My "Beware" indicator is when the customer explanation starts with, " All you gotta do is". When I hear those words, I think to my self, "Then why don't you do it if that is all you gotta do." And sometimes those words slip out of my mouth if my response does not get through to the customer...
This is the foam technique, with a high density dam around it ?
So what's wrong with them ? Is the technique possibly sound, with a variation ?
What did you use for foam ? the article describes a base of high desnity foam with a border of the same, yet they're different colours. I was wondering if these really were meant to be the same foam ?
IMHO, I'd have gone for traditional horsehair and batting for chairs of that sophisitication. Never did like foam.
OTOH, "made my living" often means that you know how to turn a profit out of the market, rather than you are producing the best possible product (and these are all too often contradictory - it doesn't mean that you couldn't, or wouldn't rather be doing it). I'm trying to make my living on furniture and totally failing - I just don't have the grasp of either pricing, or production to a timescale and budget. There's no money in doing it "right" when your client group is too fond of Ikea !
I didn't read into Andy's response what you and Perry apparently did. I didn't find his response to be objectionable. Just a statement that to stay in business often means doing things not exactly the way you'd do them if you doing it for yourself. Actually, I was waiting for Perry to make the apology.
todd
I must admit I too was a wee-bit taken aback by Perry's response because I had not detected any ill will in Andy's post either. I think Andy meant well, but perhaps his choice of words just wasn't what Perry wanted to hear at that time. I find both Perry and Andy to be very worthwhile contributors to the group; I'd hate so see it turn nasty.
Oh go and learn to read FFS !
If I wanted to insult you. you'd have noticed. If I've offended you unintentionally, then I apologise unreservedly because that certainly wasn't my intention.
This is just a generalised gripe. HTF do I do good work (which as we all know, takes an absolute age) when the market won't pay more than the equivalent rate for China. I just can't compete with that, even if I live on just rice and noodles (because I have to import them !)
Now if you've managed to survive in this market for 15 years, then you're doing better than I am. As it happens, I live next door to an upholsterer who has been doing it since the '50s. I don't like his work at all (it's certainly not how I'd do it) because he does everything with a slab of foam and spray glue. OTOH, you're damned lucky these days to have a client base that can appreciate the difference, let alone be willing to pay for it.
So what _are_ the exact materials ? They don't specify whether they used chemically blown or mechanically blown foam for the high density stuff, and that makes a difference.
And you still haven't said what was wrong with these chairs. Too hard, too soft, too noisy, took a permanent set ? What ?
Can I venture into No-Man's Land to ask for a source (or explanantion) on the best, or better, way to upholster the seat?
Ed
snip
Geez.....You have NO CLUE about the PRACTICAL applications of foam density in real life. I am talking about *density*, not height. The "bump" is the percieved difference in the densities of the two foams, as one would rub their hand over the surface. A 1/2" of urethane foam is not as tall as
On Mon, 14 Jul 2003 15:00:55 GMT, Steve Turner pixelated:
Ditto to all. I'm glad they kissed and made up. ;)
-- "Not always right, but never uncertain." --Heinlein -=-=-
On Mon, 14 Jul 2003 20:30:46 +0100, Andy Dingley pixelated:
I missed that the first 2 read-throughs. The center is 5/8" while the outer is 1/2". But that raspable outer rim has to have a yucky, stiff, cardboardy feeling to it.
-- "Not always right, but never uncertain." --Heinlein -=-=-
Andy Dingley spaketh...
bentcajungirl spaketh...
Perry, not all of us have access to the article and you did start this thread... in a woodworking group not an upholstry group, so we may not all follow you as well as you like. I for one am confused. You say the technique in the article doesn't work (you feel a bump), but you haven't explained why. Without access to the article and what was specified, I don't know what material was specified. (fyi: I think we all understand the difference between density and thickness).
Clear.
I don't understand what you're saying... you don't know what? How can a color difference be 'mechanical'?
Clear. Two different densities, compressing differently.
You think the seat is too thin, especially with cutouts. Clear.
What is not a height descrepancy? I don't get this part.
You're suggesting that you should have beefed up the seat and added webbing across the cutout? Why would 'you' do that, send it back to the customer, they built the chair... right?
I was tracking up until the 'lifelike' part. What living thing is the foam supposed to feel like? (yeah, I'm just being an ass on this one)
I agree with you Perry and it isn't just upholstery, it's every job that requires effort, experience and talent to do correctly.
Perry,
A can really appreciate your line of work. Let me explain...
About 2 years ago, my wife and I looked into getting two wing chairs reupholstered. The estimates ranged from a low of $250 per chair to a high of $600 per chair. These were two chairs that are over 10 years old and brand new probably wouldn't cost over $200 each, so it seemed kind of excessive to me. So there they sat in our living room with blankets covering the holes in the fabric on the arm rests (Damn cats!).
A few months later I saw that our local adult night school was offering a 6 week upholtery course for $70. Being handy, I figured why not give it a shot.
I was able to do both chairs for about $200 (actually I have not finished the second, but I already purchased the materials). I found that upholstry is not rocket science and if you learn the tricks of the trade you can do a pretty decent job yourself. That said, I now understand why it costs so much and can't imagine why the estimates we got were so LOW! It's labor, labor, labor. My instructor also explained why I can buy a chair for less than I can have it reupholstered for. Reupholstery requires each piece to be custom cut where the factories can turn out hundreds, assembly line fashion.
As a testament to how hard it is to make a living doing this, my instructor supplemented his income... teaching upholstry classes at night school. I think if your customers could see what is involved in your work, they would not question the price you charge.
-Chris
Even small chair factories turn out hundreds. My stepson works in such a place, as a finish upholsterer. He is fast, very, very good, and has no desire to open his own shop--at least that I know of. He makes more where he is, and while he works his butt off, he probably doesn't work as hard as he would have to doing custom upholstery.
Charlie Self
Facts are stupid things. Ronald Reagan
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