Planer question

[Ralph Compton]

Got a Ridgid 13" planer last year, haven't used it much but, dang, it sure is noisy. Today I was planing some 1x10x30 pine boards, trying to get them kinda flat so as to make some simple trivets for campouts. Planed the boards with the cup side facing down. Taking off a very little.

But, watching the dust going into the DC, I'm really not cutting much and by lowering the cutting head more it seems like all I'm doing is making more noise, hardly any more sawdust. So much noise I don't want to do this outdoors for the possiblility of annoying all my closest neighbors.

I've watched some utube videos, and it looks like I'm doing everything right, but I feel I'm doing something wrong. Surely my blades aren't this hopelessly dull by now?

I did clean my blades to remove some built-up residue from previous planing.

I'm contenplating taking my planer down to the Ridgid shop for a look-over, after all, it's free, but I don't want to look entirely stupid.

It seems to me that the blades might be bouncing the board because of the cupping. The worst board, cupping-wise, has about 1/8 inch in the middle of the 10" width.

Ralph

[Doug Miller]

"Ralph Compton" wrote in news:f6ednV6c7IqeZcbSnZ2dnUVZ [e-mail]:

Is there any possibility at all, that the blades are installed backwards?

Ahh. Yes, there is. Double-check to make sure you reinstalled them facing in the right direction.

Then check the orientation of the blades first. ALL of them.

Not likely on pine. I think you'll discover at least one blade installed backwards.

[dpb]

On 3/10/2012 6:55 PM, Ralph Compton wrote: ...

The planer won't do any good on cupping anyway; the feed roller will simply press the board flat, run it under the cutterhead and out it will come recupped when the pressure is removed.

If you're trying to remove cupping, you need to surface a single face first before the planer. Jointer or handplane is the way to accomplish that.

As for the noise and apparent lack of sizable cuttings, make sure the knives are indeed installed correctly (both orientation and depth)

[John Grossbohlin]

A few thoughts...

Can you see if the "cut area" is wider with each pass? If so the additional noise is most likely due to the wider cut as more wood is being removed...

Another possibility is that because you didn't face joint the board first the feed rollers may be straining to flatten the board out as it's passing through.

Did you clean the blades before or after this problem came up?

It would sure be easier to diagnosis in person!

[-MIKE-]

I remove cupping all the time with my planer. I don't think it's possible for mine to do what you describe. It would have to be set too low and I wouldn't be able to get the boards started.

[CW]

I remove cupping all the time with my planer. I don't think it's possible for mine to do what you describe. It would have to be set too low and I wouldn't be able to get the boards started. =================================================================== Yep.

[Ralph Compton]

In answer to come questions and comments:

I have never taken the blades off the machine. They are as they came from the factory. Bought this machine new from HD in Dec, 2010. Hasn't had much use. Did several pieces of dog-eared cedar last fall, new wood, 1x6's, planed them down smooth. I've probably had a couple of hours (maybe 3) use on the machine since new. Feeding it single-handed is slower than with an extra person so that time represents about half the time cutting, half waiting for a new board.

I took a piece of rough sawn lumber, probably pine, dunno, about 1x12x24 and ran it through. Didn't look to me like very much came off. Gave that up for now.

I did inspect all the blades but didn't remove or adjust. Didn't touch the mounting bolts at all. I cleaned some residue off the cutting edges, didn't make much difference. I'll mess with it a little more before taking it down to the shop. BTW, the Factory Repair Shop is about 2 miles from my house so it's not much of a burden. Just a nuisance.

Since this is my first planer, I didn't really know what to expect re life span of blades, etc. But it does seem to me that doing clean soft woods should allow me rather more life out of the blades than this. Thanks for the suggestions. I look more into it on Monday.

Ralph

[Puckdropper]

"Ralph Compton" wrote in news:Cq6dnWnc9rb_3MHSnZ2dnUVZ [e-mail]:

*snip*

Take a pencil or even a piece of chalk and scribble across the face of the board. Plane and then look at the results. That will tell you exactly where material was removed.

*snip*

Puckdropper

[dpb]

That must be an interesting planer design that somehow manages to exert a forward thrust on the material sufficient to push it through the planer and take a cut while not bearing down on the material the same time.

Or, it's some other kind of wood than that which I can procure locally that has an infinite moment of stiffness so it isn't affected by that (nonexistant, of course) downward pressure.

How much, specifically depends on the thickness of the material and what it is; nominal 1" white pine just ain't that strong; you can flex it easily by hand. Run a piece of 3" roughsawn oak thru and yeah, the deflection will be minimal.

