Never heard of a vice versa. Wouldn't think there would be a demand.
If I remember right there were gas conversions for coal furnaces. I know there were gas conversions for oil furnaces. I would think there are (were?) gas conversions for oil boilers. (Maybe not now with tighter standards.)
Weil McLain is the largest manufacturer of cast iron boilers in the USA, and I expect the largest manufacturer in all of North America.
Here is Weil McLain's "Products" web page that shows all of the different types of boilers currently available from Weil McLain.
'Residential Boilers, Commercial Boilers | Weil-McLain'
Note the "2" at the top of the product selection indicating that the first page only shows the first 12 different kinds of boilers. Weil McLain offers 9 different kinds of residential gas fired boilers, 4 different kinds of oil fired residential boilers and 7 different kinds of commercial boilers.
On the second page it calls three of their commercial boilers "gas oil" boilers, which to me means that they can be set up to fire on either kind of fuel; and could undoubtedly be switched from one to the other relatively quickly and easily. I could see a demand for that feature in places like Alaska where gas may be temporarily interrupted by an earthquake that severs the gas lines. Places like hospitals and government offices could have their own oil storage tanks and switch over to burning oil until the gas service is restored.
What I don't see, however, are residential boilers that can burn either kind of fuel or a conversion kit to allow a residential boiler firing one kind of fuel to burn another. What I do see, however, is that Weil McLain's GV90+ gas fired residential boiler can be easily converted to propane, which would be of similar advantage to houses in Alaska or California or British Columbia where earthquakes are more common; or in urban areas where the gas utility isn't reliable.
'GV90+ Gas Boiler | Weil-McLain | Product Detail'
Anyhow, it's possible that boilers made 20 years ago, and those that sold well in some parts of the continent were different than those available today. But, from what little snooping I've done on Weil McLain's web site I'm coming to the conclusion that being able to switch a boiler that's meant to fire gas to one that burns oil, or vice versa, isn't very common. If the boiler was designed to fire either fuel, you have that option, but if it wasn't designed for that, then I'm expecting that option isn't available to you.
But, I'm old enough to acknowledge that I don't know everything like I did when I was 15, so I might be dead wrong on this one too.
I recall a story about a homeowner who had the old oil tank removed from their basement when switching to a natural gas boiler. The filler for the old tank was still outside and you guessed it, an oil supply truck driver hooked up to the tankless filler and quite a few gallons were dumped into the home's basement. It would be common sense to block or remove the filler to any old oil tank to keep such a mistake from happening. ^_^
TDD
No maintenance. After doing the conversion I never had anyone look at the system again.
Well, if you're going to be that way, the *real* source of the energy is *solar*. ;-)
Sure, but like a refrigerator, it was time to replace them long before they failed.
Conversion is easy IFF there is natural gas readily available. Propane may be a solution but its price varies widely so there it's not necessarily worthwhile.
You can. There are gas "conversion burners" made to replace oil burners.
The gas is "sprayed" into the combustion chamber with air, just like the oil burner. Gas has the advantage that it's cleaner and is already a gas so doesn't have to be atomized. It works really well.
You can. It's a simple swap of the burner. They aren't all that cheap but it's a trivial job for anyone who has serviced oil burners.
Somewhat true. Many areas that didn't have gas service fifty years ago, now do. It really is worthwhile to convert, given a chance. Obviously, if there is no gas available (or propane is too expensive) it can't be done (or isn't worthwhile).
Not so much. A 20Y0 firebox likely won't last that 80 years. If major surgery like that is needed, scrap the whole thing and get an updated unit.
That's a good point. Heating-degree-days make all the difference.
If natural gas isn't available in Houston, I'd be looking at a mini-split (heat pump).
Good grief. These things aren't rockets. If it doesn't work, swap the part.
There's no way to know without running the numbers. I'd certainly do everything possible to get rid of an oil burner!
Roughly the same as you had with the old oil burner. The lost heat goes up the chimney. With the same boiler design and the same output heat, the same heat goes up the chimney. TANSTAAFL.
The conversion burner is a cheap way to do exactly that; convert between fuels. Of course, if money is no object or the old boiler needs more than just a burner, a complete replacement is in order.
When I did it, the gas company paid for all of the work (inside and out) except the burner (which I rented) and a cleanout cut in the chimney $50 (which should have been there, by code).
I think a complete new boiler could be in order even if money is taken into consideration. You have to look at what it costs to convert the old inefficient boiler to gas, versus what it costs for a whole new efficient boiler, the annual energy cost differences, rebates, etc. Just a few years ago you could get $1500 in a federal tax credit, plus state incentives, utility rebates, etc but only on new systems that met energy star efficiency standards. You wouldn't have gotten any of that here in NJ on a conversion. That brings the cost of a new boiler way down. With the cost of new boiler at $2000, I would think today even without the federal credit, it could make economic sense to get a high eff new boiler. You have to look at the actual numbers, rebates, etc.
That's nice, if such a deal happens to be available. What would the cost have been if you had opted for a new high eff boiler?
All sorts of combinations exist.
