless you only want an ACCESS POINT. Is the WRT54G capable of working as an access point?
Apparently yes: From googling
Settings to change (obviously, do this while plugged into a LAN port on it): Setup > basic setup > select 'auto config DHCP' in the connection type drop-down; enter a good (outside of your DHCP range) IP address (and, of course, match your current subnet); and click 'disable' on the DHCP server line. Then (here's where it becomes an AP; but, the wording's a bit wierd): Setup > advanced routing > select 'router' from the operating mode drop-down (in Linksys, Router = AP, Gateway = Router); 'both' on the dynamic routing line; and 'LAN & Wireless' on the interface entry.
Of course, remember to click the 'save changes' button before you go on to the next screen. Do, this, and your WRT54G is now a switch/WAP
Any reason not to just put the access point at the entry point, as it is also an active switch? Is the wireless range adequate???.
I'd try that first - and if the range is insufficient, move it upstairs to the center of the house and add the switch.
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On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 08:04:38 +0000 (UTC), Chuck Banshee

The basic idea is to build a "star" (also known as home run). Everything comes to a central location, where you locate a 10/100baseT ethernet switch. You can add additional ethernet switches at any endpoint that needs more than one connection (forming a "tree").

Very vague. What manner of hardware are you installing? Most WISP system use PoE to the radio/antenna on the roof, and ethernet to some manner of power injector. From there, you run ethernet to a local router, and then to the central ethernet switch. The router might be built into your unspecified model WISP radio. Note that I said "switch", not "hub". You do not want a hub.
Hopefully, you didn't run 75ft of coaxial cable between the radio and the antenna. That's much too long. Cable losses at 2.4GHz are quite high.

My Zircon stud sensor sorta works. However, I cheat. I have photos of what's inside my walls from before the drywall and paneling was added.
While it's nice to have the outlet box attached to a stud, it's not necessary. There are rework PVC device boxes, that attach to the drywall.
RJ45 jacks do not cause loss. Un-connected jacks do not cause loss. Unterminated cables do not cause loss. The catch is that you have to install one cable for each RJ45 jack. Since CAT5e has 4 pairs of wires, and ethernet uses only 2 pairs, you can split the cable pairs and wire two jacks on the wall jacks, and attach two RJ45 plugs at the other end of the cable. However, if you're using PoE on this segment, you'll need all 4 pairs to the wall jack.
Since you're running CAT5 through the wall base plate, you'll need to drill a large enough hole to accommodate the number of cables you need. If you only want to run one cable, then perhaps adding an ethernet switch near the wall plate might be easier.

Hint: a "wire" is a single length of insulated copper. a "cable" is a collection of wires enclosed by a vinyl jacket.
Hopefully, this cable is CAT5e. It will need to run from the rooftop mast, to the nearest convenient location that has AC power (for PoE). That's usually also the location of the central ethernet switch.

No. Wall plates are NOT waterproof. You should use a proper cable entry. For rooftops, that's a "rams head". For wall entry, cable entry with a drip loop. There are some tricks involved (such as slightly angling the hole in the wall upward so accumulated water drips outward). Also, leave a service loop for anything that you install in the wall. Talk to a DBS satellite dish installer for clues.

Nope, as long as there is an ethernet switch between each segment. However, if you're talking about running multiple segments and just splicing them together, that also works. I suggest you terminate each end with an RJ45 plug, and use a coupler to make the connection. It's a bit more complex, but much easier to troubleshoot when the kids, puppy, or mice, chew up the cable. <http://www.ebay.com/itm/260915346939

Do NOT hide anything INSIDE the wall. One little spark or overheated power device, and you'll have a fire in an inaccessible location.

Yes. As long as the 2nd jack is on a separate CAT5e cable, there's no deterioration in the signal. The problem is that there's NEVER enough ethernet wall jacks. If you expect that you'll need one, then install two. If you think you'll need two, then install four. 6 jacks is about the limit. Extra cable is cheaper than the time to do it over again.
There are also ethernet switches that will fit in the wall, but you won't like the price: <(Amazon.com product link shortened)>

I think you're over your head a little. Best to Google the internet for CAT5 and ethernet installation instructions and examples. Also, talk to a professional cable installer before you make a major mistake. The danger is that if you have a house fire, and the fire inspector finds non-code compliant creative wiring, you run the risk of having your insurance company declare that you were the cause of the fire.
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Is there any code for wire beneath 48V? I though the whole idea behind low voltage wiring is that it is code free. Otherwise you would need an electrician to wiring up a new phone outlet.
The trouble with networking experts is these are all the guys who were run out of the alarm business when ADT and others started their free installations. They became networking experts, home theater experts, etc. Not that I blame them for finding new jobs where they can be self employed, but quality is all over the map.
Don't get me wrong. Some of these networking guys are really sharp. I use a local guy for auto parts that is a CNI. Trouble is it is more profitable to sell parts on the net than compete with the rest of the networking firms. I have a friend that does networking strictly for commercial and municipal jobs, and survives pretty much by having a long list of jobs well done. Nobody in city hall wants to be the guy that hired the clown network company, and so they write the bids with enough legal mumbo jumbo that few first timers want to compete.
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Yep. It's called signaling or communications cable. Network wiring and telco are covered as NEC article 800. <http://ecmweb.com/nec/code-basics/electric_article_communications_circuits/ The basic it is to keep the stuff away from power cables.

