On a properly designed, modern cabinet and properly hung/hinged doors I can get that without a center stile, and, better yet, without having to open and close cabinet doors in sequence:
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years ago, both those cabinets would have had partial inset doors with a fake center stile because it was easier/cheaper to do it that way, and took less skill.
Even worse on frameless cabinets ... ugh.
Not necessary in today's modern kitchen, as shown above.
Besides, there is little as fugly as the ubiquitous dings on the adjacent door made by the fake stile when opening/closing in the wrong sequence ... unless it is the ubiquitous off-the-shelf molding traditionally used to make the lip by those without the skill set to do a proper door. :)
My clients can't wait to get rid of the damned things ... and I haven't had any one request them in longer than I can remember.
You posted a SU drawing of assembled rails and stiles a short while back (from your DC-WallCabinet).
I assume you knock down a wall in each of the stiles (so that the groove is not obstructed by the side of the stile). I assume you do this with the TS, carefully, while you're cutting the other grooves, as your machine will already be set-up for it after you cut grooves in the respective rails.
If I understand your suggestions, I think a reasonable sequence of operations (omitting the cabinet doors) is:
Glue faceframe parts together.
Cut the sides, top, and back of the cabinet to fit the face frame.
Glue the pieces from Step 2 together and into the face face
Please correct me if anything looks amiss! Your drawing will certainly result in my making the "lip" on the bottom smaller (and more sophisticated-looking)--1/8", then I would have made it. A nice touch..
Cheers, Bill
By the way, to my surprise I found I can get a 1/4" Cherry dowel at Rockler for a few bucks. If I slice some notches (to avoid glue-squeezeout) on the bottom 5/4" of a length of a dowel, will this give me a suitable dowel for my casework joinery? I intend them for the top and bottom in addition to the dado. I'm not sure it I need dowels to secure the faceframe. I would prefer not to put dowels down the front of the work unless it is suggested to help support the (heavy?) cabinet doors. The impression I have is that glue is up to the task.
No, and AFTER assembly of the faceframe ... I almost always use my laminate router to join the grooves in the rails with the grooves in the stiles, and I almost always do it by hand, simply marking the lines with a square as extensions of the existing dadoes, and routing to that line.
You can make a jig, and, IIRC, that is what Leon does, but I find I can do it much quicker with almost the same accuracy (this operation doesn't have to be the picture of perfection unless it is visible, in which case I will use a chisel to mark the edges of the joining groove, then either chisel it out or use the router by hand ... this latter method keeps the edges nice and crisp if they are going to be visible, which they rarely are)
Not "suggestions" ... this is a concise method/methodology, just as a "method engineer" would dictate in a factory setting as a sequence of events for fabrication of any part, including the whole. :)
Cut your dadoes and grooves in the face frame stiles and rail BEFORE you assemble the face frames (with the exception of the above).
When making a "cabinet", you will find assembling the cabinet's face frame's with pocket hold joinery provides more than enough strength, and is a quick and elegant method.
Cut ALL your end panels (sides) and floors (top and bottom, usually the same dimension) at one time. Then
Cut all dadoes/grooves in your end panels, then
Lay the face frame face down on a suitably flat surface. Glue and assemble the end panels and floors to each other, and to the face frame. Clamp, nail, screw as needed.
Once the above casework is assembled (without the back), double check your measurements for the back; cut backs to size; and glue, screw, nail in place as desired.
I like having that 1/8" "lip" between the top of the bottom rail and the floor of the cabinet, and I use it all the time, in every cabinet I build, but it is optional ... some folks don't like it. I do.
Why? That "lip" forces the floor of the cabinet to be perfectly flat, which can be difficult to do without the lip ... and, no matter how well you choose your stock, plywood is not always flat, and Murphy guarantees that the only non-flat part of the cabinet will end up where it looks the worst.
That will work, but it is unnecessary. A properly sized, glued and clamped dado joint will suffice. Most of the time, where you may need some other type of mechanical fastener (screws, dowels, nails, brads), it may well be in area that will covered by trim on the outside of the cabinet ... in that case use an appropriately sized finish nail or brad.
