best roofing ice and water shield?

[Smarty]

Roofers I speak to seem to strongly prefer Grace I/W Shield over Certainteed and Owens Corning btands despite a very big price difference.

Is the double or triple cost worth it?

Thanks very much !!

[Joe]

The technology of all these underlayments is based on a butyl rubber adhesive system that has been around for many years. There are similar sealant products used around windows and doors. If the Grace material is physically better I would be quite surprised. It does have an advantage in a faster means of removing the paper backing, which to a roofer (time=3Dmoney) is an advantage. That, coupled with an artificially inflated list price means more profit. For a DIY project any of the major brands should be just fine. You might check the different products out at your local lumberyard or box store to see if there are discernable differences that would make one or another a better choice. The rolls of the quality membrane will be quite heavy, making comparisons easy. HTH

Joe

[aemeijers]

I have no personal knowledge as to which product is best. However, if you are in the trades, 2x or 3x on material price is NOTHING compared to the time and goodwill cost of having callbacks and rework. One bad job can cost you 5 other jobs, once they tell their friends. And if the more expensive material goes in easier and quicker, all the better.

Remember, labor is usually half to two thirds of the cost of any project.

-- aem sends...

[Smarty]

The technology of all these underlayments is based on a butyl rubber adhesive system that has been around for many years. There are similar sealant products used around windows and doors. If the Grace material is physically better I would be quite surprised. It does have an advantage in a faster means of removing the paper backing, which to a roofer (time=money) is an advantage. That, coupled with an artificially inflated list price means more profit. For a DIY project any of the major brands should be just fine. You might check the different products out at your local lumberyard or box store to see if there are discernable differences that would make one or another a better choice. The rolls of the quality membrane will be quite heavy, making comparisons easy. HTH

Joe

Thanks very much Joe. I certainly would also tend to the heavier material, all things otherwise being equal. Since I have 2 old roofs being removed, and literally 20 to 30 thousand nails being removed in the process, I am also thinking that the heavier materials will also provide a little better puncture resistance if one or more nail heads are still sticking up from prior jobs. I am not sure if this makes any sense or not, and perhaps the felt paper / Titanium UDL underlayment takes care of this issue.

Many thanks again,

Smarty

[Smarty]

Yup, although the roofing people I have spoken to seem to be looking for cost savings if they can find them, and this Grace ice and water protection is expensive material, perhaps adding another 600 to 700 dollars to the cost of the materials versus the cheaper stuff from Carlisle, Owens Corning, etc. The Grace would be about $1200 whereas the Owens Corning is closer to 500 bucks.

Smarty

[Joe]

My roofer sub likes the DuPont product similar to Permafelt from Menards. I used the latter last summer and it is far better than felt for that critical first layer. For DIY projects, it will give you many days of leeway in completing the job and keep the weather out when unexpected rain arrives. Probably better than felt for water resistance and safer to walk on when the pitch gets over 4-12.

Joe

[aemeijers]

All depends how the job is bid out. Most residential rip'n'replace around here is done as a job price, not time and material. As long as customer trusts the roofer to not cut corners to get done faster, the tradeoff between material cost/labor/reliability is a decision on the roofer's part. Finding the sweet spot between cost and durability, etc. On a multi-thousand dollar repair job, if $700 additional gets me an extra 5 years of not worrying about leaks, it starts to look pretty cheap. If it gives the roofer a warm fuzzy about less callbacks, he may be willing to eat part of the cost difference. New construction is is different- the GC or architect specs out the materials, and all the sub has to play with are his labor costs, and how much markup to charge on the material, if he is the one providing it.

-- aem sends...

[Cooper]

I'm in the Midwest. Cost comparison, Grace & Certainteed are comparable.

I always preferred Certainteed (Winterguard) over Grace. Certainteed has more workability, than Grace. On a 5/12 or lower slope, we would start the roll at one end, and roll to the other end of the roof (with Certainteed), instead of using 10 ft. pieces. We would chaulk a line to keep the shield where we want it. Stripping back a corner of the split backing, and letting it tack down. On Grace, it's adhesion is too quick, making the roll less forgiving, meaning you must cut the roll to avoid wrinkles. I have no idea if this makes any sense to you, but basically, Certainteed has a more workability time, plus you don't have to cut the roll in smaller pieces to install.

Certainteed guarantees their product, as long as the shingle is guaranteed for. I haven't used Grace for probably 10 years, at that time, their guarantee was only for 10 years. I would think they might have extended it, to be competitive.

[bob haller]

Its just as important to address others issues that can cause leaks toi begin with, espically ice dams.

great attic venting clean gutters downspouts and drains, soffit vents covered with insulation?

[Smarty]

Absolutely, and many thanks to all for excellent suggestions.

[StepfanKing]

Well, duh! It's obvious you don't live in a harsh winter environment. Simply, you only live someplace where it snows.

[Andy]

Just make sure you tell the customer that you are using Grace and that it is more expensive. I had no knowledge of that. I received 3 estimates from contractors. Two were 20K for my rook and a third was 30K (for ice and water on the entire roof of my ranch). I immediately thought the third contract was trying to rip me off. It wasn't until I hired someone else and I spoke to the third contractor that he told me he was using Grace (He still didn't tell me Grace was twice as expensive as Owens Corning). I didn't find out about the price difference until I did my own research. So, from this home owner to you contractors, make sure you explain about the price difference between Grace and others!!!

[trader_4]

So you're trying to tell us that the price difference between a $30K quote for a roof job and the $20K quote is due to using a different water barrier? I say your first impression was correct. And unless it's some very unusual climate or a roof with low pitch, water barrier isn't needed on the entire roof anyway. A few decades ago those products didn't even exist and roofs were done without them.