home A/C and R-22 - cost per lb

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On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 12:39:40 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

If air could get in, there wouldn't be enough propane to matter.
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On 4/27/2013 4:59 PM, snipped-for-privacy@attt.bizz wrote:

I wonder if anyone has heard of a stoichiometric or near stoichiometric mixture? It doesn't have to be that close but you do need enough O2 and fuel to make a BOOM! The military and terrorists have used fuel/air bombs with great effectiveness. If you pump O2 from your welding tank into your AC filled with propane and overload the compressor until the overload breaker in the compressor windings gets hot enough to trip, you might be a Redneck. You should have two cameras setup, one close and one far away. After it's all over have a surviving Redneck upload the video to Y'all Tube. ^_^
TDD
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On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 18:42:02 -0500, The Daring Dufas

The explosive range for propane is relatively narrow (and low) at 2.1 to 10.1% by volume at 20C and atmospheric pressure.
Gasoline is 1.4 to 7.6 BY VOLUME - Stoich is about 14:1 BY WEIGHT.
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On 4/27/2013 10:01 PM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

That's what the fuel/air delivery systems in gasoline engines strive for. ^_^
TDD
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At that moment, Billy Bob stops by with his propane cylinder, and adds seven pounds of propane. . Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . .

If air could get in, there wouldn't be enough propane to matter.
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On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 21:18:14 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"

Any idiot who will fill a leaky system without evacuating and repairing it deserves to have his double-wide join the international space station in orbit. Propane or not.
Good start for the Darwin awards.
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On Apr 27, 12:39 pm, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

?

That's right, it's the low side, but it's still way above atmospheric pressure, so if there is a leak, it's going to leak out. When it gets down to atmospheric pressure, then air could start to get inside. But with a typical pinhole leak, I see refrigerant under pressure getting out. Air getting in is going to be a lot more difficult.
A bigger worst case scenario would be that someone or something slams into one of the lines inside near the furnace, severs it and a pilot light from the furnace, water heater, etc ignites the propane. But you kind of have that potential with dryer gas lines, stove lines, etc too.
I wonder if any codes say anthing about it?

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Can go as low as about 20 inches of mercury, maybe 25. And the situation you describe (for your opinion of the only possible way) does happen. . Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . .

system?

How low does the low side of a refrigeration unit go???? Are they not supposed to run somewhere between 40 and 85 PSI??? Not much change of getting ANY air into a system that has enough gas in it to function at all. In fact virtually impossible to get air into anything but an OPEN system (one with a severe leak or one with a slow leak that has existed for a long time - system totally non-functional)
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On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 21:12:42 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"

Not on a functioning system - most will shut down before that happens because that means a very low charge. Perhaps some home units may get that low - I don't have much to do with them - but I've never seen an automotive system get anywhere NEAR that low.

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That says it all. . Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . .
Perhaps some home units may get that low - I don't have much to do with them -
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On Sun, 28 Apr 2013 06:42:02 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"

I do know MINE won't - it shuts off to protect itself if pressure is either too high or too low.
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On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 09:55:39 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
systems are designed for totally non flammable refrigerants. if there is some air in the system, and the happy home owner adds propane, the resulting explosive mix can, well, explode.

But if there is air in the system the owner has other problems. That's why a system is "evacuated" before recharging - with ANY refrigerant.
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Please explain to me again, that the toothless home owner with the ten big dogs tied out front, using propane for his AC system. That sleeveless, truck driving wonder who calls his wife by blowing the horn on the truck "musical rendition of Dixie" will evacuate to 400 microns, using two stage vacuum pump, digital micron gage, and full flow ports with valve core remover? Is that before he farts a few bars of "anchors aweigh" or after? . Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . .
But if there is air in the system the owner has other problems. That's why a system is "evacuated" before recharging - with ANY refrigerant.
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On Sat, 27 Apr 2013 21:25:37 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"

Which is why in Canada it is technically illegal to open a refrigeration system without a licence - which requires training.
Used to have mine for automotive AC but let it lapse many tears ago.
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On Saturday, April 27, 2013 at 7:55:39 AM UTC-6, Stormin Mormon wrote:

s. AC systems are designed for totally non flammable refrigerants. if there is some air in the system, and the happy home owner adds propane, the resu lting explosive mix can, well, explode.