Another trick to reinforce a dado joint in a cabinet is to toenail a brad though the horizontal piece and into the vertical piece in such a manner that is almost invisible, and being careful to not breakthrough to the other side of the vertical pieces.
Gluing the face frame to the casework will usually suffice.
That said, I am one of those folks who, after handling, viewing and observing some beautiful antique furniture from both the US and Europe, have NO problem whatsoever using a strategically placed mechanical fastener (finish nail/brad) in a visible part of a piece of furniture ... what was done by the old masters is good enough for me.
I do take great care, as they did, in orderly, even placement of any fastener, respecting the direction of the grain, and using an appropriately colored filler that will make it almost indistinguishable for other elements of the natural wood.
So be it ... in sixty years of making things out of wood I've not had a single remark in that regard
And,for your Faceframes, by all means, spring for a Kreg pocket hole kit ... you will be glad that you did.
I am using a router fence/guide now to complete the unions of the grooves on the face frames. Clean accurate cuts on this process are more necessary for me as I commonly use "back" face frames on my cabinets now. If the back of the cabinet is visible it is important that the completed grooves look good. For front face frames with out a mirror back the hand guided router is the best choice for me.
I may wish I did. How about my new plate jointer? I'll be using it, at least, for my panels in my cabinet doors. I can see, however, that gluing biscuits may not be as quick and convenient as making pocket hole joints.
By the way, I did buy the 2" blade to cut slots for the FF biscuits (encouraged by your recommendation, IIRC), but I'm not sure (yet) whether biscuits of that size have a role in this project. Noticing that the #20 biscuits are 1" wide makes me think I would better use the #10 which are 3/4" wide to make a butt-joint using 3/4" plywood. I need to revisit my book on plate-jointers.
As long as my angles come out "true" (90-degrees) everything should be okay! At least, that's the way I heard the preachin'! : )
I wanted to share the drawing I did tonight with the kind folks here who help make my progress possible, so I put it on my web site (the earlier version is there too, just for the sake of comparison).
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's always rewarding to get feedback. And, it needs feet--how many I don't know! :)
Looking quite nice. A hint here. You mention that you left the construction/measure lines visible to indicate where internal features are located. You called x-ray. There is actually an x-ray icon normally at the top that will actually show an x-ray view of your drawing. Located just left of the icons that turn your color/materials off and on. The actual x-ray view is normally better if you turn the color off and view in the grey two tone mode. If you are not aware of the icon try it out. It actually makes placement of lines and or components easier when you don't normally have a clear view of where to reference attachment.
It's totally a matter of taste, and suit yourself, but I would put the wider rails of your face frames on the bottom, not the top.
Also, you might want to consider making a similar base to this, with six adjustable feet, for the TV unit to sit on:
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base of this type would provide support for your span; make a nice visual transition from the face frame; and would easily support six adjustable feet (one in each corner, and two in the middle, front and back) that would insure that the unit sits solidly on an uneven floor without detracting from the visual aspect.
Although, this one is a bit more fancy with the curves, it gives the appearance of having four feet, and if you do it like this, you will only need four adjustable feet.
Here's the casework:
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's the casework with base attached:
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's what the base looks like from bottom side:
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's the whole enchilada trimmed out:
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drawing, showing a wider unit than yours, sitting on a base with four adjustable feet, with a whole lot more weight and longer span to contend with:
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so you can orbit around something completed, here's the same model I used to collaborate with the client, who lived a few hundred miles away, for both the design and fabrication of the dining room set I made for her:
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some more ideas to play around with.
BTW, congratulation on your modeling. You are obviously becoming quite proficient with SketchUp and it shows, AND, as we see here, it gives you the ability to benefit with a bit of collaboration and swapping of ideas.
Bill wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@news3.newsguy.com:
without the menu buttons by using File > Export > 2D Graphic.
This allows you to create an image of whatever view is on your screen at the time without cluttering up the image. You can choose 4 different formats for the image (jpg, tif, bmp, and png).
It's crucial for higher powered amplifiers and such. If you have lots of hot items enclosed, think about mounting one or more muffin fans in there, too. Suck cool air in from the bottom or push hot air out the top.
-- I started out with nothing and I still have most of it left! --anon
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