I've been associated with boilers in one way or another since my first job in 1963 where we build heating and AC products. Last place I worked we had dual fired units. We'd run gas most of the time, but when it got really cold, the gas company would call and give us two hours to switch over to oil. We got a special low rate for that and we'd only have to go to oil a few days a year. We burned about 250 gallons of oil a day so the price differential was considerable.
At another place, we burned #6 oil. On a Monday, you's start up with #2 until the pre-heater with steam probe warmed the #6 to flow.
The building we have where I work now has just about anything you can imagine. Two fire tube gas high pressure steam boilers for process, a gas cast iron low pressure steam for heating, 5 gas unit heaters, 2 steam unit heaters, 2 oil furnaces. 2 gas high efficiency water boilers,
3 gas fired rooftop heating units, fin and tube cooling tower, water cooling tower, water recirculating system (tank, sump, 5 pumps) for process cooling and even some electric baseboard. Getting ready for winter keeps my maintenance guy busy for a couple of hours.
You bring up a good point. It's quite likely that he already has AC, so switching that to a heat pump shouldn't be a big deal. Gas is almost certainly a better choice but a heat pump shouldn't be a terrible choice for Houston.
I hope you send copy of that information to EPA and Wash DC and so on. They will be thrilled.
. Christ> >
How does one "rent" a burner?
. Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus
On 9/26/2013 1:33 PM, snipped-for-privacy@attt.bizz wrote: Subject: Battery booster pack Date: Thursday, July 24, 2008 8:17 AM
A useful device, is a battery booster pack. You can find them at Walmart, or any auto parts store. Just a 12 volt gel cell battery and a couple cables and clamps. The one I have, I paid about eight bucks at BJ's Wholesale Club. I got one about five years ago, and it was totally useful. The battery is strong enough to jump start a vehicle, when the auto battery is dead. The inverter on the back provides up to 300 watts of AC 110 volt power for up to
45 minutes, if the internal battery is fully charged. The booster pack has an internal charger, just flip open the little door, and stick on the end of an extension cord. The booster pack will run a floor or table lamp for several hours of light. More hours, if you use a power saver compact fluorescent bulb or fluorescent desk lamp. Much brighter than candles or camping lantern. And far, far safer.Has a light on the front. On mine, I pulled the lens off, and pull the bulb out. It's too easy to bump the light switch and the battery goes dead. At least, that's what I thought was the problem. Turns out the battery wasn't holding a charge. This was winter time, so I figured I'd killed the battery by letting it freeze. Here is an identical unit, with a different brand name.
Now, the price has gone up a bit. I paid eighty bucks for mine, and now they are getting one seventy five. Ouch!
Says retail $250 but they only get $150. Things going up in price, I see.
When mine went dead, I took the cables, clamps, and so on. And the inverter. Wired it all to a garden tractor battery from Walmart. Found out later on my own van, that the garden tractor battery isn't strong enough to boost a vehicle engine. However, it does provide some 12 volt power, and also the
300 watts of AC for a few minutes is useful.About the time I bought a second one of these. Another eighty bucks. And the battery went dead. I called the factory and found out they had bought a load of old batteries. The rep there offered me a replacement battery, which was much cheaper than replacing the unit. Being a repair man, it wasn't all that hard to pull the box apart, and swap out another battery.
Harbor Freight has booster packs aroud fifty bucks, with a battery and lighter socket and some cables and clamps. The inverter is only about thirty bucks at Walmart, so you can get the jump pack and a separte inverter. For about the same money I paid five years ago. The Walmart $30 inverter plugs into a lighter socket, so you can move it from car to car, or run it off the battery booster pack.
Of course, you have to charge the unit after each use. Most of these come with their own wall charger. Take it home and plug it into the 110 volt power. I rigged a cord with a 12 volt lighter plug on each end. So I can plug the cord into the vehicle and into the jump pack. Charge while I'm driving.
In houston I'd keep using it until it really needed replacing. You just don't have all that much of a heating season. At that point I'd go with a heat pump.
Another consideration that hasn't been mentioned so far is that by switching to a high efficiency gas (or oil) boiler, you also acquire a new problem.
They call them "condensing boilers" because they recover so much heat from the burning fuel that the water vapour in the flue condenses to form water.
Now, anyone that's familiar with drinking carbonated soft drinks knows that CO2 dissolves in water, and that's often what gives carbonated soft drinks their "bite". Well, in the case of the condensate that comes off of high efficiency condensing boilers, that condensate is actually very acidic, and just putting it into your house's main drain line isn't healthy for that drain line.
In my case, when I put my two high efficiency condensing boilers into service, I immediately set about making a pH neutralizing filter out of limestone. Basically, the condensate would pass through a 5 foot long 2 inch diameter PVC pipe containing limestone before it would end up in my sump pit.