In my experience and observation, without resorting to "doom and gloom" and terror tactics, Many, MANY vehicles are equipped with propane AS A FUEL. I n other words, there is no more dangerous environment for propane to exist in it's compressed format (in tanks). Yet, as EVERYONE knows who knows anyt hing about chemistry, propane does not burn until and unless it is evaporat ed and mixed with sufficient oxygen and then brought to the ignition point. Even if there was a minute amount of oxygen in the sealed air conditioner/ refrigeration loop, the danger of ignition is virtually nil. I have personally recharged a number of vehicles and an old freezer using p ropane, with no ill effects to my knowledge. I even power-factor-corrected the old units to use a fraction of the electricity making replacing them a low-priority issue. It appears that the law is created by man FOR man, that is to say for indus try, for the elite who are in control of industry and commerce. The common "consumers" have no say in the matter which occurs in the capital cities of the world (contrary to what we are led to believe). What is most interesting is that I learned about Propane being used as a re frigerant by a commercial refrigeration technician charged with the heat-pu mp systems of a number of skating rinks. He told me that Ammonia was the be st refrigerant, but that Ammonia requires very special equipment AND care t o use and maintain. Whereas Propane was a good substitute which is not weig hted down with the same concerns as Ammonia. :) Eugene Labossiere
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On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 15:27:22 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

It is the slow leak into a confined space with an ignition source that is the problem. In an automotive sytewm a slow leak in the evaporator can put enough propane into the interior of the car to ignite from the spark of the dome light switch when the door is opened. Propane fuel components are NOT allowed inside the passenger area.
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On 6/5/2016 6:27 PM, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

to "doom and gloom" and terror tactics, Many, MANY vehicles are equipped with propane AS A FUEL. In other words, there is no more dangerous environment for propane to exist in it's compressed format (in tanks). Yet, as EVERYONE knows who knows anything about chemistry, propane does not burn until and unless it is evaporated and mixed with sufficient oxygen and then brought to the ignition point. Even if there was a minute amount of oxygen in the sealed air conditioner/refrigeration loop, the danger of ignition is virtually nil.

an old freezer using propane, with no ill effects to my knowledge. I even power-factor-corrected the old units to use a fraction of the electricity making replacing them a low-priority issue.

that is to say for industry, for the elite who are in control of industry and commerce. The common "consumers" have no say in the matter which occurs in the capital cities of the world (contrary to what we are led to believe).

Propane being used as a refrigerant by a commercial refrigeration technician charged with the heat-pump systems of a number of skating rinks. He told me that Ammonia was the best refrigerant, but that Ammonia requires very special equipment AND care to use and maintain. Whereas Propane was a good substitute which is not weighted down with the same concerns as Ammonia. :)

Do you vacuum out the air before charging with flammable propane?
How do you get the propane from a POL threaded tank to a 1/4 flare refrigeration service valve?
Can you guarantee that kids who get a chemistry set for Christmas (and know some thing about chemistry) "ALL" know about the flammable properties of propane? The kids are included in EVERYONE who knows some thing about chemistry.
--
.
Christopher A. Young
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On Wednesday, June 8, 2016 at 9:09:12 AM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Very easy to adapt a propane cylinder to 1/4" flare. I bought a new propane tank and use it for R22
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On 6/25/2016 8:37 AM, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

\
Don't get caught!

--
It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made to guard
the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all
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On 6/25/2016 8:37 AM, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

I wonder if the Mormon will turn you in for the reward money on the fine you will pay.
--
"...I am committed against every thing which in my judgement, may
weaken, endanger, or destroy [The constitution]...and especially against
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