My collegue has an interesting story... 8yr old Bryant NG furnace was failing to ignite... the Pro (from the company that installed it) came in and changed the ignitor which didn't help.. claimed that the heat exchanger must be cracked (?) and would cost $2000 for repair. Collegue asks me about it--I suggested he look into the warranty... he discovers that Bryant will cover much of the cost (minus $600). As soon as he calls the pro back about this, the pro suggests he'll come back and try something simpler first to help my collegue save money... Comes over and changes a burner--"sealing it well"--and charges $80. He says the company policy is to charge "Top Shelf Pricing" first then go down.
This is the kind of BS that keeps people from trusting the "pros". It's COMPANY POLICY for Christ's sake.
The "tech" lied in the first place when he said the Hx must be cracked. Then you choose to believe him when he says something is company policy? Why? Never mind, you don't need to answer. You believe him because it fits your world view.
Your colleague should call the company directly. He should talk with the right end of the horse and raise cane.
What I want to know is what would the guy had done when the HX was swapped out and it *still* didn't work?? and how much more was that company gonna try and steal from the guy. The next question is, how much in commission and spiffs does the tech get?? Sounds like the company was gonna charge the guy full freight for the new HX then collect on the warranty claim too. In my mind, thats just wrong.
Good point. And you're right--it is a stupid assumption (what he said about the policy).
My "world view" is one of caution and skepticism--questions being more important than answers. Many people share this same view--it is simply a recognition of the selfishness of human nature.
You know what's the funniest thing to me? "Independence" and doing it on your own is the classic definition of the "American Way"... but when it comes to actually trying to learn and do something on your own, there's much talk about leaving it all in the hands of others who "know". Hey, the British were doing government far longer than the first Americans--you may even say that the Brits were the "pros". Why then DIY???
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Ever hear of a second opinion?? You think there are only incompetents in the trades? Please.... What do you do for a living Dan? There isin't a prefession without a dumbass in it.
-Canadian Heat
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Every time a question comes up about something technical, the common answer is "call a pro" or get a pro to come over and check it out. Anyone who does so automatically becomes "gullible"--by asking a pro to come over, you put the power in his/her hands to make the call.
My colleque obviously was suspicious. He asked me about it before committing to the repair. As for me, I would not have called the guy in the first place... I'd post a question here, I'd do some googling, I'd read the manuals, I'd ask around--only if I could not solve it and it was getting serious (ie. need heat) would I "give up" and call someone--all this not to save money but to avoid being ripped off.
My collegue asked for a second opinion--he asked me.
Let's say that at least half of all tradesmen are not out to do their best for you (our buddy Mike Holmes claims 9 out 10). How much money would you have to spend and how many people to call in to get the right answer?
I'm sure there are many true professinoals--but it seems that there are many MORE BS guys... and that's in every skill/trade/profession... even mine.
And they're not all incompetent--in fact, I suspect that most rip offs are done by competent people who know exactly what they're doing... the dumbass tries to do it right but rips you off sort of by mistake, no?
The problem is, it comes back to a little knowledge being a dangerous thing. There are too many variables that a non-pro isn't aware of, and attempting to fix a gas-burning appliance yourself could go right for you, or it could go wrong in a hurry.
Yes there are many variables but it is up to individual to decide if he or she should attempt to try to fix it or not, we are not God to say one way or the other if he screw it up can blame no one but himself and that goes for any type of equipment. Dido say that
So how many of you when you first got in the business made mistakes? I burned the hair off the back of my hand once on an old wall heater with a delayed ignition problem. But I made sure it was working right before I left the customer.
Last time I burned the hair off my hand, it was lighting a charcoal grill. Over at a friend's house. I took a five galon blue container clearly labelled "KEROSENE" and poured some on. Reached over, flicked a lighter on it, and discovered that wasn't kerosene. Now, who the heck would do that to little old me?
Man, talk about getting flamed!
But like you say, make sure it works right before you leave.
The problem is that a homeowner would not be aware of known issues with some heat exchangers, gas valves, limit switches, etc....tell-tale warning signs to those in the know. Simply replacing a failed limit isn't going to solve the problem of a separated heat exchanger that may be spewing carbon monoxide into the structure. Re-lighting a pilot that keeps going out isn't going to fix a crack in the exchanger that causes it to blow out when the fan comes on... things like that. I know where to look for signs of over-heating on a Keeprite Mid....Joe Homeowner doesn't. Simply addressing the failure won't always solve the underlying cause. You need to be in the trade to be up on the causes of many of these things.
Most people (with senses) can easily smell the difference between kero and gasoline and would have enough brains not to light. Except of course for the bee assassin
Just when I thought SOME of your posts showed you maybe are not a complete idiot as these guys are saying, you prove them correct.
As I understand it, the Concorde was brought down by a piece of metal that came off of the Continental flight before it on the runway... something not properly installed? An inspection skipped?
Planes are usually serviced in an environment where there are multiple hands working and multiple eyes looking. There is the added responsibility of many lives at stake. A home repair is far from a controlled enviornment--it's an easy target. And in most cases the worst that can happen is some homeowner gets cold or material gets damaged etc. It's the same reason there are so many poor car repair stories--relatively harmless, easy targets.
Ever change your own brakes on a car? Wonder why they are designed so damn foolproof? The hardest part is taking the rusted crap apart. If you manage to at least fit it together and tighten the bolts, it's safe... it may seize up and wear out your pads real fast, but it will "work". Even the car manufacturers know the difference between servicing cars and servicing planes... and which are more likely to attract the shady tradesmen...
I was amazed at how simple and foolproof the design of my furnace and auxiliary parts are. Clearly the new ones are designed to be quite easy--parts only fit one way, circuit boards are clearly marked, layouts are obvious... I can imagine that new installs are hard to screw up--and likely intentionally so. The industry obviously recognizes the number of crappy techs out there and is making it easier to have their products work as advertised.
Now, as for something that's getting older, is having problems, etc., I agree that a proper pro is the best person to service it. It's a case of mostly diagnosis--like a real good auto mechanic. However, it is exactly that same reason that leads to so many rip-offs--the pros know the diagnosis, they know the customers don't, and if they're sure the customer *can't* know, we have a clear invitation to rip-off. By calling the pro, you automatically admit that you don't have a clue.
Thankfully, with people like yourself and the modern easy-access to information, it is possible for a HO to at least try--certainly to learn. The irony is that the advice given here often contradicts the intention in the first place.
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