There's no such thing as code free. If the NFPA had its way, there would be specifications for the toilet paper.

Nope. Real cable experts are usually BICSI certified: <https://www.bicsi.org/single.aspx?l $64,4192,4194> Note that BISCI also has a wireless designer certification: <https://www.bicsi.org/double.aspx?l%72&r%74 I'm tempted. Only $345... ouch.
However, I agree about the quality. I only got the jobs that no sane and competent installer would accept. If I make a profit, I might actually document my work or label a few things.

Yep. However, the reason is different. The convoluted specs are usually to avoid legal complications and to cover the customers ass when the whole mess goes to litigation. I've been asked to carry oversight insurance, with the customer as the sole beneficiary, just in case they screwed up the job specifications. (Hint: I don't do much wiring these daze).
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# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
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In California, all the cities and counties have low voltage wiring inspections as part of code compliance. In most cases, they simply require compliance to the latest NEC wiring codes. They may add their own details, but the basic requirements will need to be met. Incidentally, the Peoples Republic of Santa Cruz requires a permit for any construction costing over $500.

It's not the wiring that's the problem. It's how it's mounted and what it's made from. For example, you need to run plenum cable through air spaces. Plenum cable does not generate much smoke and will therefore not asphixiate fire fighters. Proper support and using riser cable for long vertical runs is simply best practices to prevent the wire falling or breaking under its own weight.
Try this quiz for practice: <http://ecmweb.com/nec/whats_wrong_here/whats_wrong_122211/ <http://ecmweb.com/nec/whats_wrong_here/whats_wrong_here_20100701/ Plenty more: <http://ecmweb.com/nec/whats_wrong_here/

From my limited and somewhat dated experience, the inspector doesn't care much about sloppy LAN wiring. He's probably a former electrician or contractor and doesn't know much about LAN wiring anyway. He does care that the low voltage wiring is at least 2" away from AC power, that it doesn't share any wall outlet boxes, and that it's not running high currents through the cabling. Incidentally, some IEEE spec recommends 6" for 120vac and 12" for 240vac. Where there are few cables, the inspection is rather superficial. Where there's a large number of cables (hospital, corporate, data center, etc), the inspections are more thorough.
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On 12/25/2011 7:57 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

never pass muster with the lady of the house. Bad enough they try to block outlets with furniture. Your suggestion of wiring two walls on either side of the door is a good one. Almost any wire in a room can be tolerated except if it crosses a door.
Years ago I took a structured wiring "class" at CES, just to see what was happening. This was before the WWW was cranking at 11, though it existed. They suggested two networks per room. I could never get a reasonable explanation for why this was a good idea. Not on different walls, but two networks to the same outlet. Like the person saw it done, but didn't really know why himself. Of course there is no shortage of space on the wall outlet plate for multiple RJ45.
That was where I learned nearly everyone in the class was an ex-alarm installer. Oy!
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Been there. Use a recessed wall plate: <http://cableorganizer.com/datacomm-electronics/recessed-pro-power-flat-panel-kits/ <http://cableorganizer.com/leviton/decora-recessed-duplex-receptacles.html
I dunno about this one: <
http://images1.cableorganizer.com/leviton/decora-recessed-receptacles/690-i-lg.jpg

Yep. It didn't take me much to work out the problem and magic formula. Convincing the customer is much more difficult.

I've never heard that one.
I've had an electrician tell me that the right way to wire a house is to put run 4 wires instead of 3 to each wall outlet, and set them up so that each of the two outlets goes to a seperate breaker, and possibly a seperate phase. It's also handy for wiring 220VAC in the same outlet. The extra wire can also be used for wiring 3 way switches. Probably a good idea, but nobody is doing it.

