Actually the OP's post probably doesn't deserve this kind of ridicule; any more than my dad did in my previous post. Those a little older will remember when shutoff valves were pretty uncommon in older homes. The thumb-then-cap trick was not uncommon, and often used by plumbers or installation men. You had to be careful. And make sure the pilot was off and a window was open.
RonB
And dont forget the pilot light is still burning in the furnace, and possibly the water heater too.....
Yes they do.
But that was outdoors. Even then that practice is stupid because any flame or a car backfiring, or whatever could cause a blast. The gas pressure BEFORE the meter\regulator is much higher too. Actually that regulator is what drops the pressure.
Or call a local furnace company, tell them the brand and model of the furnace. Most will tell you how. Or go to the library and learn how to light a pilot. The web should have that info too. You should know how to light the pilot anyhow. What if it goes out in the middle of the night during a 20 BELOW winter weather. Or ask your neighbors. Most people can light a pilot.
I looked at the furnace insturctions last night. It turns out that the pilot starts automatically, and it is not possible to restart by hand. Armed with that information, and knowing that I can restart the pilot on the water heater, I'll just just off the main, the cap it when I know there is not any gas running. For anyone else reading this, I was planning to cap the line from the outdoors where the fireplace bump out is. I had no intention of filling the house with gas. Not only would that not smell so good, but there are other dangers too. :-)
Thanks for the advice, R
rabacu wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@a10g2000vbz.googlegroups.com:
Well, I too had jumped to conclusions. If your fireplace gasline is outside, it will all be much easier and safer. But, believe me, turning off the main is the safe way to go. You never know what problem pops up when you get the fireplace gasline open ...
Hi there:
Just following up.
A couple of weeks ago, a licensed plumber replaced an elbow on the gas line for the water heater, he just disconnected the elbow, then replaced it, and even though a shutoff valve was about 3 feet before the elbow, he did not bother to shut it off, which surprised me.
I looked at the furnace insturctions last night. It turns out that the pilot will start automatically, and it is not possible to restart the furnace pilot by hand.
Armed with that information, and knowing that I can restart the pilot on the water heater, I'll just just off the main, the cap it because then I'll I know there is not any gas running.
For anyone else reading this, I was planning to cap the line from the outdoors where the fireplace bump out is. I had no intention of filling the house with gas. I don't know if that would happen in the 15-20 seconds the line would be open or not, but gas in the house is not what I want. Not only would that not smell so good, but there are other dangers too. :-)
Thanks for the advice, R
so to replace a main line gas valve the gas company turns gas off for hundreds of homes, requiring turning off and locking out every home and business then going back and turning on each home, relighting all pilot lights, when some locations wouldnt be accesible people on vacation etc.....
WRONG they work with lives lines, just like the power companies do, for many repairs.
and a open line for up to a minute isnt going to fill any home with gas.....
home gas lines are low flow, and natural gas must have a specific mix to explode.....
normally I tturn main off but have done things with live lines to save time and hassle. just have the windows open and use common sense
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:iqok5o $lpt$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:
Not sure that is a good idea, just incase the drop in gas pressure sucks the flame and air back into the line.
Not a problem.
It's still positive P, even if it's dropping.
It's _gauge_ pressure in inches H20; not absolute. It has to be positive pressure above atmospheric or it won't flow when you turn on a burner on the stove, for example.
If the supply valve is off, the internal pressure will drop to atmospheric but there's no way it'll go lower in a closed system (you could conceivably pull reverse on an open line that had another appliance still operating from the draft, but that wouldn't be the situation postulated w/ the main off).
--
Yes, it is a good idea.
The flame won't flow back into the line. There's no oxygen in the line to support combustion and the openings are designed small so that this can't happen. There's now way anything would get "sucked" into the line.
Otherwise, on the first loss of pressure from the gas company the whole system would blow up.
Glad to hear it worked out for the OP. I suspected that the furnace might be auto start. Mine's got a pilot which I've had to light a few times over the years.
Common sense says turn the gas off.
I can hear it (common sense), I hear it right now, screaming in my ear. It says "turn the gas off stupid". If you play with gas you're going to lose.
:)
NOT TRUE.
I have LP gas in my house and when it runs out, it just runs out until the flame dies. Same as when you have a propane grill on a 20lb cylinder, or a propane torch on one of those disposible small tanks. Or for that matter, your BIC lighter. If all these things blew up from the flame getting sucked in, when they run out of gas, everything would be blowing up.
The best way to eliminate the pressure in gas pipes, is to burn off the gas on the kitchen stove or a gas fireplace, or let the water heater or furnace do it. Actually there is not that much gas in the pipes, and the flame will go out quickly, but burn off what you can, and you wont have the odor or slight risk of an explosion.
As far as the OP finally getting wise in this matter, and having an electronic ignition in his furnace, why not install a valve on this gas line while you're at it. Unscrew the pipe from the fireplace to the basement, put the valve in the basement right below that rise pipe. Be sure to still cap it when you're doing your work and the pipe is not connected. All it takes is someone to turn that valve and fill your house with gas. NEVER leave any unused gas pipe uncapped, unless you are going to connect the "appliance" immediately.
By the way, when shutting off the gas main, be sure to turn the thermostate way down, or cut the power to the furnace or that electronic igniter will keep sparking, and could burn out.
I didn't know it was outdoors either, but it's still best to shut off the gas. Now I must ask..... WHY do you have a fireplace outside?
I'll work on electric live. Of course there are ways to do it safely which must be followed. But a live wire is not leaking explosive gas into the air. When I work on gas pipes, I shut off the gas. And even with the electric there are limits. Like never work on the Mains live, when there is no disconnect. And if there is a disconnect, shut it off. But I have been in situations where I have had to replace an outlet or switch live. For example, when I worked for a rental company, it was not uncommon to work on the wiring in one apartment and find a circuit connected to the power from the next door apartment. And if those people were not home to disconnect the power, I could not wait around for them to come home, I had other jobs to do.
Of course I'd always report to the building owner that they have the wiring mixed up between apartments, and we can rewire to fix that, but most owners did not care. I still recall one very old building that was built in the late 1800's as a huge mansion. It had been converted to 4 apartments. It had the old K&T wiring, and the circuits were so mixed up that I'd be working in a handy box in the attic, and sparks would start blowing when I had all the upstairs apartments shut off. The owner decided to pay us to straighten out the mess because some tenants were paying 70% of the electic for the building while others were paying 10%. But he did not want the walls ripped up. We did our best, and got it so that at least 90% of the circuits were going to the right apartment, but there were a few lights that could not be changed without ripping the building apart. That job took over a week, and was like a jigsaw puzzle to figure out. We made sure that the heavy loads (appliances, Air cond, etc) were going to the correct meter, but like I said, a few lights just could not be changed without ripping he walls and ceilings apart. The owner was satisfied, even with a high bill, and we felt that the electric bills for the tenants would be pretty fair. We worked on several of these type of places. All were old mansions converted to apartments and all of them had the wiring all messed up.
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