The limestone we have here near Tyndal, Manitoba is about 95% calcium carbonate. It's basically the calcium carbonate shells of sea creatures that lived millions of years ago and compacted into a continuous rock by the weight of Lake Aggasiz, which was a lake that covered most of southern Manitoba millions of years ago. But, even at 95 percent calcium carbonate, I was still finding that I had to clean my limestone every coupla weeks or so. The condensate would dissolve the calcium carbonate, but leave behind the 5 percent that didn't dissolve as a "fuzzy" kinda residue on the limestone rocks. That fuzzy residue would keep water stagnant within the thin layer of fuzz just like insulation keeps air stagnant, and that would severely reduce the effectiveness of the filter. I had to empty the limestone rocks out every couple of weeks and basically rub them against each other so that they cleaned that fuzz off each other, thereby restoring the effectiveness of the filter. Now, I'm using a product called NM-20 from Axiom Industries in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan that's almost 100 percent soluble in the condensate, and so I only clean my pH filter once every few months now; more often in winter because of the additional condensate produced.
But, if the OP is a busy professional with kids that need to be chauffeured to soccer and judo and ballet and every other kind of activity kids take an interest in, it might not be the smartest thing to opt for a high efficiency condensing boiler because that's going to give him/her one more chore that needs to be done periodically. They might prefer to simply have a less efficient boiler and let the water vapour go up the chimney than be saddles with additional work cleaning their condensate neutralizing bed regularily.
I know when I was still using limestone in my neutralizing bed I was wondering how much longer I could keep up that practice of cleaning the limestone every 2 or 3 weeks, and the idea of keeping it up for years was a depressing one.
It's certainly worth it to run the numbers. A boiler may be $2000 but it's likely 6000$ installed, forgetting any issues with the structure (running a new flue, etc.) In the Houston climate, it might not pay. BTW, the burner is $500 or so, so that certainly has to be part of the equation.
As has been pointed out here several times, one has to run the numbers on all of the reasonable alternatives. I'd start with the conversions that are common in the area.
Well over $6000.
That's code in most areas where this sort of thing is common. The gas company will demand it.
I can easily imagine why you didn't go that route.
. Christ> >
Bug Out Bags -- levels and layers by Christopher A. Young August 15, 2008
Emergencies come in different levels. It is some times possible to size up a situation. Before, or during the event. If your car breaks down, and you're walking home. That's a different severity than if another nation is invading, and you need to be out of the cities.
Bug out bags can also be "get home" bags. It is very possible you're at work, and your chosen action is to get home to your warm home with a good stock of supplies.
This article won't tell you what to put in your bag. Contents are varied, based on your personal and medical needs. Also time of year, and type of emergency.
And here are some proposed layers of bags.
FANNY PACK When you are on a day hike with your church group, a fanny pack (also called bum bag) can be worn, without attracting much attention. This bag straps around your waist, and allows you to pack some supplies. With out wearing a full backpack.
KIDS PACK Children, when they start walking, can understand carrying something along. Especially if everyone in the family is carrying stuff. Kids pack should be lighter weight than the adult packs. Perhaps focusing more on food and clothing. Kids grow rapidly, so check the clothing two or three times a year, and see if it still fits.
SHORT TERM BUG OUT BAG (ALSO GET-HOME BAG) If the emergency happens when you are away from home, a short term bags is needed. Some call this a 72 hour kit. These bags would be lower profile and be without obvious weapons. You'd not want to be wearing a battle rifle on your back to get home from a traffic jam. That's sure to get you questioned by the police.
LONG TERM BUG OUT BAG
This is what you would take along if there was a good chance that you would not be coming back and things were really nasty. Foriegn invasion, or maybe EMP burst, and the cities are riot zones. You'd want much more food, clothing, medical, and weapons, etc.
STEP UP PACK Since many of the same items are included in a short and long term bag. It makes sense to figure out what "extra" items are that are needed for long term. Develop a pack that could be used to upgrade the short term bag to a long term bag. In the case of a long term bug out, you would take along both the short bag, and the upgrade. Since you're planning for a much longer time frame, the upgrade may be in a wheelbarrow, or some kind of wheeled "Mormon Handcart".
CAR KITS If you have one emergency vehicle bag, then much of the time it's in your "other car" and not with you. Each vehicle needs a bag, a 72 hour kit of sorts. With the basics (matches, flashlight, food, space blankets). Winter beater vehicles will get extra winter related supplies.
When possible, start your long term bug out by vehicle. If you have enough early warning, you may be able to be far enough ahead of the crowds. You may be able to do 65 MPH down the open road, which is a lot faster and more comfortable than walking with a wheel barrow. Rope the wheel barrow on top of the car, you may need it if you get into a traffic jam or can't get gasoline.
RUBBERMAID READY At least a couple articles have been written, on the advantage of making an emergency kit for your home. This is typically packed in a Rubbermaid tote. Kept near the main door of your home, in case you need to leave in a hurry. While this is a good idea, many emergencies happen when you're already away from home. So, the Rubbermaid kit should be in addition to your car kits.
The same way you rent a propane tank or even a cable box. It's part of the bill.
Well, many soft drinks use phosphoric or citric acid to give them a "bite". Carbonic acid isn't all that "acidic".
What's the problem with mildly acidic water in the sump pit? There's plenty of water in the ground to dilute it. I can understand some concern about cast iron plumbing (though it will he highly diluted) but PVC?
Not buying it.
Sounds like you're way too anal.
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