These daze, home alarms are either carrier current on the AC power wires, or wireless.
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On 12/25/2011 10:02 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

<http://cableorganizer.com/datacomm-electronics/recessed-pro-power-flat-panel-kits/
<
http://images1.cableorganizer.com/leviton/decora-recessed-receptacles/690-i-lg.jpg
That would sure be a lot of breakers.
I vaguely remember (which makes it likely I'm wrong) that there is an issue regarding running different phases in the same box unless it really is 220.
You've probably seen large homes where they use multiple breaker boxes. I assuming there is a price point where the second box saves enough wire that it is worth the effort.
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Yep. A simple ferrite xformer between phases solves that problem. <http://www.smarthome.com/_/Troubleshooting_Training/Phase_Coupler/X10_Problem_Solvers/_/t/2Q9/1TP/nav.aspx>

It has nothing to do with the breaker box. As long as they are fed by the same transformer on the pole, it works.
Another method is the relatively new Z-wave 900Mhz devices. Whatever works, the idea is to avoid installing new wiring with the home alarm and monitor system. For example, this DIY store offers 3 types of alarm systems; wired, wireless, and hybrid. <http://www.youralarmstore.com
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Also the ampacity of the main(s). This is particularly true of large homes where central air conditioning or heat pumps are the norm.
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I could see a network with QOS priority making sense. I guess the "quality" feed is sent to a switch from the router, and then all the VOIP goes on that switch.
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On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 13:36:12 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

I now realize a 'star' topology is what I want (but I didn't know that until now).
I was initially thinking of using my Linksys WRT54G router as the center of the star!
That's why I was asking about additional jacks.
I was going to go from the four LAN ports of the WRT54G to the WII in the game room (via additional wall jacks).
I think now that was a bad idea (right?).
The 'better' idea, as you noted, is to use an 'active ethernet switch' as the center of the star. Right?
Drawing it on paper, does this make sense of what you suggested? 1. WISP antenna ~75 feet from the house 2. Ubiquiti Bullet M2 radio set up in router mode & DHCP server 3. POE just inside the house (it's an indoor Ubiquiti 15 volt POE unit) 4. Active 10/100 Ethernet switch just inside the house 5a. Out of the switch, one wire goes to the office (25 feet away) 5b. From there it goes to the Linksys WRT54G wireless router 5c. From there, the signal goes to the wireless devices scattered about 6a. Out of the switch, another wire goes to the game room (25 feet away) 6b. From a game room wall jack, a jumper goes to the WII 6c. This will be a different IP address - but that should be OK (right?)
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On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 13:36:12 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

I had to look up hub versus switches versus routers. - Hub: What goes in one port goes out all the others - Switch: What goes in one port is 'intelligently' sent to another - Router: Connects two networks to share the Internet connection
My desired setup is similar to what you've described.
- The 19 dBi planar antenna is outside on a pole pointed at the WISP AP - (The antenna is not on the roof because I break tiles every time I go on the roof!) - Connected to the antenna is an outdoor Ubiquiti Bullet M2 radio - That outdoor radio is currently configured as a router (not a bridge) and it is set up to serve DHCP addresses and perform NAT - From there the outdoor cat5 cable connects to a Ubiquiti 15volt POE - From the POE, is up to me.
All I need is two wired points inside the house: - The office (which is in a central location & where I'll put the WRT54G broadband wireless router) - The game room (which has a WII that I'd like to connect by wire)
I'd like the 'star' topology previously mentioned.
I'm confused if I need the "active 10/100 Ethernet switch" because I'm wondering if the Linksys WRT54G is 'already' an active 10/100 Ethernet switch.
Is it?
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On Sun, 25 Dec 2011 07:50:54 +0000 (UTC), Chuck Banshee

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I bought several of those switches. Gigabit works well enough, but I was never able to get close to wire speed with them. I'm not sure if it's the switch or something else. Caveat Emptor.

Huh? An ethernet switch works on ISO layer 2 (MAC layer). DHCP works on layers 2 and 3 (IP layer). As long as the switch can pass broadcast packets (they all should), you should not have any problems with DHCP broadcasts and negotiations. Each port on the switch has its own MAC address. Your DHCP server should be picking up the MAC address of the originating computer, not the local switch. If it grabs the switch MAC address, then yes, it will try to change IP address every time you move the ethernet port. However, that's NOT the way it should work. Double checking:
C:\>arp -aInterface: 192.168.1.11 --- 0x4 Internet Address Physical Address Type 192.168.1.1 00-16-01-97-fd-a6 dynamic
Yep... that's the MAC address of my Buffalo WHR-HP-G54 wireless router, and not the MAC address of the ethernet switch located between my PC and the router.

No comment. I won't generalize by manufacturer. Each one has their winners and their losers. Dlink seems about average.
I recently picked up several Dlink DIR-601 (N150) wireless routers. <http://www.dlink.com/products/?pids7 These are cheap and basic routers. So far, no problems or failures. I expected problems due to the new "green" features, such as reducing the ethernet transceiver power for short cable lengths, but so far, so good. <http://www.dlinkgreen.com/greenproducts.asp
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