--

[-MIKE-]

There's barely any downward pressure and I assume that's the case with most modern planers. I have a Delta 22-560 and the rollers are about

1/16" proud of the blades. It has a maximum cutting depth 3/32" The cast metal casing of the planer sits very close to the the level of the rollers. If I try to feed a board that is bowed enough that it would be pushed down by the rollers enough to "spring back," the casing would block the board from even entering the cutting area.

Here's another thing I've observed with most planers. There is very little room in the cutting depth adjustment between "the rollers grabbing and pulling the wood" and "the rollers slipping and not grabbing the wood at all." This tells me that the rubber on the rollers is doing the work of pulling, via simple friction, and not some extraordinary amount of downward pressure.

[Ralph Compton]

I'll try that tomorrow too. Thanks

Ralph

[CW]

There's barely any downward pressure and I assume that's the case with most modern planers. I have a Delta 22-560 and the rollers are about

1/16" proud of the blades. It has a maximum cutting depth 3/32" The cast metal casing of the planer sits very close to the the level of the rollers. If I try to feed a board that is bowed enough that it would be pushed down by the rollers enough to "spring back," the casing would block the board from even entering the cutting area.

Here's another thing I've observed with most planers. There is very little room in the cutting depth adjustment between "the rollers grabbing and pulling the wood" and "the rollers slipping and not grabbing the wood at all." This tells me that the rubber on the rollers is doing the work of pulling, via simple friction, and not some extraordinary amount of downward pressure. ==========================================================================================

Wait a while. There will be several people on here explaining to you that that is impossible. It's all in your mind. The boards that you have straitened over the years didn't really exist. It was all a dream. BTW, I have had the same dream, using the same planer, numerous times.

[dpb]

On 3/11/2012 3:51 PM, -MIKE- wrote: ...

Interestingly, from the owners manual for the above machine I find...

The manufacturer recommends the same sequence of operations.

[-MIKE-]

==========================================================================================

That was so helpful.

[-MIKE-]

That is pretty much the SMO for flattening boards with a twist, crook, kink or bow. because in all these cases the planer will simply follow the warp of the board. However, cupping can be brought straight to the planer because, by definition, the board is straight on the other two axes.

Keep in mind as well that a board may warp as you remove thickness from it. Things like grain pattern and internal stresses can cause this.

[Doug Miller]

-MIKE- wrote in news:jjl44o$ckh$ [e-mail]:

[...]

If cupping is the only flaw, and the board is otherwise straight with no twist or bow, then I'd agree with you -- but IME cupping is usually accompanied by some degree of twist or bow as well.

[-MIKE-]

or bow, then I'd

twist or bow as

I don't want to get off on a tangent. I was dealing with the specific facts presented. It was purported that the planer "won't do any good on cupping" which isn't true.

I was providing information to contradict the specific claim, "the feed roller will simply press the [cupped] board flat, run it under the cutterhead and out it will come recupped when the pressure is removed."

[Puckdropper]

-MIKE- wrote in news:jjl6ph$kb3$ [e-mail]:

My planer manual suggested the use of a shim (and maybe a sled... it's been a few seasons) to keep the board from deforming too badly under the wheels.

It depends on the board, I had one a couple months ago that would flatten out quite easily, so it would plane smooth but not flat. Most of the others, however, will retain their shape provided I take extremely light passes.

Puckdropper

[dpb]

On 3/12/2012 11:13 AM, Puckdropper wrote: ...

The principle is, in general, true (as I noted).

Regardless of what mikey says, there _IS_ downward force on the feed roller (and to a lesser extent both the cutterhead and the outfeed roller as well).

There will be _zero_ frictional feed force w/o it, regardless of how sticky the feed roller cover is.

F_friction = F_normal * Coeff_Friction

is a physical principle.

(Chap 6)

[dpb]

On 3/11/2012 3:51 PM, -MIKE- wrote: ...

I kept the smaller when returned to farm...sometimes I've regretted not having the Powermatic Model 225 but don't have 3-phase so it would have required either swapping the motor no mean feat to find a single phase or a phase converter so get by w/ the Rockwell/Delta Model 13.

That these little lunchbox guys don't have much guts isn't too surprising; I've never tried using one...

Here's a couple links to nice pic's at the OWWM site...

The one guy says his came from an estate sale; the one I have came from a furniture factory in PA that upgraded. They had 27 of these set up in

9 rows of three--ran them all day, every day preparing the stock to a fixed set thickness--each machine was set at one precise thickness setting and fed by one and unloaded and passed to the next in the line by another.

Here's the (lamented, gone) PM...

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